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> Fuel pump options, Staying in its original location
emerygt350
post Apr 13 2023, 07:59 PM
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I am having a very specific issue here. Pump no longer holds pressure after shutdown. Original location, original three port pump. It still pumps great when running, but no longer holds pressure. Need to fix that and quick. Do I have to replace it or can it be repaired?
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wonkipop
post Apr 16 2023, 11:38 PM
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@emerygt350

i was watching the full unedited version of the interview with the mclaren mp4/4 F1 car designers last night on youtube before going to bed.

towards the end there was a new added section.
a discussion about the fuel system.

it seemed the mp4/4 suffered from fuel vaporisation problems late in races due to the circuit the fuel ran in, which meant it had to be drawn up from the bottom of the tank bladder and over the engine and to the rear of the engine. this also increased the temp of the fuel in the total circuit. sometimes the fuel in the tank would start boiling.
and the car would suffer starvation as the main pump began to cavitate.

the solution was pretty good. they built a little catch tank of sorts under the quick fill fuel cap and pumped first to it and pressurised at a low pressure of 0.5 bar. this was enough to keep the fuel feed to the main pump liquid. they made a check valve themselves out of a ball bearing and the spring from a ball point pen. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

the pressure was quite low. 0.5 bar = 7 lbs. it was done with tiny electric fuel pump.
way less than the pressure in a 914 injector circuit or an F1 turbo engine.

the comment was made in the video by the engineers that pumps only like to pump and not suck fuel. a good flow is required for feed. a good flow can be simulated by a small amount of low pressure. so the main fuel pump which generated much higher injector pressure was fed by this low pressure line. the tank itself and return circuit remained unpressurised.

one way around the old 914 problem is not necessarily to go the high pressure route from the tank to the engine as per 75 cars but simply to induce a small amount of pressure in the feed line from the tank with a tiny pump?

i dunno? just a thought. it may be enough to keep the fuel from boiling in the critical part of the fuel line after the tunnel and before the fuel pump. a low pressure feed.

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/293759097396

such pumps are very small. easily accommodated discretely under the tank.
and with less stress on the fuel lines through the cabin if you don't have the steel lines in yet. or you don't feel comfortable with a higher pressurized line through the cabin (which i must admit is how i feel re high pressure line through the cabin - i know that is probably not rational given i have steel lines in now......but).
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emerygt350   Fuel pump options   Apr 13 2023, 07:59 PM
r_towle   I would suggest you test the injectors, including ...   Apr 13 2023, 08:21 PM
r_towle   https://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/DJetParts.ht...   Apr 13 2023, 08:22 PM
emerygt350   This is after shutdown. I will have to check the ...   Apr 14 2023, 04:06 AM
emerygt350   "Failed Check Valve: The check valve keeps th...   Apr 14 2023, 04:13 AM
emerygt350   Hmm seems that "check valve" is debated ...   Apr 14 2023, 09:40 AM
emerygt350   After an hour, pressure back down to 0. Nothing i...   Apr 14 2023, 10:27 AM
emerygt350   Engine was nice and hot. Parked. Pressure was 24 ...   Apr 14 2023, 10:59 AM
r_towle   The way to check your injectors is to remove the n...   Apr 14 2023, 11:05 AM
emerygt350   Or you just remove them from the system like I did...   Apr 14 2023, 11:18 AM
emerygt350   I think this is some boyles law stuff. The fuel n...   Apr 14 2023, 11:22 AM
brant   I had a 3 port fail this way with the pressure hol...   Apr 14 2023, 11:39 AM
Olympic 914   Why do you need to have the pressure hold when the...   Apr 14 2023, 11:40 AM
wonkipop   Why do you need to have the pressure hold when th...   Apr 14 2023, 09:49 PM
emerygt350   Is your pump under your engine or has it been relo...   Apr 14 2023, 01:24 PM
burton73   Well, the factory moved the pump up front under th...   Apr 14 2023, 01:59 PM
emerygt350   Yes, absolutely. That is what I need to do but my...   Apr 14 2023, 02:06 PM
wonkipop   interesting read @[url=http://www.914world.com/bb...   Apr 14 2023, 09:34 PM
wonkipop   @[url=http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showu...   Apr 16 2023, 11:38 PM
emerygt350   Very interesting! I have had stupid old v8s t...   Apr 17 2023, 05:19 AM


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