1st Gear Grind---help!, Secret to getting in to first gear without grinding gears Options

[2pointOH]

Clubbers--

Is it possible that I'm losing lubrication or just my mind?? It seems there are times when getting into 1st gear is simple but lately I can't seem to get back to 1st gear without grinding me and all other stopped traffic to a screeching halt.

I do have a slow drip from under the car--seems I have a slight cack in the bottom transaxel (magnesium) housing which I was told was not repairable?? Could this be the culprit?

I can get into 1st easier once in a while when I push up toward reverse then into first. Sometimes revving up then putting her into 1st helps. Should I be more aggressive or will I slowly chip away at my gearbox???

Any thoughts or tips here?? Any thoughts on costs/sources for parts to repair the lower housing??

Thanks--John

[gopack]

I'm thinking time for a clutch job! that is the symptom I had when I needed a new clutch.

[914Sixer]

Have you checked or replaced all your shifting bushings? The plastic bushing behind throwout bearing arm is very critical as is the bushings for the throwout bearing itself. Its the little things that can lead to a clutch job !

[olav]

Clubbers--

Is it possible that I'm losing lubrication or just my mind?? It seems there are times when getting into 1st gear is simple but lately I can't seem to get back to 1st gear without grinding me and all other stopped traffic to a screeching halt.

I do have a slow drip from under the car--seems I have a slight cack in the bottom transaxel (magnesium) housing which I was told was not repairable?? Could this be the culprit?

I can get into 1st easier once in a while when I push up toward reverse then into first. Sometimes revving up then putting her into 1st helps. Should I be more aggressive or will I slowly chip away at my gearbox???

Any thoughts or tips here?? Any thoughts on costs/sources for parts to repair the lower housing??

Thanks--John

Typically going from second to first or reverse to first helps for a smooth shift, also nice and slow is a good idea.

Could be that your clutch cable needs adjustment because they are known to "stretch" a little.

Try that out and it could be fine.

[gopack]

I think that the bushings would make the pattern sloppy, but only the clutch not working properly would cause the grinding. Especially since reving helps get it in to gear. Also be sure to check your cluch cable adjustment before you do anyting drastic. (this is one of the few things I can say "BTDT" on!) good luck!

[Bleyseng]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Adjust the clutch so its a bit tighter and shift slowly when going into 1st at a stop.

[pfierb]

Patience seems to be the secret if you don't want to get a grinding sound, going into 1st gear.....let them blow their horns!!!!! works for me (most of the time)

[2pointOH]

Thanks for your input!!

I'll check into the bushings/clutch cable/clutch. The clutch cable was recently replaced when I had the brakes rebuilt a couple of months ago. I don't have a shop or lift at home...can I check/fix anything from under the car before heading to a shop??

What would this cost with a mechanic (low end = adjustment to high end = full clutch job??)

John

[Bleyseng]

Cost?

Jack up the passengers side onto a jackstand and use two 11mm spaners to adjust (tighten) up the clutch cable some. I'd say maybe about a 1/8th looking at it from here......

There should be some freeplay so the throwout bearing isn't riding on the flywheel but alot of 914's I test out have lousy clutch adjustments. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[lapuwali]

If, when stopped, it will sometimes grind going into 1st from neutral, the problem is most likely that you just had it out of gear, clutch out, then pushed in the clutch, and tried to engage 1st. True?

If so, then the problem is actually the 1st gear synchro, not the clutch or the bushings or anything else. What's going on is that you have the clutch out, with the lever in neutral. This allows the engine to spin the input shaft, but not the output shaft. Pushing the clutch in disconnects the engine from the input shaft, but the shaft doesn't come to a halt instantly. When you try to engage gear, the 1st gear on the stopped output shaft tries to stop the still spinning input shaft. This is what the synchros do. They're effectively brakes. If the synchro is worn, the brake won't be very effective, and you'll be able to move the gear into mesh faster than the brake can slow the input shaft, and you get grinding.

The trick is to push in the clutch and wait a bit before trying to engage 1st from neutral. Engaging 3rd (which usually has a synchro in better shape, simply because it's used less and the speed differential when it is used is less than 1st) before 1st will help, as the 3rd gear synchro will be able to stop (or at least slow) the input shaft. No grinding.

If the clutch is misadjusted so it doesn't quite disengage, then it will make the problem worse, as the input shaft will never quite stop spinning, and you're forcing the synchro to make the clutch slip and stall the input shaft. This, obviously, is hard for a worn synchro to do, and wears out the synchro even faster. However, even with a perfectly adjusted clutch, you can get this problem.

[mstein95]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)
That is a excellent explanation James. I have the synco/grinding issue and that is exactly what I do - put the tran in 3rd gear first and THEN first gear. No grinding.

[JPB]

Thanks for the tip since I am new to these bugies and had the same problem. Makes perfact sence to me.


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smoke.gif) I see the light through the smoke.

[Bleyseng]

Its easy to pull the rear cover and install a new 1st gear synchro, do that before you toast the dogteeth

[Sk8erBri]

that is hot! good info i was having the same problem. i always have to just move real slow and it goes into first no problem.

[914-8]

first gear synchro is worn.

the proper fix is to fix the synchro.

but you can get around it by pressing the clutch down, move the gear shift lever into second gear, then into first.

[montoya 73 2.0]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/hijacked.gif) Sorry for this but I have the grinding problem when going into second. What the hell can I do to fix this? It's a pain in the ass!

[olav]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/hijacked.gif) Sorry for this but I have the grinding problem when going into second. What the hell can I do to fix this? It's a pain in the ass!

to paraphrase:

second gear synchro is worn.

the proper fix is to fix the synchro.

but you can get around it by pressing the clutch down, move the gear shift lever into second gear slowly.

[Toast]

Mine does the same thing. I have been doing the following techniques for years:
Make sure you have slowed enough that you are at a slow roll before trying to put it into first.
When stoped, go into 2nd or 3rd then into first. That eliminates the grinding most of the time because the syncros have aligned more.
Same thing applies for reverse (if you have that problem also), but reverse seems to have a little more attitude. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

Slamming it or being agressive only wheres the syncros faster and then you wont be able to get it into gear at all!!!! And we all know how $ and what a pita replacing those are. <<

[lapuwali]

Reverse doesn't have any synchro at all, and you should ONLY put the car into reverse when at a complete stop. First gear also only has a synchro that works in one direction (one set of brake bands), as you only downshift into first, you never upshift. However, this won't work if you try to put the car into first while it's rolling backwards.

Using another gear's synchro to get things stopped is a good way to prolong the time to a gearbox rebuild, perhaps even for years. If you're careful, you can live without functioning synchros for a very long time. Cars didn't use to have synchros on one or two forward gears. However, if you're going to try to drive you car like a modern Honda, then you really need to get the synchros replaced and the dog-teeth cleaned up or replaced, as well.

Grinding wears the dog teeth, and that can cause the situation where you can't engage gear (or, worse, you can "engage" the gear, but nothing happens, as all of the dog teeth have broken off). The synchros are only there to help with sloppy shift technique. With care (a great deal of care), it's possible to shift up and down with no synchros. You have to do all of the speed matching manually, and downshifting in particular becomes tricky, but very possible.

[Toast]

I have also noticed that reving the idle slightly in neutral also makes it easier to downshift.