Elden MK.10 Formula Ford, Resto/rebuild thread Options

[oldschool]

All formula fords use a Hewland mk.9 built on a vw transmission case flipped upside down. The vw case ismachined to accept the hewland internals.

The side covers are hewland parts as well, and are cast with bosses for inboard brakes and for transmission mounts to the chassis. Most of the older formula ford run inboard brakes from what i can gather.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) Dude...are you going to have time for my ride (IMG:style_emoticons/default/lol-2.gif) .That is some sweet Project man. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[eric9144]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

['73-914kid]

I think we can find some free time to work on your 914 Jaime...haha (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)


As of today, I've removed all the rivets, and drilled out the rivet body. The plan right now for the rivet holes is to weld the rivet holes on the floor pan, and the holes forward of steering box.

Eldens never originally came with aluminum side paneling, so this stuff was all an afterthought, and just a lot of weight. I think for safety reasons, we're going to re-fit new aluminum skin on the side from the bulkhead forward to the steering box, right along sides of the driver's torso as an anti-intrusion panel. Honestly though, there's fiberglass on the side of the car, and the triangulation seems small enough to prevent much from entering the car as it is. It's something for my dad and I to discuss I suppose.

The other problem we face is somehow removing the rivet bodies from inside the tubes. The skin has been installed and removed twice as of now, so theres a TON of rivet bodies stuck in the chassis. I'm thinking of just cutting a square out of a part of the chassis on both sides and emptying everything the best I can. Then I'll just TIG a cover back on. This is the one really nice advantage to having square tubing.

Well, I think I'm done for today as it stands. Maybe this evening I'll start welding up the floor tubes.
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i260.photobucket.com-9714-1347827679.1.jpg)

['73-914kid]

Figured id give an update on how things were going. All of the holes have been welded, and ive started grinding them flush. I must say, trying to grind the highspots on the welds down flush to the square tubes seemlessly and without divits is quite the challenge. Pictures tomorrow of where the chassis stands. Then comes some brazing repair, and sandlbasting. Hoping to have it off to the sandblasters next friday afternoon.

[Randal]

Figured id give an update on how things were going. All of the holes have been welded, and ive started grinding them flush. I must say, trying to grind the highspots on the welds down flush to the square tubes seemlessly and without divits is quite the challenge. Pictures tomorrow of where the chassis stands. Then comes some brazing repair, and sandlbasting. Hoping to have it off to the sandblasters next friday afternoon.

So what are the rules on where to tig and where to braze?

['73-914kid]

The VARA rule book doesnt explicitely state what can be welded versus what can be brazed on a pre-1981 FF. Simply because all the tube seams are already brazed, any repairs are going to be re-brazed. All the holes and cracks directly in the tubes are going to be welded.

[jd74914]

Very cool project.

Are the frames mild steel or chromoy? If you're welding holes/cracks in 4130 (or like), you'll want to anneal the HAZ or it'll crack again in short order.

Have you read Carroll Smith's books (Prepare to Win, Tune to Win, Engineer to Win)? If you haven't he has a bunch of interesting racecar prep tips including some FF-specific information. In any case, they are definitely worth a read.

['73-914kid]

The frame is just mild steel, nothing fancy about it.

My dad purchased the set of three back in the late 70's. I'm currently going through Prepare to Win in my free time in between classes. I must say, for technical as some of it is, Carroll writes things somewhat amusingly. Certainly keeps you entertained

[jd74914]

Mild steel is much easier...and encouraged by Carroll Smith. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

He definitely does have an interesting writing style; I think it makes the drier parts of his books easier to get through.

If you like those and are into technical IC engine design, his style is very similar to Gordon Blair (of Design and Simulation of 4-stroke Engine fame).

[Mugs914]

I have worn out several copies of Carrol Smiths various books. They all end up dog eared, highlighted, underlined and disinegrating! The common sense approach will never be out of date.

If you really want to get geeky about things, there is also Carrol Smith's Guide to Nuts, Bolts and Fasteners. More info than you ever wanted on the subject and, somewhat inevitably, quickly became known as "Screw to Win".

Cheers,

Mike

[dfelz]

The frame is just mild steel, nothing fancy about it.

My dad purchased the set of three back in the late 70's. I'm currently going through Prepare to Win in my free time in between classes. I must say, for technical as some of it is, Carroll writes things somewhat amusingly. Certainly keeps you entertained

Hey Ethan,

You go to Cal Poly right!? I have seen your car on campus a few times and Kyle Graves had mentioned you one or two times while we were discussing my 914 project. Would love to come check out your car(s) some time, I am right over in walnut working on my 72 914 project, so i will probably be soliciting your advice in the near future since your the only local i "know" with one.

This FF seems like a sweet project with some great rewards when finished. Keep up the good work

David

[stewteral]

I think we can find some free time to work on your 914 Jaime...haha (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)


As of today, I've removed all the rivets, and drilled out the rivet body. The plan right now for the rivet holes is to weld the rivet holes on the floor pan, and the holes forward of steering box.

Eldens never originally came with aluminum side paneling, so this stuff was all an afterthought, and just a lot of weight. I think for safety reasons, we're going to re-fit new aluminum skin on the side from the bulkhead forward to the steering box, right along sides of the driver's torso as an anti-intrusion panel. Honestly though, there's fiberglass on the side of the car, and the triangulation seems small enough to prevent much from entering the car as it is. It's something for my dad and I to discuss I suppose.

The other problem we face is somehow removing the rivet bodies from inside the tubes. The skin has been installed and removed twice as of now, so theres a TON of rivet bodies stuck in the chassis. I'm thinking of just cutting a square out of a part of the chassis on both sides and emptying everything the best I can. Then I'll just TIG a cover back on. This is the one really nice advantage to having square tubing.

Well, I think I'm done for today as it stands. Maybe this evening I'll start welding up the floor tubes.
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i260.photobucket.com-9714-1347827679.1.jpg)

'73-914kid',

Just a thought, but while you have the car down the the bare frame, Whaddya' think about adding forward bracing from your rollbar forward to the frame tubes supporting your dash hoop.

If you look at the photo I sent of my Royale, it has them. My Lotus 61 didn't have these and it felt MUCH safer in the Royale as I sit with my shoulders BELOW the bracing.

Since you're planning on REAL racing, the more safety the better! That old Lotus gave me a 6-week hospital stay!

Jus' tryin' to be helpful,
Terry

[jd74914]

Front and rear hoop braces help stiffen the car a bit too...higher bending moment of inertia.

[Paul Pfanner]

Hi, my name is Paul Pfanner

I worked for the Importer, Pacific Formula located at 711, 1est 17th Street in Costa Mesa CA, where I worked on FORMULA Magazine at the time. I saw your car when it was brand new and I helped deliver it to its first owner, who if my memory serves me, was named Ron Moreno. I also remember that this was one of the very last Mk 10s built and a special one-off variant that combined the front radiator of the Mk-10B and the side radiators from the Mk10c. This was done to address the overheating issues encountered at Riverside, Willow Springs and Phoenix during hi temp events. From you photos, I can see that this car is very original an unmolested. The frame and suspension is the correct semi-matte black and all the body pieces are correct and in great condition. I own several Mk8 and Mk 10 Eldens that are restored to original condition. You can also still get almost anything you need for the car from original sources. I've raced my Eldens in HSR and VARA and they are very nice cars to drive and maintain. I've attached some images of my cars. All the best, Paul Pfanner

Please e-mail with any questions: paul.pfanner@racer.com  EldenMk8logbook.pdf ( 343.08k ) Number of downloads: 237

['73-914kid]

Thank you very much for the brief history lesson on my car. I really don't know much about it, other than that it was the last mk10's built, with the modifications.

A few questions.. Would I be shunned for painting the frame a dark grey instead of the satin black? I feel like it would be a lot easier to see oil/fluid leaks on grey, rather than the black. I've never seen an Elden in Grey I suppose though... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Also, the path for the car currently is to completely remove the side pods/ side oil cooler/side radiator. Even if that's a rare thing on these cars, it seems like a hideous band-aid. Will I be looked down upon for not running the car with the side-pods?


So, an update is due I suppose. No pictures, but I'll post some this weekend I guess.

-The chassis has been completely sandblasted, and is currently in mockup with the engine and gearbox.

-10 AN oil lines/fittings have all been cut and fit

- Oil cooler bracket fabricated to sit on top of the rear suspension cross member, directly in the direction of laminar air flow coming back from the engine cover.

-Engine cover has been sanded, and ground down. I've removed probably 4 pounds of filler/glass and resin from It. It cracked with heat from the header, and was band-aided over and over again.

This weekend I'm planning on pulling the motor and gearbox again and taking it to the shop to re-braze some cracks in the rear parallel link mounts. After that, It's back off the sandblasters to get the chassis completely ready for paint.

Then I'm going to reseal the engine, and adjust the shift forks in the gearbox.



You guys will have to excuse the slow process. The 914 is now as done as it can be I believe, (yeah right) and being a full time Aerospace student has taken up almost all of my time to get stuff done on the car.

['73-914kid]

So I had my brother take some shitty cell phone pics of the car. You'll have to excuse the buffing compound splatter...we cut and buffed my brother truck, and well, it made a mess.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i260.photobucket.com-9714-1359077350.1.jpg)
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/i260.photobucket.com-9714-1359077350.2.jpg)

[oldschool]

Thank you very much for the brief history lesson on my car. I really don't know much about it, other than that it was the last mk10's built, with the modifications.

A few questions.. Would I be shunned for painting the frame a dark grey instead of the satin black? I feel like it would be a lot easier to see oil/fluid leaks on grey, rather than the black. I've never seen an Elden in Grey I suppose though... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Also, the path for the car currently is to completely remove the side pods/ side oil cooler/side radiator. Even if that's a rare thing on these cars, it seems like a hideous band-aid. Will I be looked down upon for not running the car with the side-pods?


So, an update is due I suppose. No pictures, but I'll post some this weekend I guess.

-The chassis has been completely sandblasted, and is currently in mockup with the engine and gearbox.

-10 AN oil lines/fittings have all been cut and fit

- Oil cooler bracket fabricated to sit on top of the rear suspension cross member, directly in the direction of laminar air flow coming back from the engine cover.

-Engine cover has been sanded, and ground down. I've removed probably 4 pounds of filler/glass and resin from It. It cracked with heat from the header, and was band-aided over and over again.

This weekend I'm planning on pulling the motor and gearbox again and taking it to the shop to re-braze some cracks in the rear parallel link mounts. After that, It's back off the sandblasters to get the chassis completely ready for paint.

Then I'm going to reseal the engine, and adjust the shift forks in the gearbox.



You guys will have to excuse the slow process. The 914 is now as done as it can be I believe, (yeah right) and being a full time Aerospace student has taken up almost all of my time to get stuff done on the car.

kid do you have time for taco's (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chowtime.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

['73-914kid]

Maybe...depends what day

[oldschool]

When we both have time.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

[TC Johnson]

How about an update? With pictures of course.

Tom