Corner Weight Balancing of 914s, The benefits of equalizing the side-to-side corner wts. |
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Corner Weight Balancing of 914s, The benefits of equalizing the side-to-side corner wts. |
stewteral |
Dec 9 2009, 12:43 AM
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#1
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Old Member Group: Members Posts: 384 Joined: 4-December 07 From: Camarillo, CA Member No.: 8,424 Region Association: Southern California |
Hey 914ers:
If you have been following my posts on 914 chassis settings, here is one that applies to ALL 914's. To start, per my posts: -I Squared the chassis with paralleled strings to measure and set the toe, front and rear. (Front = 0 to -1/16 toe, rear = 0 to -1/8" toe) =Results: steering a bit "nervous", but all else stable. -Camber: For Street cars, Standard front with -1 to -1.5 degrees rear. =Results: nothing noticeable. -I bumpsteered the front suspensions to within 0.008" from prefect at 2" compression. =Results: nothing I could feel driving the car on the street. TBD on-track. -CORNER WEIGHT BALANCED THE CHASSIS: With the car weighted for the driver weight, I adjusted the rear spring ht. and the front torsion bar ride height. For the rear, large diameter washers can be added to make adjustments, while the front is too easy with an 11 mm wrench. =Results: WONDERFUL!! With all the previous chassis settings done, the car still wanted to pull to the right as though I were on a highly crowned road. After the balancing the corner weights, side-to-side, the car now runs STRAIGHT and TRUE right down the road. The sense through the steering is now light, equal and very linear as to where I want to aim the car. Conclusion: Take the time to either build wt check lever, as per my photo or find a very strong STEEL ladder and wing it. Regardless, the benefit from the effort is completely WORTH IT!!! If you have any questions, please let me know! Terry stewteral@verizon.net |
J P Stein |
Dec 12 2009, 01:51 PM
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#2
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Irrelevant old fart Group: Members Posts: 8,797 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Vancouver, WA Member No.: 45 Region Association: None |
Of course, sonny, you can't learn squat from a fat old guy.
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stewteral |
Dec 15 2009, 10:57 PM
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#3
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Old Member Group: Members Posts: 384 Joined: 4-December 07 From: Camarillo, CA Member No.: 8,424 Region Association: Southern California |
Of course, sonny, you can't learn squat from a fat old guy. Hey Ricky Racer, Are you saying you have a lot of racing and race-car prep experience? I'd be interested in learning what experience you have with which cars and tracks. Have you always done your own chassis prep and tuning? What kind of equipment do you use for chassis alignment? Have you raced a number of different types of cars? Do you have any special tricks you have picked up over the years? Thanks, Terry |
SirAndy |
Dec 16 2009, 12:17 PM
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#4
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,669 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
Hey Ricky Racer, Are you saying you have a lot of racing and race-car prep experience? I'd be interested in learning what experience you have with which cars and tracks. Have you always done your own chassis prep and tuning? What kind of equipment do you use for chassis alignment? Have you raced a number of different types of cars? Do you have any special tricks you have picked up over the years? I'm not Ricky Racer nor do i play him on TV ... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I happen to be the crew chief for a small Porsche racing team. We consistently place in the top 3 with many, many race wins and overall class wins under our belt. To answer your questions: - All the chassis prep and tuning is done by us. - We use electronic scales and the Smart Racing strings, camber plates and camber gauges for alignment. - I race and work mostly on Porsche's. 911, GT2, 914, Boxster, you get the idea. - Yes. My point? I agree with the old fart. You're doing it in reverse. We always start by setting the ride height close to where we want it, then corner balance the car to fine tune, then align the car. In that order. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) Andy |
stewteral |
Dec 17 2009, 10:05 PM
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#5
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Old Member Group: Members Posts: 384 Joined: 4-December 07 From: Camarillo, CA Member No.: 8,424 Region Association: Southern California |
Hey Ricky Racer, Are you saying you have a lot of racing and race-car prep experience? I'd be interested in learning what experience you have with which cars and tracks. Have you always done your own chassis prep and tuning? What kind of equipment do you use for chassis alignment? Have you raced a number of different types of cars? Do you have any special tricks you have picked up over the years? I'm not Ricky Racer nor do i play him on TV ... :D I happen to be the crew chief for a small Porsche racing team. We consistently place in the top 3 with many, many race wins and overall class wins under our belt. To answer your questions: - All the chassis prep and tuning is done by us. - We use electronic scales and the Smart Racing strings, camber plates and camber gauges for alignment. - I race and work mostly on Porsche's. 911, GT2, 914, Boxster, you get the idea. - Yes. My point? I agree with the old fart. You're doing it in reverse. We always start by setting the ride height close to where we want it, then corner balance the car to fine tune, then align the car. In that order. :popcorn: Andy Hey Andy: I have no argument with where to start the chassis adjustment process, but after finishing the first round of settings, one should go back around and verify/adjust the others.....wouldn't you agree? Since every adjustment effects the others, it is a continuing process of refining all the settings. Now after setting toe, camber, ride height and corner weight, I will go back and verify toe and camber settings. Have fun with your track cars, you have 2 truly great tracks up in NOCAL, while I have only WSIR and Buttonwillow here in SOCAL Best, Terry |
SirAndy |
Dec 18 2009, 11:37 AM
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#6
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Resident German Group: Admin Posts: 41,669 Joined: 21-January 03 From: Oakland, Kalifornia Member No.: 179 Region Association: Northern California |
I have no argument with where to start the chassis adjustment process, but after finishing the first round of settings, one should go back around and verify/adjust the others.....wouldn't you agree? Since every adjustment effects the others, it is a continuing process of refining all the settings. Now after setting toe, camber, ride height and corner weight, I will go back and verify toe and camber settings. True, we always double and triple check the settings. However, in my experience, the effects of corner balancing on the alignment are far greater than the effects of an alignment on the corner balance. We do the corner balance first because if you do the alignment first the corner balance will tend to throw off your alignment settings enough that you have to go back and readjust your settings afterward. In contrast, doing the alignment after the corner balance seems to have little to no effect on the corner balance. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) Andy |
stewteral |
Dec 19 2009, 12:01 PM
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#7
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Old Member Group: Members Posts: 384 Joined: 4-December 07 From: Camarillo, CA Member No.: 8,424 Region Association: Southern California |
I have no argument with where to start the chassis adjustment process, but after finishing the first round of settings, one should go back around and verify/adjust the others.....wouldn't you agree? Since every adjustment effects the others, it is a continuing process of refining all the settings. Now after setting toe, camber, ride height and corner weight, I will go back and verify toe and camber settings. True, we always double and triple check the settings. However, in my experience, the effects of corner balancing on the alignment are far greater than the effects of an alignment on the corner balance. We do the corner balance first because if you do the alignment first the corner balance will tend to throw off your alignment settings enough that you have to go back and readjust your settings afterward. In contrast, doing the alignment after the corner balance seems to have little to no effect on the corner balance. :shades2: Andy Hey Andy, I think I can put the whole debate on "what to adjust first" to rest by letting you know that I didn't get around to building my corner-weight check lever until the last. I was kinda busy with a complete engine rebuild, replacing 1 of the dual master cylinders for the brakes and building & installing a new rear swaybar. Shame on me: I was spoiled by the good old days with the formula Ford where I could load the car with my weight and just stick a bathroom scale under each wheel! Too easy! So really there is NO arguement. Starting with the bump steer info I took on the rear suspension, I've calculated that the worst case "unintended-adjustment" change would be 0.025" change in toe-in. However, as we agree, going around all the setting again will rectify any such change. Merry Christmas, Terry |
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