Racing question i have never heard of before, It actually exists and is banned from F1! Options

[tazz9924]

So. I own a baja bug and a popular off road upgrade for it is a cutting/ turning brake. My question is why arnt these used in road racing as an alternative for left foot braking? this would direct braking force torwards the inside wheel(s) and may allow for faster and tighter cornering.

(Edit): I found that mclaren used a system similar to this in 97-98 in F1 and is a system currently employed in modern mclaren road cars. Instead of a grab handle it was a switchable 3rd pedal to the left of the brake pedal (they dont have clutches) Conservative estimates say it was good for .3 seconds a lap! It was banned from F1 on the grounds that it was a 4 wheel steering system. More info can be found here: http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/archive/...e-steer-mclaren

[brant]

fun....
we all have different interpretations


Trail braking is about transferring some of your grip that your using up braking... transferring it with a forward weight transfer to promote more turning grip at the expense of less braking grip...

you brake later... brake less powerfully... and brake longer to equal the amount of braking force you would of had by braking harder in a straight line.

subsequently the trail braking transfers some of the tire grip to the front wheels (rear brake only would not help this at all) and that increased grip on the front tires allow you to actually make the corner at a slightly higher speed (demanding more grip)

had you braked fully in a straight line you would have a slower speed and enough front grip left to make it without trail braking, but potentially slower entry speed also.

because you are trail braking.... you would have enough tire grip or adhesion left to make the corner at this slightly higher speed.

its a tool and has a time and place
one place might be when you make a pass on your competitor under a braking situation. you play chicken with your competitor while side by side... chicken to see who is going to brake first.

assuming you win the game of chicken, you carry your extra speed into the corner so you can complete the pass.... then you trail brake in the corner so you don't spin out and can actually turn the car in at the higher rate of speed you have carried.

its not something I would do every corner
its something that works well on some corners, not others.

trail braking is about increasing front grip from a car that wants to understeer
it might be understeering because you are going to fast
but it might save your but and help you " make it" through a corner

rear brake only, as per the image of the sytem used by rally car drivers...
is about creating over steer (severe over steer)
and has nothing to do with addressing understeer.

brant

[Dave_Darling]

subsequently the trail braking transfers some of the tire grip to the front wheels (rear brake only would not help this at all)...

You'd think that, but it's not quite true. Slowing the car at all will cause weight to transfer off the rear wheels and onto the front wheels. As long as what you are using to slow the car is below the CG of the car, there will always be weight transfer. Your rear tires are also below the CG, unless there is something very odd going on.

But when the weight is coming off the rear wheels, it is easier to lock them up. It is also easier to lock up the inside-front wheel if you brake while turning, in part for the same reason--weight has transferred off it.

The above does not detract from your main points at all, though. Just a weird side-track.

--DD

[6freak]

Your rear tires are also below the CG, unless there is something very odd going on.
--DD

yeah! like your upside down (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif) ,which is never good...look forward to some AX with ya Tazz cept the cold rain part ..