Suspension upgrade, Like Modern! Options

[Randal]

Been thinking about what it would take to build in tubes or whatever to allow a complete Boxster suspension swap out on a 914.

It is likely a big project, but maybe not.

Anyone else been thinking about this? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sawzall-smiley.gif)

[J P Stein]

I have mulled it over. I've decided to sell the $hitbox instead.

[Randal]

I have mulled it over. I've decided to sell the $hitbox instead.

I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on the project, i.e., other than the conclusion you reached...

BTW I have my motor back, ready to go back into 222. It's sitting in my garage on an engine stand.

I'd have it back in, except for a bit of a setback I RAN into.

[grantsfo]

I'd rather see the car run. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

But yes Boxster suspension would be a huge improvement. If you get out to an event I'll let you take some runs in my car. You will be amazed at how much better Boxster suspension is over 914. I can do absolutely stupid stuf fand recover in the Boxster.

We do have some local people looking at Boxster suspension swaps. I'm just not aware of anyone executing yet.

This post has been edited by grantsfo: Jul 15 2009, 10:59 AM

[grantsfo]

I have mulled it over. I've decided to sell the $hitbox instead.

I'll have enough class to not say what JP said when I sold my car, but will ask a question. JP, You trading up to a Miata? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)

This post has been edited by grantsfo: Jul 15 2009, 11:11 AM

[Randal]

You will be amazed at how much better Boxster suspension is over 914. I can do absolutely stupid stuf fand recover in the Boxster.

Hardly, as I've had a reasonable amout of seat time in Spec Boxsters from the beginning of Spec Boxsters.

Like the first day we took out Bill's Spec Boxster at a GGR autox and did pretty well.

[Randal]

I have mulled it over. I've decided to sell the $hitbox instead.

I'll have enough class to not say what JP said when I sold my car, but will ask a question. JP, You trading up to a Miata? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/happy11.gif)

Do me a favor Grant, please leave the "poking" to some other web site.

I'd personally like to hear JP's technical opions on the matter; IMHO the "poking" or joking or whatever you call it just eliminates the opportunity to get people discussing what I was trying to discover.

[J P Stein]

I didn't get much past the looking it over stage. The Boxster suspenders are still Mac strut which doesn't appear to be a huge advantage over the 914 set-up except.....
If a guy was able to adapt the Box ball joints to the 914 A arm, then use the upright & strut, you would get the advantage of reduced scrub radius with wide front wheels (larger back space wheels could then be fitted) There would be some modifying to the upper mount to attach it. Neither of these seem to be a show stopper.....but a fair amount of fab work.

I have never gotten a good look at the rear. It would seem (at a glance) to need a new subframe fabbed for attach points. It seems very superior to the stock 914 set-up.
That said, a custom double A arm set up may be no more difficult since a new subframe is needed no how.

I want to simplify my AX experience. I can't keep up with the shitbox. The preliminary plan would be to set up my Mr.2 Turbo to run B Stock against the RX8s. Tires & shocks is about all one can do....but a Miata is not out of the question.

[john rogers]

You could do what Ron Mistak did with his 914 and put a late model rear suspension under it. That is the GT-1 looking car and I heard the cost was close to astronomical including all the tube frame work. I would think it would be easy (relative) to cut away a Boxster body and save the bulkheads as necessary and then put all the outer panels of a 914 GT over it. The Boxster could be narrowed, shortened, etc as needed as long as reassembly was done correctly.

But once all that is done the question becomes where do you race it?

[J P Stein]

But once all that is done the question becomes where do you race it?

The SCCA autocross Mod class......PCA, too.
These classes are among the few places that a hot rodder that likes turns can play.

[Randal]

You could do what Ron Mistak did with his 914 and put a late model rear suspension under it. That is the GT-1 looking car and I heard the cost was close to astronomical including all the tube frame work. I would think it would be easy (relative) to cut away a Boxster body and save the bulkheads as necessary and then put all the outer panels of a 914 GT over it. The Boxster could be narrowed, shortened, etc as needed as long as reassembly was done correctly.

But once all that is done the question becomes where do you race it?

Your right, it is likely out of the question cost wise to duplicate, in tubes, the attachment points and use a 914 starting point.

On the other hand, just for fun, I've got to take a closer look at Bills Spec Boxster and figure out just how many "attachment points" would have to be fabricated.

With some of the 3D software out there the job might be something that could be documented, then built.

[EdwardBlume]

Randal, you know Jason Samson right? I think he was working on a similar result for the rear but for a different application..

BTW - if you'd like to put together a crew and install your engine, Cade and I are in...

[Chris Hamilton]

I'd like to do like Chevy did with the fiero. Take a modern FWD car frontend and put it in the rear, and just fix the tie rods to a solid mount.

Imagine a honda B16 frontend in the rear of a 914? Double wishbone suspension and 160hp from 1590cc @ 8200rpms, and limited slip diffs that cost $700! The whole rig would probably cost $1500 from a civic si.

[Joe Ricard]

89 Civic hatch has some really nice suspension. Good camber control and looked to be fairly simple to cut hunks off a Civic and weld them to a 914.

Then the brakes can be infinately upgraded.

However if I was going to start cutting stuff I would look at the 3rd gen RX-7

[jimmybryan]

I'd like to do like Chevy did with the fiero. Take a modern FWD car frontend and put it in the rear, and just fix the tie rods to a solid mount.

Imagine a honda B16 frontend in the rear of a 914? Double wishbone suspension and 160hp from 1590cc @ 8200rpms, and limited slip diffs that cost $700! The whole rig would probably cost $1500 from a civic si.

Something like this, perhaps?........

http://www.kimini.com/

[stewteral]

I have mulled it over. I've decided to sell the $hitbox instead.

Hey Randal:

Tim is a 914World member and has an incredible tube-frame 914-V8 in which he has built his own 5-Link rear suspension.

In order to do the same, you would need to rebuild the whole back-end of the car with a tube sub-frame to accept a new design suspension.

So the question is: do you have the shop, tools, know-how and WILL to go all the way. Once you start, there would be NO going back as you would HAVE to remove all the original 914 suspension mounting points.

For a complete discussion, I'd suggest emailing Tim: byndbad914@yahoo.com

Best of luck,

Terry

[naro914]

If you really want to do a nice 914 suspension upgrade, consider ERP's 935 front suspension, camber boxes and Fox coil overs all around. They are amazing... I have them on Papa Smurf and the handling and steering input is wonderful. Like driving a whole new car. Fully adjustable, nimble, never fights back like torsion bars do. I want to put it on Huey too one of these days...

Pics:

[Randal]

If you really want to do a nice 914 suspension upgrade, consider ERP's 935 front suspension, camber boxes and Fox coil overs all around. They are amazing... I have them on Papa Smurf and the handling and steering input is wonderful. Like driving a whole new car. Fully adjustable, nimble, never fights back like torsion bars do. I want to put it on Huey too one of these days...

Pics:

Amazing.

What kind of investment is that package?

[Chris Hamilton]

Bob, that suspension system on your car looks very nice. Those really look like fantastic pieces.

It is not however a modern suspension system like we are talking about here. I don't see anywhere in the car that the actual suspension geometry has been changed beyond what can be done with basic upgrades on a 914. The trailing arm shape and pivot points are still in the stock locations, and the front A-arms and struts appear to be basically the same geometry also.

The main thing that I'd like to change on my 914 is the curve described by the rear trailing arms as they move on their pivot, and your car doesn't seem to have addressed that point.

[naro914]

Bob, that suspension system on your car looks very nice. Those really look like fantastic pieces.

It is not however a modern suspension system like we are talking about here. I don't see anywhere in the car that the actual suspension geometry has been changed beyond what can be done with basic upgrades on a 914. The trailing arm shape and pivot points are still in the stock locations, and the front A-arms and struts appear to be basically the same geometry also.

The main thing that I'd like to change on my 914 is the curve described by the rear trailing arms as they move on their pivot, and your car doesn't seem to have addressed that point.

Chris,
You are correct, in fact that only changes in the rear are putting the remote resevoir shocks instead of standard - and much stiffer springs. The big changes are in the front. the geometry can be changed pretty substantially in the front since all the components are very adjustable. We can dial in just about any camber, and any ride height we want, and it handles great. Plus with the coil over set up, we can now easily adjust spring rates too. I noted it above, but one thing I was really surprised with was the steering input changes. With the old system, I had a very hard time turning the wheel when pushing it in and around the garage - 11" wide slicks will do that. Now, I can reach in the window and turn the wheel with one hand, very easily. It almost feels like the car has power steering.

Little story: Nadine and I decided to put the suspension on. I told her the car would run better on the track. So we did. She never asked how much it all costs, until we were heading home after our first track weekend and she said "OK, I love the suspension, feels great. So....how much did it cost?" I said "well, uhh...." she interupted me and said " did it cost a months salary" I said "no, not at all", and she then said "Great, then it was worth it!"

Gotta love a girl that understands the value of money.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

Just curious, what do you hope to gain with the upgrade? Knowing the way a Boxster suspension is, I'm not sure I can see how it could fit?