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Welding question: Argon for MIG?, Yes, I'm asking a welding question

Series9	May 28 2005, 07:50 PM Post #1
Lesbians taste like chicken. Group: Members Posts: 5,444 Joined: 22-August 04 From: DeLand, FL Member No.: 2,602 Region Association: South East States	I just got a MIG welder to keep my TIG company in the garage. Can I use 100% argon with the MIG? I've been through a few welding books and can't find a good answer. Most of the opinions suggest that CO2 mix is used to save money over pure argon, but don't really say wheather or not 100% argon is appropriate for MIG welding. If I can have one bottle, it would be easier.

Replies(1 - 16)

Trekkor	May 28 2005, 07:55 PM Post #2
I do things... Group: Members Posts: 7,809 Joined: 2-December 03 From: Napa, Ca Member No.: 1,413 Region Association: Northern California	I use straight CO2 with my MIG. Lasts four times as long as bi-mix and costs half the price. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif) Straight Argon would be rather pricy, don't you think? KT

Jeroen	May 28 2005, 07:55 PM Post #3
914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 7,887 Joined: 24-December 02 From: The Netherlands Member No.: 3 Region Association: Europe	I think MIG gas is 80% Argon and 20% CO2 It comes pre-mixed, so no need for seperate bottles Dunno if 100% Argon wurks...

LvSteveH	May 28 2005, 08:00 PM Post #4
I put the Poor in Porsche Group: Members Posts: 1,080 Joined: 22-April 03 From: Las Vegas, Nevada Member No.: 600	We've been using 84% Argon/ 16% CO2, so you are getting closer to an answer (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif) While I have no way to support it, I'd think it would be fine to use 100% Argon, but it wouldn't burn as hot, so if you are using a small mig it could be a factor on what you could weld.

Series9

May 28 2005, 08:18 PM

Post #5

Lesbians taste like chicken.

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QUOTE (trekkor @ May 28 2005, 06:55 PM)

I use straight CO2 with my MIG.
Lasts four times as long as bi-mix and costs half the price. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif)

Straight Argon would be rather pricy, don't you think?

KT

I'm getting 150cf bottles filled for $42, so the cost of argon is not a big issue.

Buying another bottle for the MIG to hold premix would be around $200, so I'm just working on making a decision.

xsboost90	May 28 2005, 08:20 PM Post #6
Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,393 Joined: 2-August 04 From: cincinnati Member No.: 2,432	most will use 75%/ 25% argon with most metals. I believe 100% is usually used for aluminum or some other types of metals. If your welding anything on your car get the mix.

Series9

May 28 2005, 08:20 PM

Post #7

Lesbians taste like chicken.

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QUOTE (LvSteveH @ May 28 2005, 07:00 PM)

We've been using 84% Argon/ 16% CO2, so you are getting closer to an answer (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif) While I have no way to support it, I'd think it would be fine to use 100% Argon, but it wouldn't burn as hot, so if you are using a small mig it could be a factor on what you could weld.

Yes, if you're only using 16% CO2, I would think pure argon would be fine.

I got a Miller 175 220V, so I don't think power will be a problem.

JoeSharp	May 28 2005, 08:43 PM Post #8
In Irvine, Ca. May 15-18 Group: Members Posts: 3,947 Joined: 9-July 03 From: DeLand, Florida Member No.: 898 Region Association: South East States	Joe: Listen to it spit, if it is working leave it alone. The zap on a wire feed gets you the penatration, er, ah, maybe I can't spell that on this board. See you in too weeks. :PREMAGRIN: Joe

LvSteveH	May 28 2005, 08:56 PM Post #9
I put the Poor in Porsche Group: Members Posts: 1,080 Joined: 22-April 03 From: Las Vegas, Nevada Member No.: 600	Drum Roll Please...... it can be done, but arc stability and penetration will suffer. I'd test it and see if you like it. Looking at the quality of your work, I'd go with whatever gets you the results you'll be happier with in the long run.

Series9

May 28 2005, 08:58 PM

Post #10

Lesbians taste like chicken.

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QUOTE (LvSteveH @ May 28 2005, 07:56 PM)

Drum Roll Please...... it can be done, but arc stability and penetration will suffer. I'd test it and see if you like it. Looking at the quality of your work, I'd go with whatever gets you the results you'll be happier with in the long run.

If that's the case, I'll be getting another bottle.

David_S	May 28 2005, 09:58 PM Post #11
Member Group: Members Posts: 430 Joined: 11-May 03 From: Dimmitt, Tx Member No.: 680 Region Association: Southwest Region	When I got my MIG, the welding shop told me that Argon will work, but the CO2 mix will not spatter as bad, will not warp the metal as bad, and the penetration will be better than with Argon when welding steel. I have never tried MIG with Argon, but I did find out several years ago that you can't TIG with CO2 mix !!!

rick 918-S	May 28 2005, 10:00 PM Post #12
Hey nice rack! -Celette Group: Members Posts: 20,494 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Now in Superior WI Member No.: 43 Region Association: Northstar Region	The fuction of the gas is a sheild. The more expensive Argon provides a "purer" (is that a word? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wacko.gif) ) environment for the molten metal. Because the gas is heavier that the Oxygen it is displacing, the weld is allowed to flow and reach max purity as it cools. Mild steel is alot less fussy about what is used as a sheild than say Aluminum. Hence the use of less expensive mixtures of sheilding gas. The added Argon is done to enhance purity. It's only needed in small doses because like I said, Mild steel is less fussy about it's conditions. (water, rust, oil, etc.) Try adding any impurities to Aluminum while your welding and you'll see what I mean. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) The short answer IMHO Argon will work just fine. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) Although the Co2 may lay over the weld longer the straight Argon, This will permote a cooler weld. BTW: I checked the bottom of the box tonight. It's better but still damp. We haven't had more than 3 hours of sun here per day for 3 weeks. Tell Liz to hang on, I haven't forgotten her. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wavey.gif)

bondo

May 29 2005, 10:09 AM

Post #13

Practicing my perpendicular parking

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QUOTE (LvSteveH @ May 28 2005, 07:56 PM)

Drum Roll Please...... it can be done, but arc stability and penetration will suffer. I'd test it and see if you like it. Looking at the quality of your work, I'd go with whatever gets you the results you'll be happier with in the long run.

This is what I've heard, never tried it though. I do know that you need 100% argon for mig welding aluminum, and a spool gun is HIGHLY recommended. (for aluminum)

TravisNeff	May 30 2005, 06:03 PM Post #14
914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,082 Joined: 20-March 03 From: Mesa, AZ Member No.: 447 Region Association: Southwest Region	100% argon for alu and SS. I think that the uses are for mix are for keeping the weld clean as well as penetration help. I would give it a try and see how it does, can't hurt right?.

Rusty	May 30 2005, 06:10 PM Post #15
Wanted: Engine case GA003709 Group: Admin Posts: 7,942 Joined: 24-December 02 From: North Alabama Member No.: 6 Region Association: Galt's Gulch	I really like Stargon... it's a blend of Argon, CO2 and Nitrogen. I used several bottles in Des Moines and it really cut down on spatter, etc. I haven't been able to find it here in Kansas. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) -Rusty (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smoke.gif)

cha914	May 30 2005, 08:04 PM Post #16
MUSR 8 - 5lug conversion done wed - drive 500miles thrus Group: Members Posts: 739 Joined: 31-December 02 From: Austin, TX Member No.: 63	I have your same welder and run straight argon all the time...welds just fine...I have a TIG also, and it was easier to get the straight gas, plus straight argon is actually cheaper than the mix (at least where I shop), and not that much more than the co2. I havn't been able to notice a difference in the different gasses with a mig, but I also don't weld for a living... Tony (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif)

ChrisFoley

May 30 2005, 08:40 PM

Post #17

I am Tangerine Racing

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QUOTE (rick 918-S @ May 29 2005, 12:00 AM)

The fuction of the gas is a sheild.

That's only one function of the gas.
The gas also carries the arc so the choice of gas influences how much energy is transferred from the gun to the work surface and affects the arc stability.

QUOTE

I really like Stargon... it's a blend of Argon, CO2 and Nitrogen

Actually I think you will find that all MIg tri-mixes are a blend of Argon/CO2/ Oxygen. The trace of oxygen helps with cleaning, since it oxidizes certain impurities.

BTW, the choice of wire also has a big effect on certain weld properties such as fluidity, and how much rust and other impurities can be tolerated without getting porosity.

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