Fuel Lines and Pumps, what'll fit? lots of ??'s Options

[3liter914-6]

Hi folks, I apologize in advance for some of the questions being ones I could figure out just by looking under my car, but I'm out of town for a few days to help a sick friend out, and want to get some parts ordered up because I want to get this together in time to drive it to Hershey.

I posted a while back asking about the fittings on the 914 gas tank, and got some good answers. Based on that thread, I was originally going to go with -8 fittings welded to outlet and return ports on the tank, but am now reconsidering this as
A. I can't find anyone to weld on a gastank, and don't really want to do it myself.
and
B. -8 fittings might be a little overkill. Google says that -6 is good up to at least 350hp.

What I was thinking of doing now is taking the stock nuts that hold the fuel pipes in place on the tank, cutting the holes a little bigger, sticking -6 male connectors through and welding them up. I think this should work and wouldn't pose any danger, but anyone who sees a fallacy in my thinking, please pipe up.

Ok, so now I'd have -6 connectors, will I be able to just run some hose back through the firewall. I was thinking of connecting the old hose up to the new one, duct taping it together use the old line to pull the new line through. I know the old line is a little smaller (AN -6 is ~3/8" size), but will the -6 still fit through or am I going to have to enlarge some holes. I can access the fuel lines through the cover in the pass compartment, right? I'd like to use bulkhead fittings, but can't think of a way to do it without cutting up the car, is it doable?

Ok, next round of questions, fuel pumps. I bought my SDS setup from a guy who was going to install it on his turbo VR6, so for the price it came with the mother of all fuel pumps.
(IMG:http://www.capa.com.au/pics/sx_sidepump.gif)
It's good for 700+hp. -10 inlet and outlet, etc etc. Overkill to the extreme. It's nice, but doesn't really fit with my needs, and I think I can throw it on ebay get another pump and come out ahead. The question is, what pump? I found one that looks nice, MSD2225 (IMG:http://www.msdignition.com/fuel/2225_big.jpg)
43 gph@40psi $99, but as you can see it has nipples for the inlet and outlet. It seems like the only aftermarket FI pumps that have AN fittings are like the one I alread have--huge and expensive. I've done all sorts of searches and looked a bunches of OE Bosch pumps etc, but haven't found one that seems usable given that I need to be at -6 for the TB fuel rails.


So to briefly recap the important questions,

Will -6 slip through the holes already in the firewall?

Is there a way to use a firewall/bulkead adapter without slicing the car up?

Is there a fuel pump that has threaded fittings that are AN or NPT, or is there a safe way to get from a nipple to AN?

Oh yeah, and I guess if anyone knows about how much I'll need to get from the tank back to the fuel pump, that'd be nice too.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Thanks for your help, anybody who reads through this whole thread deserves a beer so if you see me at Hershey (and I hope you will), lemme know and I'll get ya a tasty beverage of your choice.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif)

thanks!

Adam

[ArtechnikA]

Is there a fuel fump that has threaded fittings that are AN or NPT, or is there a safe way to get from a nipple to AN?

Thanks for your help, anybody who reads through this whole thread deserves a beer so if you see me at Hershey (and I hope you will), lemme know and I'll get ya a tasty beverage of your choice.

sorry i can't answer many of your questions...

a -proper- hose clamp (such as one of the Earl's or Russel clamps that have the tricko "hose end" shroud on them will do nicely. people get into troublw with hose clamps because they try to use them on straight fittings with no barb.

i agree, threaded junctions are much nicer - but unless you're racing at the very top levels, they aren't *required*.

drop by the ArtechnikA spaces at Hershey, the tasty beverage of my choice would be a bottle of EKU 28, but at Hershey, i'm rarely very picky ...

[ein 6er]

adam,

have you seen this? http://www.jwesteng.com/fuel.htm

there was someone else on here, i think, that welded AN fittings to their tank and posted pics.

i missed your other thread, i'm guessing this is for the 3.0 with cis? can you not use the stock 3.0 pump and filter? check
summit for holley pumps and filters.

although i haven't done braided lines, i don't think there is any problem with them fitting through the stock holes. a lot of people don't approve of braided lines in the tunnel because the ss can be like a file on the cables. sorry, don't know about the bulkhead fittings.

good luck!!

doug

[3liter914-6]

Thanks for the info, Doug.
Wow, no I hadn't seen that. Hmm, $25 a piece. I think I might give my hack job a try first at that price, still nice to know that's out there if I can't get something cobbled together in time. It looks like that fuel pump is just the MSD unit I posted without the label. I've seen the holley and summit offerings, but most of it's designed for carbs or $3-400 and built for 1000hp like what I've got already.

I think I may have solved the fuel pump actually. I did some more searching and found out that Walbro makes an inline fuel pump. I'd only seen the in-tank units on previous searches. $130 for a 255LPH pump with 10mmX1.0 threaded inlet and outlet + $6 per AN -6 fitting. I think that's the hot ticket.

As far as the braided lines, I agree it's not a good idea. So if there isn't a bulkhead fitting solution, I'm going to run AQP's socketless hose
(IMG:http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/aer-fcn0615.jpg).
I've got 1 foot of -6 through -10 hose at home that I bought to check on how well it would fit through the tunnel , and it looks like pretty good stuff. Rated up to 250psi, so I think it should do the job.

Oh yeah, it's a 3.0 no mo'. I rebuilt it about 3 years ago right before I had to ship off to Japan. It's now a 3.3 and has been sitting in my garage just waiting for me to get around to installing these:
(IMG:http://iesforums.org/cool.jpg)

mated with this:

(IMG:http://www.sdsefi.com/web6f.jpg)

[campbellcj]

Adam, another option for the tunnel fuel lines is aluminum tubing. That's my plan, with AN-6 tube fittings on each end. I have already done the engine compartment end and will do the tank and tunnel in the next couple weekends, hopefully.

I have sourced most of the hardware for my car from Pegasus and Jegs. Summit, Behrents and Hoerr have much the same stuff. Prices do vary, a bit.

If you check the catalogs, you can find any kind of adapter, fitting or bulkhead pass-thru imaginable. Pegasus focuses on English (Formula Ford) hardware but has even started carrying some Porsche-specific, and metric plumbing fittings lately.

I may have missed what kind of induction you're running, but if it's carbs then those mega dragrace pumps may be trouble...massive pressure and flow compared to the modest needs of your typical carbed 914...

[jridder]

I posted pictures of my installation of 3/8" aluminum line with AN fittings. I welded an AN-8 bung on the tank outlet and an AN-6 for the return. It's easy to weld them on the tank if you fill the tank with water first.

>if anyone knows about how much I'll need to get from the tank back to the fuel pump

Are you planning on putting the pump in the engine compartment? The closer to the tank the better the pump will work. My Holley pump, while it works OK, is so prone to cavitation that I had to remount it even lower and closer to the tank outlet than I first did.

Jonathan