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> Engine running poorly, Update, all probs. solved
geniusanthony
post Jun 14 2009, 06:56 PM
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I was on a drive two days ago and after 10 min on the freeway the engine note changes and it takes more pedal to maintain speed. I found an exit and visually checked that my timing hadn't slipped ( it hadn't). My number 1 plug was oily and black, all others were fine. I have since changed plugs and the engine will not accelerate as cleanly as it had before. I have yet to check the plugs again since a test ride. Before this problem it had been running great for a long time.

The engine is a 2.0L, 9350 cam, 40IDF, 009 dizzy.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 14 2009, 07:35 PM
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Any ideas of where I should look, I rechecked the plugs and they are normal.
Thanks
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degreeoff
post Jun 14 2009, 08:38 PM
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idle jets would be my guess pull em out and look for crap in there.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 14 2009, 11:27 PM
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thanks guys, will check tomorrow.
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ericread
post Jun 15 2009, 08:22 AM
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QUOTE(geniusanthony @ Jun 14 2009, 06:35 PM) *

"My number 1 plug was oily and black, all others were fine"
"I rechecked the plugs and they are normal"



I'm not sure I understand your two comments...

However, you seemingly have an issue with cylinder #1.

As a short cut, start your engine then remove the #1 spark plug wire (careful you don't electrocute yourself). If you don't get any change in engine noise, you have confirmed the #1 cylinder as the root of the problem.

It is electrical, fuel or mechanical based. I would first check to ensure you are getting a spark to the #1 plug (easiest check). Since you've got carbs, and you're getting fuel to the other three cylinders, I would not suspect fuel delivery, however, you could have an issue with the cylinder #1 intake valve, so I would check all of your valve clearances. The third thing I'd try is a compression test for all four cylinders.

Good luck!

Eric Read
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Jake Raby
post Jun 15 2009, 08:34 AM
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If #1 was oil you may have a ring issue on that cylinder.. Whats the history of the engine?

I see it uses my camshaft, did you use all my other valve train components as well?

As Eric mentions, do a compression test and leak down test sooner rather than later to save yourself headaches on diagnosis on what could be a mechanical problem internally.
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Spoke
post Jun 15 2009, 09:01 AM
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Are you running points or electronic ignition? I've upgraded my 914's to Pertronix mainly to get away from doing the dwell and burnt points.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 16 2009, 08:32 AM
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RE: cylinder #1 I found a leak in the primary before the collector on a Patrick Motors header. The crack has been dressed and welded up.

The engine was built by me two years ago and aside from the negatives of a 009 dist. has run flawlessly. Yalvetrain is mostly stock.
I have removed the jets 125===200==F7 and 55 idles all were clear of debris.
Still using points, bosch blue, points had a tit and i filed smooth. The cap showed some oxidation and I replaced. Timing is -34 deg at 3500.

As it stands now the plugs are clean but the lack of power is still present.

I will look at the valves this evening per Erics rec'd
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geniusanthony
post Jun 22 2009, 07:06 AM
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I finally have had some time this weekend to get the car up and investigate further. The rocker shaft on #1 cylinder had lost its nuts and the rocker shaft was left lying inside the head. That's the good news, bad news is the washers are present though the nuts are completely missing.

Is there anywhere they could have gone in the rocker box? I have ran a magnet tool down the pushrod tubes and found no debris.
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Katmanken
post Jun 22 2009, 10:05 AM
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There's only three ways out of the rocker area in a 2.0 head....

Through the opening created by removing the valve cover..

Down a pushrod tube...

Out one of those vacuum ports....

I'd pull the rocker shafts and the pushrods and go diving down the pushrod tubes with a magnet on a stick. Go all the way to the lifters, there isn't any other place to go that way. Or, pull the pushrod tubes too and go magnet diving in the lifter bores to make sure they aren't near the lifters...

No joy? Check the vaccuum system venting from the top of the heads til you find them.

Still no joy? Better dissasemble the motor until you find them or you will hear it go BOOM when one of them gets where you don't want it.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 22 2009, 11:30 AM
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Thought so, I do not have vented covers, the valve covers have been on since.. I notice that the inner most pushrod (cyl #1) will stick out more than the outside rod.. 1 is at TDC with flywheel timing mark up and piston at TDC.. i may be 360 out though perhaps...
Thanks thus far.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 22 2009, 04:12 PM
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Seems me an chef had similar issues simultaneously, Luckily we appear to have both found the bits simultaneously. Mine were in the #2 pushrod tube.
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nycchef
post Jun 22 2009, 04:17 PM
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QUOTE(geniusanthony @ Jun 22 2009, 02:12 PM) *

Seems me an chef had similar issues simultaneously, Luckily we appear to have both found the bits simultaneously. Mine were in the #2 pushrod tube.

i think i still have a problem i don't see a washer.
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Jake Raby
post Jun 22 2009, 06:58 PM
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Q:Why did the fasteners come loose???

A: Because they were not properly torqued...

They never loosen otherwise. Thats two instances today where valve train components came loose and could have wiped out engines..

You guys wouldn't get very far working on aircraft.
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76-914
post Jun 22 2009, 07:31 PM
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QUOTE(Jake Raby @ Jun 22 2009, 05:58 PM) *

Q:Why did the fasteners come loose???

A: Because they were not properly torqued...

They never loosen otherwise. Thats two instances today where valve train components came loose and could have wiped out engines..

You guys wouldn't get very far working on aircraft.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) especially those case halfs!several complete torque sequences before completion.
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geniusanthony
post Jun 24 2009, 10:40 PM
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After recovering the missing hardware and putting on new, I looked at the old nuts and saw that they were worn/damaged to have likely caused the failure. 38 year old hardware does have the propensity to not function as would be expected.

In the end, through a journey of checking and rechecking related systems, cleaning and balancing carbs and linkages, rebrazing/repairing a throttle pedal, new cable while there and cleaned and serviced ignition, re-setting all valves.... somewhere along the line it is all right and I really think this is the best she's run.
Thnks for the advice guys.
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EdwardBlume
post Jun 24 2009, 11:16 PM
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I love happy endings... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

Nice Work! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer.gif)
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Cap'n Krusty
post Jun 24 2009, 11:33 PM
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QUOTE(kwales @ Jun 22 2009, 09:05 AM) *

There's only three ways out of the rocker area in a 2.0 head....

Through the opening created by removing the valve cover..

Down a pushrod tube...

Out one of those vacuum ports....

I'd pull the rocker shafts and the pushrods and go diving down the pushrod tubes with a magnet on a stick. Go all the way to the lifters, there isn't any other place to go that way. Or, pull the pushrod tubes too and go magnet diving in the lifter bores to make sure they aren't near the lifters...

No joy? Check the vaccuum system venting from the top of the heads til you find them.

Still no joy? Better dissasemble the motor until you find them or you will hear it go BOOM when one of them gets where you don't want it.


The cylinder head vents are NOT part of "the vacuum system" They're vents, and are NOT under any sort of vacuum. They can safely be vented to atmosphere without affecting the way the engine runs. the Cap'n
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