Door hinges, Original door hinges… Painted? |
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Door hinges, Original door hinges… Painted? |
Ishley |
Aug 2 2022, 09:20 PM
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 106 Joined: 4-October 21 From: Clarendon Hills Il Member No.: 25,957 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
I have a 1972 1.7 that I’m restoring. One of the areas that I can’t find any information on is how the door hinges were originally finished. Mine have been sprayed over several times and when I repaint I want it to look right.
Were the hinges painted to the same color of the car? What about the bolts and pins. We’re they painted or zinc/cadmium plated. I ran my bolts through my ultrasonic cleaner and it appears they are black underneath the layers of paint. Does anyone have an original picture of how it was finished from the factory? |
wonkipop |
Aug 12 2022, 11:52 PM
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#2
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,403 Joined: 6-May 20 From: north antarctica Member No.: 24,231 Region Association: NineFourteenerVille |
came across old ad for a 1970 914.
most of the paint looks original. certainly all inners. only one image is a clear shot of the hinges. looks like the hinge pin could be painted in this early car. hard to discern but think its white paint there not bare metal hinge pin. @SirAndy might be good to shift this thread over to originality section of site? |
nathanxnathan |
Aug 13 2022, 12:50 AM
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 291 Joined: 16-February 18 From: Laguna Beach, CA Member No.: 21,899 Region Association: Southern California |
came across old ad for a 1970 914. most of the paint looks original. certainly all inners. only one image is a clear shot of the hinges. looks like the hinge pin could be painted in this early car. hard to discern but think its white paint there not bare metal hinge pin. Opening the image in a new tab on the site will show it unscaled, but it's still indiscernible. I would say it looks unpainted if I had to guess. It's interesting that car's vin is 11,000 cars after mine, a fairly late 70, but the chassis number is 15 weeks before mine. It has the later driver seat tilt adjustment arm and the 2 section center tray. |
wonkipop |
Aug 13 2022, 01:37 AM
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#4
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,403 Joined: 6-May 20 From: north antarctica Member No.: 24,231 Region Association: NineFourteenerVille |
came across old ad for a 1970 914. most of the paint looks original. certainly all inners. only one image is a clear shot of the hinges. looks like the hinge pin could be painted in this early car. hard to discern but think its white paint there not bare metal hinge pin. Opening the image in a new tab on the site will show it unscaled, but it's still indiscernible. I would say it looks unpainted if I had to guess. It's interesting that car's vin is 11,000 cars after mine, a fairly late 70, but the chassis number is 15 weeks before mine. It has the later driver seat tilt adjustment arm and the 2 section center tray. even in 74 the karmann numbers wander around off kilter with the vin numbers. however that does not sound quite right that there is such a discrepancy. you must have a very very early 69 car @nathanxnathan . it must be within the first thousand cars built and it must have been started 15 weeks before august 69. which is interesting. the one i found above is an august 70 car. right towards end of 70 MY production. |
nathanxnathan |
Aug 13 2022, 09:29 AM
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 291 Joined: 16-February 18 From: Laguna Beach, CA Member No.: 21,899 Region Association: Southern California |
even in 74 the karmann numbers wander around off kilter with the vin numbers. however that does not sound quite right that there is such a discrepancy. you must have a very very early 69 car @nathanxnathan . it must be within the first thousand cars built and it must have been started 15 weeks before august 69. which is interesting. the one i found above is an august 70 car. right towards end of 70 MY production. @wonkipop My car, the vin and chassis number are pretty close, both in November of 69. Chassis #4839528 I work out to being the 28th car built on Wednesday Nov 25, 1969 The vin is 4702900987 I don't have a door sticker — it was removed during a respray I assume. The production numbers listed here on 914world go by actual year, saying 1543 4 cylinder cars were produced in 69, so my vin agrees with that, if it was #987. I think the production numbers here are based on vins, not chassis numbers? The white car, I can't make out the production date on the door sticker, but with vin 4702912026 that would make it the 12,026 — 11,000 cars later — pretty far on into 1970 for a completion date if there were about 22,000 1970 model year 4 cylinder cars. The white car's chassis number is 3319577 which I think is August 11th, 1969. So it sat as a chassis for 10 months or so? It seems like the chassis would have got painted, like they couldn't have left it around in bare metal that whole time. The Karmann badge is applied after paint so that seems logical that they create and mark the chassis with the number. Then the vin gets assigned once the whole car is assembled. I guess chassis numbers are what would be relevant here, rather than vins as it's a chassis question. |
wonkipop |
Aug 13 2022, 03:30 PM
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#6
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,403 Joined: 6-May 20 From: north antarctica Member No.: 24,231 Region Association: NineFourteenerVille |
even in 74 the karmann numbers wander around off kilter with the vin numbers. however that does not sound quite right that there is such a discrepancy. you must have a very very early 69 car @nathanxnathan . it must be within the first thousand cars built and it must have been started 15 weeks before august 69. which is interesting. the one i found above is an august 70 car. right towards end of 70 MY production. @wonkipop My car, the vin and chassis number are pretty close, both in November of 69. Chassis #4839528 I work out to being the 28th car built on Wednesday Nov 25, 1969 The vin is 4702900987 I don't have a door sticker — it was removed during a respray I assume. The production numbers listed here on 914world go by actual year, saying 1543 4 cylinder cars were produced in 69, so my vin agrees with that, if it was #987. I think the production numbers here are based on vins, not chassis numbers? The white car, I can't make out the production date on the door sticker, but with vin 4702912026 that would make it the 12,026 — 11,000 cars later — pretty far on into 1970 for a completion date if there were about 22,000 1970 model year 4 cylinder cars. The white car's chassis number is 3319577 which I think is August 11th, 1969. So it sat as a chassis for 10 months or so? It seems like the chassis would have got painted, like they couldn't have left it around in bare metal that whole time. The Karmann badge is applied after paint so that seems logical that they create and mark the chassis with the number. Then the vin gets assigned once the whole car is assembled. I guess chassis numbers are what would be relevant here, rather than vins as it's a chassis question. i doubt very much the K number on the white car goes to august 69 and that it sat for 10 months. i would say its a late production car and the K number is indicating august 70. unfortunately no vin sticker was available in the dealer photos to show that. the numbers on 1970 MY cars are not 22,000. thats the production for the calendar year 1970. production was only around 13,000 for the 4s for MY 70. since its vin is up in the 12,000 range its about a 1000 from the end of 70 model. they built about 100 cars a day on average through most of the production run. so its a car 2 weeks from the end of 70 MY. k number makes it an early aug 1970 car. which is right. they usually took several weeks off sometime in or around august as a summer holiday and shut the factory down or slowed production down between the model year breaks. the chassis number checks out. there is nothing odd about it. |
nathanxnathan |
Aug 13 2022, 10:17 PM
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 291 Joined: 16-February 18 From: Laguna Beach, CA Member No.: 21,899 Region Association: Southern California |
i doubt very much the K number on the white car goes to august 69 and that it sat for 10 months. i would say its a late production car and the K number is indicating august 70. unfortunately no vin sticker was available in the dealer photos to show that. the numbers on 1970 MY cars are not 22,000. thats the production for the calendar year 1970. production was only around 13,000 for the 4s for MY 70. since its vin is up in the 12,000 range its about a 1000 from the end of 70 model. they built about 100 cars a day on average through most of the production run. so its a car 2 weeks from the end of 70 MY. k number makes it an early aug 1970 car. which is right. they usually took several weeks off sometime in or around august as a summer holiday and shut the factory down or slowed production down between the model year breaks. the chassis number checks out. there is nothing odd about it. That makes sense about the 22,000 — I was adding 69 production to the total 70 production and forgot for a second that 4 months of 70 production are 71 model year cars. But about when the white car was made does seem strange to me. Everything I've read says August 1st started the production year. The 33rd week of the year, whether 69 or 70 was the week starting Monday August 11th or 10th respectively. If the chassis was made August 10th, 1970 it would be a 1971 model year car, but it's clearly not. And that's just the chassis — the car would have been completed even later. So it is weird to me that either the car was made in 69 and the chassis sat for 10+ months or else they didn't start making 71 model year cars until halfway through August. And that's not even thinking about the break — I thought that happened July.. |
wonkipop |
Aug 14 2022, 01:39 AM
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#8
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,403 Joined: 6-May 20 From: north antarctica Member No.: 24,231 Region Association: NineFourteenerVille |
i doubt very much the K number on the white car goes to august 69 and that it sat for 10 months. i would say its a late production car and the K number is indicating august 70. unfortunately no vin sticker was available in the dealer photos to show that. the numbers on 1970 MY cars are not 22,000. thats the production for the calendar year 1970. production was only around 13,000 for the 4s for MY 70. since its vin is up in the 12,000 range its about a 1000 from the end of 70 model. they built about 100 cars a day on average through most of the production run. so its a car 2 weeks from the end of 70 MY. k number makes it an early aug 1970 car. which is right. they usually took several weeks off sometime in or around august as a summer holiday and shut the factory down or slowed production down between the model year breaks. the chassis number checks out. there is nothing odd about it. That makes sense about the 22,000 — I was adding 69 production to the total 70 production and forgot for a second that 4 months of 70 production are 71 model year cars. But about when the white car was made does seem strange to me. Everything I've read says August 1st started the production year. The 33rd week of the year, whether 69 or 70 was the week starting Monday August 11th or 10th respectively. If the chassis was made August 10th, 1970 it would be a 1971 model year car, but it's clearly not. And that's just the chassis — the car would have been completed even later. So it is weird to me that either the car was made in 69 and the chassis sat for 10+ months or else they didn't start making 71 model year cars until halfway through August. And that's not even thinking about the break — I thought that happened July.. your observation is correct. its extremely late in the piece to be august and still a 70 MY. as far as i can work out from our 74 research they made 74s as late as july 74. we came up with one sole example. the earliest 74s were august 73. so the break might have been either end of july or start of august when it came to 74s and factory holidays shutdowns. i think germans were fairly traditional and summer holidays were set in stone? but it was still the era of the economic miracle and the idea of work, work, work (as per the japanese of that time) - don't know enough about their traditions and what is the summer break. the earliest 75 1.8s i came across were august of 74. i'd have to back and check the karmann plates to work out when in august. i don't have a karmann plate number for the 74 that was built in july. looks a little more nebulous when it comes to 70? maybe. like maybe they didn't have a holiday. or they shifted it a bit. or they finished off a few more 70s before they started on 71s. or maybe cars built to order and playing catch up? if you ordered a 70 you would expect to get a 70 not a 71 model. not sure what waiting lists for cars were like back then. probably not as bad as right now!!!!!!! but i doubt they would have left a body shell lying around for 11/12 (not 10) months. its a long long time. if they did it would have been only to do some serious rectification work and its difficult to imagine it taking that long to do it. dunno. mysteries of the 914! i've got some sense of when these cars finally rocked up in showrooms and finally got sold as whatever model years they were. eg. mine was built in jan 74 but not sold until may 74. and @StarBear is an original owner. so he can tell you when he saw his in the showroom in east coast USA and bought it. his was made in november 73, the whole thing has lags in time, |
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