SIX mount question, Patrick Moly Bar Options

[sixnotfour]

Yeah , I have a brand new one still in the box,never opened . I took in trade , For parts, I thought about calling Patrick to see if I could trade up. WTF am I going to do with it now!!!!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)

I,ll call him and see. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Kerrys914]

Keep us posted...

Is there a limit on engine size and the bars use? I mean will a 2.0, 2.2, 2.4, 2.7 have enough HP to really tweak these bars?

Given the options costs out there for engine mounts the bar seems like a good option for a smaller six engine conversion. Granted if you decide to go bigger you have to deal with this issue but for a smaller six???

Cheers

[siverson]

> When I talked to Jim he said not to use the original mount as it was a design to try to make the six conversion an easy bolt in and it was just too flexible and would fail.

When I talked to them he said he wouldn't do anything, and couldn't offer credit towards a new redesigned bar or anything. That's pretty poor after spending $3k+ there. Maybe I just caught them at a bad time when cash was tight or something, but regardless, I haven't made a purchase there since.

> sixnotfour:
> I,ll call him and see.

I am interested to hear if he's changed his policy. Actually, no I'm not - there are plenty of other places to buy better parts.

-Steve

[Britain Smith]

You should use the WEVO engine mounts.  I have some nice SPORT mounts around here somewhere.

I respectfully disagree. Solid mounts transmit loads of vibrations. Richard Parr the PMO guy has posted a detailed dissertation in some of his advertising that says it's not a good idea for a engine with carbs. If it was a race car, maybe.

The WEVO mounts are not solid mounts. They are semi-solid and just a step above the sport mounts. Here is what is listed on their website...

The WEVO SS Engine Mount is designed to offer virtually the same locating advantages of a solid engine mount – without the metal to metal contact between the chassis and the engine.

The SS Engine Mount comprises of 5 components. The design of the components ensures that at rest, or idle, the engine is firmly located, but free to vibrate against the elastomeric pillows isolating the engine mount inner and outer components. When the engine reacts to torque, the components deflect slightly and the spring rate of the isolators is progressively increased, improving the location of the engine and transmission under more stressful conditions. The design is such that metal to metal contact is always avoided, so potentially harmful misalignment forces and vibrations are managed in a manner more similar to the original factory rubber mounts.

The SS Engine Mounts are installed using the original hardware and have a gold anodized finish similar in appearance to the gold zinc plated factory parts.

The SS Engine Mount is an upgrade suited to cars used for spirited road driving all the way through full race cars.

Testing on road and track cars has shown a significant reduction in vibration transmitted versus solid mounts, without reduction in chassis performance, or gear selection accuracy.

Owners of cars with Weber or PMO carburetors will be pleased to know that development of this product was encouraged by Richard Parr at PMO as a way of protecting against carburetor issues related directly to engine vibrations.

[Kerrys914]

Has there been any issues with the 8 conversion bars?

[Joe Bob]

Has there been any issues with the 8 conversion bars?

Not that I have heard or read about. Just the flimsy ill designed ones we have been discussing.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[nine14cats]

I'd say the bars have a quality control problem from the looks of it. There seems to be too many issues with the bars, especially the early ones.

In my dealings with Jim Patrick, he has been very good to me, both on the phone and in business dealings. I must be the only person he has ever replaced a bar with. When I first put my 914 together for the track a few years ago, I bought a used Patrick bar that came with the core engine I bought. At the start of the project, I put the car all together and after a trip around the neighborhood I did notice a sag. The bar had cracked as in the pictures above.

I called Jim and talked to him about it. As I had bought the other parts of my conversion from him, he asked me to send a digital pic of the broken bar. After a few days he called me and offered to replace the bar with a new one. I took him up on it and actually sourced a second new bar from someone who had decided to give up on their project. I wanted the backup bar for the track.

I still have a wall mount PMS bar that I'm selling with my old race car, my new car has an AJ mount in it. Trekkor bought the "new" crossbar mount from me. It's only a year old.

Jim Patrick told me that the older designs of the bar had issues with the cracking but the new designs did not and were good for track use in cars with 3.2 liter motors and below (even for track). He recommended against me using the crossbar mount for my 3.6 liter project as he said that the torque from the larger displacement motors would fatigue the bar. He said a street application would be fine, but track only cars stress the components much more and he felt his bulkhead mount or the AJ mount was better for racing.

My motor was a 2.8L 10.5:1 compression race motor. I drove the car hard. I did not have any issues with the new crossbar mount.

For me, I've had nothing but good dealings with PMS.

Trekkor, as your motor is a smaller displacement motor, I think you'll be fine. Maybe give Jim Patrick a call.

Thanks,

Bill P.

[Kerrys914]

I called James about this and some other Q's. He said the bar has gone through 3 different designs/materials. Their were some failures of the first two designs but the latest design is much stronger.

James was very nice to deal with and didn't seem to be bothered by my 101 questions.

Cheers

[Root_Werks]

Has there been any issues with the 8 conversion bars?

Not that I have heard or read about. Just the flimsy ill designed ones we have been discussing.... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) How do you really feel Mike?

[pete-stevers]

How do I get a hold of a Rich Jonhson mount, any available pics of his particular design, are his mounts tough enough to hold a 3.0 (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/idea.gif)
steve

[Dave_Darling]

Email him and he can tell you how much and when and where. Or check with Pelican's site, our "sport mount" is either his kit or a very close facsimile.

--DD