H4 conversion - good deal? |
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H4 conversion - good deal? |
Cevan |
Feb 9 2010, 01:28 PM
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#1
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,079 Joined: 11-December 06 From: Western Massachusetts Member No.: 7,351 |
Bus Depot has the H4 bulbs and housings for about $53 total. These are the E-code housing which are approved for motorcycles. Any reason these won't work fine on our cars, apart from the "approved for motorcycle use" issue?
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underthetire |
Feb 9 2010, 01:32 PM
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#2
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,062 Joined: 7-October 08 From: Brentwood Member No.: 9,623 Region Association: Northern California |
Bus Depot has the H4 bulbs and housings for about $53 total. These are the E-code housing which are approved for motorcycles. Any reason these won't work fine on our cars, apart from the "approved for motorcycle use" issue? Got mine on EBAY for about 25, DOT approved. |
dr914@autoatlanta.com |
Feb 9 2010, 01:33 PM
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#3
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 7,840 Joined: 3-January 07 From: atlanta georgia Member No.: 7,418 Region Association: None |
Bus Depot has the H4 bulbs and housings for about $53 total. These are the E-code housing which are approved for motorcycles. Any reason these won't work fine on our cars, apart from the "approved for motorcycle use" issue? depends on the brand. Most are made now in India and can be had for about 30 a set including bulbs. |
Shade Tree |
Feb 9 2010, 02:11 PM
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 260 Joined: 18-December 08 From: Springfield, Oregon Member No.: 9,860 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
A local VW shop sells the Empi's for $14.99 with bulbs. They're pretty nice.
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RiqueMar |
Feb 9 2010, 02:36 PM
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#5
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Enrique Allen Mar Group: Members Posts: 2,169 Joined: 28-August 08 From: San Diego, CA Member No.: 9,478 Region Association: Southern California |
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Cevan |
Feb 9 2010, 03:56 PM
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#6
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,079 Joined: 11-December 06 From: Western Massachusetts Member No.: 7,351 |
These are Bosch housings (made in Sweden) and Flosser bulbs (made in Germany).
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underthetire |
Feb 9 2010, 04:06 PM
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#7
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,062 Joined: 7-October 08 From: Brentwood Member No.: 9,623 Region Association: Northern California |
Then I would go for it. The cheaper ones really are not fantastic IMO. My pilot driving lights put out much more than my H4's do. Best 30 bucks i spent on those.
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flat4tom |
Feb 9 2010, 04:15 PM
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 51 Joined: 6-January 10 From: Shingletown CA Member No.: 11,207 Region Association: Northern California |
Then I would go for it. The cheaper ones really are not fantastic IMO. My pilot driving lights put out much more than my H4's do. Best 30 bucks i spent on those. $30.00 for Pilot driving lights...? Do they fit in the fog light position in the bumper? I was considering replacing my cracked stock fog lights with a set from Camp914 but they are 70.00, not 30.00. Inquiring minds would like to know... Thx Tom |
914Sixer |
Feb 9 2010, 04:38 PM
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#9
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 8,877 Joined: 17-January 05 From: San Angelo Texas Member No.: 3,457 Region Association: Southwest Region |
One thing to consider using H4 is the fact that they hang upside down when stored. The bulb is not sealed and the rubber seal that goes around the bulb has been know to leak. The other factor is that the seal fries under the metal of the headlight cover. I prefer Halogen Sealbeam because they work just as good and are available most places. With higher than stock watt bulbs (100W) you may or may not need a relay to keep wiring temp down.
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underthetire |
Feb 9 2010, 04:51 PM
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#10
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,062 Joined: 7-October 08 From: Brentwood Member No.: 9,623 Region Association: Northern California |
Then I would go for it. The cheaper ones really are not fantastic IMO. My pilot driving lights put out much more than my H4's do. Best 30 bucks i spent on those. $30.00 for Pilot driving lights...? Do they fit in the fog light position in the bumper? I was considering replacing my cracked stock fog lights with a set from Camp914 but they are 70.00, not 30.00. Inquiring minds would like to know... Thx Tom Yes you can PM me for where to buy. I don't like ousting member vendors here. Camp 914 is a great place to have available to us. Attached image(s) |
Cano |
Feb 9 2010, 07:13 PM
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 110 Joined: 29-September 04 From: Goshen, KY Member No.: 2,854 Region Association: None |
IIRC, the Camp kit also includes custom brackets that fit the pilot lights better. You can use the stock brackets, but the pilots will look a little low and too recessed.
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underthetire |
Feb 9 2010, 07:36 PM
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#12
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 5,062 Joined: 7-October 08 From: Brentwood Member No.: 9,623 Region Association: Northern California |
Last time I looked they didn't come with the custom brakets, could be wrong. Craig?? If they do, it would be worth the extra for those that don't have sheetmetal equipment.
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eg914 |
Feb 10 2010, 12:26 AM
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 319 Joined: 17-June 04 From: Elk Grove, CA Member No.: 2,223 Region Association: None |
I have had a set of Hella H4 headlights in my daily driver for several years now. I have never had a problem with water getting into them, and am not afraid to drive in the rain. They put out a great light pattern, very big improvement over DOT sealed beam type lights.
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busdepot |
Feb 10 2010, 09:02 AM
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#14
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 1 Joined: 10-February 10 From: Pennsylvania Member No.: 11,343 Region Association: None |
QUOTE Got mine on EBAY for about 25, DOT approved. I thought I'd jump in here and clear up a couple of misconceptions/misinformation... No H4 headlight is DOT approved for car use in the United States. The closest you can get is DOT approval for motorcycle use, and even that is rare. The U.S. DOT in its infinite wisdom decided not to approve H4's for cars but decided they were fine on motorcycles, meaning that the identical headlight can be DOT approved on a motorcycle and not on a car. An exception is certain H4 lookalikes, such as the Hella Vision Plus. These actually use lower output HB2 bulbs, and are widely considered to be inferior to actual H4's despite their relatively high price. However, they are still markedly better than sealed-beams, and if you want 100% DOT approval they are your best/only bet. ECE is the European equivalent of DOT approval, and ECE certified headlights (widely referred to as E-code) meet those stringent standards and are street-legal in most of Europe. (Also in Canada, which recognizes ECE standards.) Most low end H4's are neither E-code nor DOT motorcycle approved, and as a result the performance varies tremendously. Higher end models are often E-code but typically not DOT approved for motorcycles (if only because the manufacturer didn't bother to get approval). The Bosch's are an exception that meets both standards, because Bosch has a U.S. customer (Harley-Davidson) who required DOT certification. (In fact that is the only reason why this deal on the Bosch's exists to begin with - Harley sales slumped, leaving Bosch with an excess of the DOT approved H4's, which we bought for way below cost.) There can be HUGE quality differences between H4 headlights. At the low-end of the market are the $25 Ebay specials - Chinese or Indian made generics that are rarely E-code or DOT motorcycle approved (or if labeled as such may be counterfeit). Even these will tend to be better than the stock sealed-beams (which isn't saying much), but compared to better H4's you do get what you pay for. The fluting is of poor quality and design, so you may blind other drivers. (In some cases, they are made for Indian or British market right-hand-drive vehicles, so the fluting is completely backwards and you are illuminating pedestrians more than the road.) Also the quality control is often poor, resulting in leakage, loose fit, etc. At the high end of the market are the well-regarded lighting specialists, notably Hella, Bosch, and Valeo (aka Cibie), who are actually OEM suppliers to the car companies. These are carefully engineered headlamps with excellent quality control, and are basically the standard by which the others are judged. Opinions may differ on which of these is best but it's hard to go wrong with any of them. In between you have Chinese and Indian H4's, all from a few factories but marketed under a variety of brand names, that run the gamut. Those factories will build to spec, so one may be utter garbage while another from the same factory may be ECE certified and actually pretty decent (even if not quite up to German standards). The problem is knowing which you're getting. Price can be an indicator (if you're paying $25 or $30 for a pair of headlights you shouldn't expect much), but I have also seen some companies rebrand the same $30 cheapos and sell them for $50 or $60 in a nicer box. You can find a very good write-up here that reviews the Bosch's in particular, but also has a lot of useful info about H4's. - Ron Salmon The Bus Depot www.busdepot.com |
type47fan |
Feb 10 2010, 09:17 AM
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#15
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It Looks Better In Person. . . Group: Members Posts: 860 Joined: 17-September 03 From: Carlsbad, CA Member No.: 1,170 Region Association: Southern California |
Great information, Ron. Thanks!
My current Garage Queen . . . . Attached image(s) |
kconway |
Feb 10 2010, 09:35 AM
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#16
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,347 Joined: 6-December 04 From: Monrovia, CA Member No.: 3,231 Region Association: Southern California |
Looking at the Bus Depot page, there are 2 or 3 dozen parts, which fits the 914 application? Type 2 (lots of years), Ghia, Rabbits, SB, Thing, Type 1, Type 3 and vanagon.
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mepstein |
Feb 10 2010, 10:18 AM
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#17
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914-6 GT in waiting Group: Members Posts: 19,258 Joined: 19-September 09 From: Landenberg, PA/Wilmington, DE Member No.: 10,825 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region |
QUOTE Got mine on EBAY for about 25, DOT approved. I thought I'd jump in here and clear up a couple of misconceptions/misinformation... No H4 headlight is DOT approved for car use in the United States. The closest you can get is DOT approval for motorcycle use, and even that is rare. The U.S. DOT in its infinite wisdom decided not to approve H4's for cars but decided they were fine on motorcycles, meaning that the identical headlight can be DOT approved on a motorcycle and not on a car. An exception is certain H4 lookalikes, such as the Hella Vision Plus. These actually use lower output HB2 bulbs, and are widely considered to be inferior to actual H4's despite their relatively high price. However, they are still markedly better than sealed-beams, and if you want 100% DOT approval they are your best/only bet. ECE is the European equivalent of DOT approval, and ECE certified headlights (widely referred to as E-code) meet those stringent standards and are street-legal in most of Europe. (Also in Canada, which recognizes ECE standards.) Most low end H4's are neither E-code nor DOT motorcycle approved, and as a result the performance varies tremendously. Higher end models are often E-code but typically not DOT approved for motorcycles (if only because the manufacturer didn't bother to get approval). The Bosch's are an exception that meets both standards, because Bosch has a U.S. customer (Harley-Davidson) who required DOT certification. (In fact that is the only reason why this deal on the Bosch's exists to begin with - Harley sales slumped, leaving Bosch with an excess of the DOT approved H4's, which we bought for way below cost.) There can be HUGE quality differences between H4 headlights. At the low-end of the market are the $25 Ebay specials - Chinese or Indian made generics that are rarely E-code or DOT motorcycle approved (or if labeled as such may be counterfeit). Even these will tend to be better than the stock sealed-beams (which isn't saying much), but compared to better H4's you do get what you pay for. The fluting is of poor quality and design, so you may blind other drivers. (In some cases, they are made for Indian or British market right-hand-drive vehicles, so the fluting is completely backwards and you are illuminating pedestrians more than the road.) Also the quality control is often poor, resulting in leakage, loose fit, etc. At the high end of the market are the well-regarded lighting specialists, notably Hella, Bosch, and Valeo (aka Cibie), who are actually OEM suppliers to the car companies. These are carefully engineered headlamps with excellent quality control, and are basically the standard by which the others are judged. Opinions may differ on which of these is best but it's hard to go wrong with any of them. In between you have Chinese and Indian H4's, all from a few factories but marketed under a variety of brand names, that run the gamut. Those factories will build to spec, so one may be utter garbage while another from the same factory may be ECE certified and actually pretty decent (even if not quite up to German standards). The problem is knowing which you're getting. Price can be an indicator (if you're paying $25 or $30 for a pair of headlights you shouldn't expect much), but I have also seen some companies rebrand the same $30 cheapos and sell them for $50 or $60 in a nicer box. You can find a very good write-up here that reviews the Bosch's in particular, but also has a lot of useful info about H4's. - Ron Salmon The Bus Depot www.busdepot.com Great explaination. I just ordered a set from you. Mark |
StratPlayer |
Feb 10 2010, 10:36 AM
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#18
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StratPlayer Group: Members Posts: 3,278 Joined: 27-December 02 From: SLC, Utah Member No.: 27 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Great read,,,,BTW BusDepot (IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)
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Katmanken |
Feb 10 2010, 01:09 PM
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#19
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You haven't seen me if anybody asks... Group: Members Posts: 4,738 Joined: 14-June 03 From: USA Member No.: 819 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Hey Ron,
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png) Glad you could make it. Great parts, great service. I still have the Vanagon with a bunch of your parts, and send people your way now and again. That was quite the Vanagon rubber hose kit. Still can't beleive how many different hoses are in that thing. Ken |
charliew |
Feb 10 2010, 01:39 PM
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#20
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,363 Joined: 31-July 07 From: Crawford, TX. Member No.: 7,958 |
I'll try the bosch h4 also thanks for explaining. Opps forgot to add the bulbs also. Great prices. Also great explanation on the site.
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