tuna can vs. deep sump vs. Accu sump Options

[jmargush]

Now that I have an oil pressure gauge in car I can see drastic swings in oil pressure while on the autox course.

So this prompts a few questions.

Does the Type IV have an oil system that really isn't adequate for higher G loads and quick direction changes?


Will I see an noticeable difference if i go tuna can sump vs. Deep sump vs. Accu sump?

I understand the Accu sump is likely the way to go but there is also a significant entry cost difference and more involvement on the install.

I hate to spend the money on the easy install of a tuna can if it isn't going to make a noticeable difference and I should have just put the money toward the Accu sump.

[GregAmy]

Does the Type IV have an oil system that really isn't adequate for higher G loads and quick direction changes?

Yes. My 914 road racer was built around 1999, right about when Hoosier started getting sticky tires, and the previous owner kept popping engines due to low oil pressure. He tried tuna cans, bigger sumps and still had failures so he finally gave up because the regs did not allow him a proper fix...which was a dry sump system.

When I got the car it was the first thing I did (while rebuilding the engine). I use this pump:

https://www.cbperformance.com/product-p/1745cl.htm

I use a Canton oil tank up front (it already had a front-mounted oil cooler). But for general autocross and street use I suggest you could use a 914/6 tank in the stock location.

As for Accusumps, here's my thoughts on them:

https://tgadrivel.blogspot.com/2024/05/on-accusumps.html

For any kind of competition on sticky tires, I strongly recommend going dry sump. - GA

[jmargush]

Does the Type IV have an oil system that really isn't adequate for higher G loads and quick direction changes?

Yes. My 914 road racer was built around 1999, right about when Hoosier started getting sticky tires, and the previous owner kept popping engines due to low oil pressure. He tried tuna cans, bigger sumps and still had failures so he finally gave up because the regs did not allow him a proper fix...which was a dry sump system.

When I got the car it was the first thing I did (while rebuilding the engine). I use this pump:

https://www.cbperformance.com/product-p/1745cl.htm

I use a Canton oil tank up front (it already had a front-mounted oil cooler). But for general autocross and street use I suggest you could use a 914/6 tank in the stock location.

As for Accusumps, here's my thoughts on them:

https://tgadrivel.blogspot.com/2024/05/on-accusumps.html

For any kind of competition on sticky tires, I strongly recommend going dry sump. - GA

Greg,

looks like some good reading I'll check it out.

Does the dry sump get plumbed in with a oil filter adapter block?

I assume guys like Chris Foley and Len Hoffman are running a dry sump?

[GregAmy]

Does the dry sump get plumbed in with a oil filter adapter block?

It's all installed so I can't take any photos, but the oil pump looks just like a standard oil pump except extended; making it a two-stage pump (two different sets of parallel gears).

It fits behind the stock fan shroud but you have to fab a front mount bracket.

It has two fittings on the extended part, pointing sideways. One is the "scavage" port/stage which extracts oil from the sump (using the same pickup tube) and sends the oil to a tank; the second port/stage is where the oil comes from the tank and is sent to the engine passages.

The design ensures that one stage's job (oil from the tank) is just to provide pressurized oil to the engine, and the other stage's only job is just to re-fill the tank. As long as you have oil in the tank (mine is 8-10 quarts) you'll get pressurized oil.

You don't have to change the existing oil filter system to do this, the stock filter cassette will work fine. All you're doing is plumbing the pump to the tank, and the tank back to the pump.

In my case, I already had a front-mounted oil cooler so I just leveraged that system by adding the tank up front.

It's a bit involved since you have to mod the CB pump to fit the Type 4 engine; Chris Foley did that for me and I seem to recall it was modifying the drive tang to fit the T4 camshaft. But he can probably help you with that. And, of course, you have to add a tank and external (AN) lines. But the concept is a lot more simple than you may initially think.

I'm not a fan of them (as you may have read) but an Accusump might work just fine for brief, unextended cornering and transitions, such as in autocross. For that environment you might consider trying one first. But if you start getting into track days and/or tie trials with sticky tires* then the dry sump system should be on your horizon.

GA

*I've done a Track Night in America with my street 914 on Firestone street rocks without noticeable issue. But I was very cautious on the longer corners as all I have in that car is the oil pressure idiot light.