Another Bad Ignition Switch?, Starting woes... Options

[orthobiz]

I have a 2 year old ignition switch. When I first got my car, it had a bad ignition switch which I replaced when I first got the car. I haven't had problems again until this year.

I have a 1974 1.8 liter 914. Occasionally, when I turn the key, the brake lights, etc. go on in the first position, but in the START position, nothing happens. If I turn the key on and off a couple of times it will start the car. It's an intermittent problem. One time I turned it and the starter turned over but the engine wouldn't kick.

It has happened when the car was hot (80 degrees here yesterday and had been running a bit) and when the car is cold.

Is this an ignition switch or could it be a bad starter or solenoid or what?

Thanks,

Paul

[orthobiz]

It's getting worse. This AM, went out to the car and it's not turning over at least one-third of the time.

I don't remember every having ignition switch problems with my other three 914's back in the day. Is this a notorious weak component?

Paul

[CliffBraun]

First thing I'd check is if you've got a loose wire to the starter, it goes from the relay board connector to the starter (mine likes to fall off).
It could be the switch, I've been told they go bad, but I've never had any actual experience with such things.

From your post I think you're getting ignition power and stuff when the key is turned to the on but not cranking position? is that correct? If you've got problems at "on" and "start" it's more likely the switch. I've had the red power wire to the column fall out, which caused interesting problems, but I think the starter would still crank.

[inschool]

Ignition switch on this car is a weak point, the plastic casing has cracked twice on me since I've owned the car, inhibiting starting only. Your problem sounds very much like mine.

[Cap'n Krusty]

Check the connections at the logic relay under the right seat. Check the connections at the battery, remove them and clean 'em. Check the tranny ground strap. Put a test light on the trigger wire at he starter and assure you're getting a signal.

The Cap'n

[orthobiz]

Check the connections at the logic relay under the right seat. Check the connections at the battery, remove them and clean 'em. Check the tranny ground strap. Put a test light on the trigger wire at he starter and assure you're getting a signal.

The Cap'n

Since it does start most of the time, I would assume there's a signal at the trigger wire, no?

Connections and grounds look good. I'm getting ready to buy a new ignition switch. Recommendations about OEM vs. repro? I see some people carry one as a spare anyway, given that they're prone to cracking!

Paul

[CliffBraun]

I'd say test the wiring when it doesn't work. There is a loose connection, internal to the keyswitch or external.
One solution to this problem (which I've seen on several cars, including a gt clone that just came through the shop) is to just slap a ford relay and a button on the dash. That's waaay better than the shorting the starter with a screwdriver method to get it started. My "stock" starter relay wire was a bit too short and likes to pull off,and this has made it so I never have to go out and get under the car to fix it.

I don't see any reason to replace crap that broke with crap that's going to break, but my car isn't a concours unit, so do what you will.

[zonedoubt]

I was experiencing this exact problem on my car today. I replaced the switch last year due to the same issue. I wasn't 100% happy with the fit of the spade connectors in the black terminal that plugs into the ignition switch, but it worked fine so I left it. It was fine until today when the car wouldn't start after a long drive. The screwdriver across the solenoid terminals started it right up. No power at the 14 pin connector on the relay board with the switch in START position.

So it looks like I'm going back to the switch to check things out. Are the black terminal (where the spades fit into) available new? Mine is worn out so the spades are bit sloppy.

[Gint]

When I bought the zambeziteen it had a cracked ignition switch. Every 1 out of 10 turns of the key the starter would actually engage and start the car. Having driven a 914 from CA to CO before and having to roll start it the entire drive home, it seemed like a good idea to replace the cracked ignition switch before I left CA. Ron and I swapped it out for a new one that came in a bag with other spares from the PO.

Fast forward three years... Same symptoms. Occasionally I turn the key and the starter doesn't do squat. And it's not a heat soak issue... bone cold. Turn the key back off and then on again to start and it works fine. Exactly the same symptoms (albeit not as frequent) as the day I bought the car and replaced the cracked switch.

As for the OEM vs. repro question, I'd use OEM if it's available.

[zonedoubt]

I'm gonna wire up one of those Ford relay set-ups. I think the high current through the replacement ignition switches is not healthy for them.

[Gint]

I'm gonna wire up one of those Ford relay set-ups. I think the high current through the replacement ignition switches is not healthy for them.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

And my car has a Ford starter relay on it. I never have a heat soak hot start issue.

But the plastic ignition switches crack. Plain and simple. And it sounds to me like this is Paul's problem based on his description.

They are two separate issues.

[orthobiz]

It looks like I started something here. Now Everybody's got a start problem! Sorry...

Paul

PS What's a "Ford switch?"

[zonedoubt]

It's a relay. There are several threads about it here, with opinions on both sides.

[silverteener]

I think my switch is getting bad also. the ford option doesn't sound to bad....

[wobbletop]

I thought my starter switch was bad too, but after taking apart the steering column (PITA) it turned out to be a broken wire in the engine bay at the main wiring connector.

[zonedoubt]

I spotted a few recent user comments over on the PP site under the tech article for switch replacement:

Yesterday I was working on a friend's 914 that had a bad ignition switch. We had THREE new switches, but NONE of them worked until I put a shim at the right place between the die-cast metal cylinder and the plastic. That made it work! I sure hope it continues to work.

Seems that reproduction switches aren't built to the tolerances of the original German ones. There is a solution though. Simply adding a shim made from some folded over paper on the right hand side of the switch as viewed from the key's perspective at 3 o'clock is just enough to make the switch work as it should.

I doubted this at first, but when the switch I installed didn't work I gave it a try and it worked as it should!

I'm going to try this before I start tearing into wiring, etc.

[SirAndy]

It looks like I started something here. Now Everybody's got a start problem! Sorry...

Don't get me started ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[orthobiz]

I hope to have an original switch from Porsche on the way. I'll try to compare it to the reproduction I have in the column now.

Paul

[Kirmizi]

Updates? Zonedoubt, have you tried the "shim" method?
I recently replaced my old, cracked ignition switch and the replacement only made matters worse.
Mike

[zonedoubt]

I ended up putting in a new ignition switch and key tumbler assembly. The pin on the tumbler side was worn and very sloppy in the switch. No problems now, starts every time.