Home  |  Forums  |  914 Info  |  Blogs
 
914World.com - The fastest growing online 914 community!
 
Porsche, and the Porsche crest are registered trademarks of Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche AG. This site is not affiliated with Porsche in any way.
Its only purpose is to provide an online forum for car enthusiasts. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners.
 

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

> Chassis stiffening in SM2, I don't possibly see how Engman kit or clam shells are legal
blabla914
post Dec 28 2008, 12:40 PM
Post #1


I like primer
**

Group: Members
Posts: 321
Joined: 1-March 04
From: Connecticut
Member No.: 1,740
Region Association: None



Just so you know, I'm not looking to build some killer SM2 914. I just like autocrossing my street car and the old club that was REAL loose with the rules lost their site a couple years ago. Now I'm looking at potentially running some SCCA events and since I used to work registration for a couple different local clubs I hate it when people have no idea what class their car can even run in much less how their mods fit in the different classes.

From the SCCA rule book chapter 16, Street Mod & SM2

16.1 G. Subframe connectors are allowed as per Street Prepared (15.2.E).
15.2 E subframe connectors
E. Longitudinal (fore-aft) subframe connectors (“SFCs”) are permitted with the following restrictions:
1. They must only connect previously unconnected boxed frame rails on unibody vehicles.
2. Each SFC must attach at no more than three points on the unibody (e.g. front, rear, and one point in between such as a seat mount brace or rocker box brace).
3. SFCs must be bolted or welded, but welding must be to the OE subframe stampings, not to the floor pan in between.
4. No cutting of OE subframes or floorpan stampings is permitted. Drilling is permitted for mounting bolts only.
5. No cross-car/lateral/triangulated connections directly between the driver’s side and passenger’s side SFCs are permitted. Connections to OE components such as tunnel braces or closure panels via bolts are allowed and count as the third point of attachment. No alteration to the OE components is permitted.
6. SFCs may not be used to attach other components (including but not limited to torque arm front mounts or driveshaft loops) and may serve no other purpose.

Seems to me the Brad Mayeur kit and clam shells violate items 1,2 &, 3 and the Engman kit since it goes across the fire wall and joins the two sides adds item 5 to the list of reasons it is not legal.

Let me know how you interpret these rules.

Kelly
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
 
Reply to this topicStart new topic
Replies
J P Stein
post Dec 30 2008, 08:20 AM
Post #2


Irrelevant old fart
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 8,797
Joined: 30-December 02
From: Vancouver, WA
Member No.: 45
Region Association: None



My take on "stiffening kits". All they do is transfer stress to an area that is not doubled up. The chassis breaks somewhere else.

Seam welding does a very good job of mitigating cracks....particularly on pinch seams.....around the ears and the arch over the axles. It does not prevent the front and back sections from moving independently, however, nor does any stiffening kit.

One of the first thing that pro teams do for prep is strip a chassis and seam weld....continuous or skip weld......including the Porsche factory on their cup (et al)
cars. Taint just for fun.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
blabla914
post Dec 31 2008, 07:22 PM
Post #3


I like primer
**

Group: Members
Posts: 321
Joined: 1-March 04
From: Connecticut
Member No.: 1,740
Region Association: None



QUOTE(J P Stein @ Dec 30 2008, 06:20 AM) *

My take on "stiffening kits". All they do is transfer stress to an area that is not doubled up. The chassis breaks somewhere else.

Seam welding does a very good job of mitigating cracks....particularly on pinch seams.....around the ears and the arch over the axles. It does not prevent the front and back sections from moving independently, however, nor does any stiffening kit.



Unfortunately I did not know what I know now when I had this car stripped to the tub about 8 years ago. Since my first 914 was a total rust bucket and came apart at pretty much every seam, I did seam or skip weld a lot of this car particularly in the longs, suspension pickup points, and over the axles. I also did a lot of doubling on the consoles and outer suspension points. I did not spend a lot of time on the inner longs where they meet the seat members or the rear shock towers. Judging by some of your other posts I need to spend some time there or just wait for it to crack.

I hear you on the stiffening kits. You get the most benefit by changing the structure not just adding metal to the current one. Additionally, you will always break the weakest link. I did the engman kit mainly because last summer I discovered cracks on the inner longs on both sides. The passenger side was cracked pretty much from front to back and the driver side was cracked near the e-brake where it hooks up to the cross piece that holds the seat. When I started repairing the cracks it seemed to me the thickness of the inner long was compromised in some areas due to rust. This car is real clean for an east coast car. The hell hole wasn't even rusted through, but was rusty so I doubled that area. I figured if I just welded the cracks I would probably have cracks adjacent to the welds in the not too distant future. That's what happened with my first 914. The engman kit seemed like a good way to keep the inner longs from cracking again, for a while at least.

Kelly
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post

Posts in this topic
blabla914   Chassis stiffening in SM2   Dec 28 2008, 12:40 PM
Joe Ricard   That's a pretty fine line on the Engman firewa...   Dec 28 2008, 01:49 PM
blabla914   Here is a technicality that will send the protes...   Dec 28 2008, 03:54 PM
Richard Casto   At one point I considered trying to build my car t...   Dec 28 2008, 05:43 PM
Joe Ricard   Have any of you looked at a real SM2 car? OMG ...   Dec 29 2008, 07:35 AM
blabla914   Have any of you looked at a real SM2 car? OMG ...   Dec 29 2008, 08:05 AM
grantsfo   Have any of you looked at a real SM2 car? OMG ...   Jan 9 2009, 02:26 PM
Joe Ricard   No, I saying the cars that are doing well in SM2 ...   Dec 29 2008, 08:22 AM
blabla914   Again, I totally agree about SM2 rules. I've ...   Dec 29 2008, 08:59 AM
J P Stein   By "real" I think Joe means a car built ...   Dec 29 2008, 09:30 AM
blabla914   By "real" I think Joe means a car built...   Dec 29 2008, 09:50 AM
J P Stein   Heh......no fool here. I install the Carrera cover...   Dec 29 2008, 10:22 AM
blabla914   Heh......no fool here. I install the Carrera cove...   Dec 29 2008, 10:56 AM
J P Stein   I didn't shorten the shaft. I put them in some...   Dec 29 2008, 11:21 AM
blabla914   good to know. Thanks. Kelly   Dec 29 2008, 11:38 AM
jhadler   Unless you expect to be competing nationally, or r...   Dec 29 2008, 02:29 PM
blitZ   But for just having fun locally, I say run it in ...   Dec 30 2008, 08:36 AM
blabla914   Josh, Yeah I hear you. I'm probably over ana...   Dec 30 2008, 07:28 AM
J P Stein   My take on "stiffening kits". All they d...   Dec 30 2008, 08:20 AM
blabla914   My take on "stiffening kits". All they ...   Dec 31 2008, 07:22 PM
J P Stein   The 914's chassis was never intended to take t...   Dec 31 2008, 09:05 PM
grantsfo   The 914's chassis was never intended to take ...   Jan 8 2009, 10:33 PM
J P Stein   The 914's chassis was never intended to take...   Jan 9 2009, 09:51 AM
grantsfo   Reinforcements are generally overated for most cau...   Jan 9 2009, 02:10 PM
J P Stein   But JP we all know your the expert AX'r so ...   Jan 9 2009, 08:28 PM
SirAndy   you are neither. :woohoo:   Jan 10 2009, 12:15 AM
Travis Neff   <snicker!>   Jan 10 2009, 02:29 AM


Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



- Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 15th June 2024 - 03:49 PM