trans, 1st gear Options

[cpavlenko]

Well today I can shift into all gears but first???? when I push clutch in to go to first, and let out clutch , grind (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) Cable is fine, all the shifting bushing are only a year old. I'm really pissed, cause the trans was rebuilt with new synchros , all new first gear slider and stuff for the first gear.Cost me two grand a year ago at Arizona trans axle. I'm real easy on the shifting, and always come to a stop before going to 1st. Most of the time 5 miles or less when down shifting to first. I'm assuming that if I can shift into reverse and 2 threw 5th gear, my shifting adjustment must be OK. I'm not a happy camper. What to do.

[stugray]

I think you need to explain a little better.

You manage to get it completely in gear and then as you let the clutch out, it pops OUT and grinds?

If it just grinds as you begin to let out the clutch, then it is not all the way in gear. That might just mean a linkage adjustment.

Tail shift, or side shift?
Did you put in a new bushing in the trans end?
If you put the bushing in backwards on a side shift, it will go into all gears (sort of) but pops out of first.

[cpavlenko]

It's a tail shift, and yes it begins to grind when i let the clutch out. and yes, it's not all the way in gear. I hope this explains it better. Also, if it goes in all other gears, wouldn't it be adjusted correctly or am I missing something on shift adjustment. What do I look for at trans end bushing.

[stugray]

The tail shift has three identical bushings in the linkage system.
The third one is at the tranny end and you can see it if you take the square dust cover off.

While you are checking the bushings, one check you can do is disconnect the linkage and put the car in 1st at the tranny.
Then try to get it moving in 1st. If it works fine, then the linkage is the problem.

If it wont go in or pops out of gear, then the trans is suspect.
If you replaced the 1st gear slider, dogteeth and synchros with new, then it might be the pinion shaft gear has broken.
This allows the pinion shaft to move wrt to the layshaft and then all kinds of nasty things can happen.

[Dr Evil]

Not the pinion, the input shaft is what breaks and allows any function. I am suspecting the 1st gear assembly. Most likely a block in the synchro band or another part of the synchro package has failed. IF you can shift it with clutch in then it is the torque that is causing your failure. So, the parts that hold fast under torque are suspect: Band and two blocks. Hardly likely it would be good and then immediately turn to crap if it were the synchro band, slider, or dog teeth.

Do you grind going into reverse at all? Does revers work? If R works, then your input shaft is fine.

Sounds like you need to pull the tail cone. Pulling first and fixing it is not hard and I (we) can walk you through it.

[stugray]

Not the pinion, the input shaft is what breaks and allows any function.

Sorry, I completely screwed up that sentence.

I meant the Pinion shaft bearing, not gear (the one you just helped me replace in my side-shift).
If that bearing breaks, the trans can do strange things while pretending to still be working....

[r_towle]

Did you have a warrantee on the work that was done last time?

[Dr Evil]

Not the pinion, the input shaft is what breaks and allows any function.

Sorry, I completely screwed up that sentence.

I meant the Pinion shaft bearing, not gear (the one you just helped me replace in my side-shift).
If that bearing breaks, the trans can do strange things while pretending to still be working....

Ah, yes (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

BTW, for the OP, if parts end up being shite and this turns south with your builder, I would be happy to give you free labor to fix this if it needs that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[r_towle]

Before you get to far down the road on this, consider what Stu said and disconnect the linkage and put the car into first gear.

You may also want to check all your motor mounts and tranny mounts.
If the motor shifter forward after a large bump, or sudden stop, it changes the geometry of the shift rod...
Sometimes it's enough to make it hard to get into certain gears.

just something that happened to me once....so you may want to check the mounts.

[stugray]

just something that happened to me once....so you may want to check the mounts

Forgot about that.
Last time I took my engine out, both front mounts were broken

[Dr Evil]

Shifting it into 1st at the trans will can at least rule out EVERYTHING outside of the trans.

Shift into first at the tranz.

Start car with clutch in.

Let clutch out, what happens?
- Goes forward without issue = problem external to transmission
- Pops out again = problem inside box (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

[r_towle]

Echo

[cpavlenko]

The trans does shift in into reverse with no grinding and no problems . Also it doesn't seem to get into first gear, can't feel it getting in. I can shift threw all the gears fine , except 1st. Like I said, it doesn't feel like it's going into 1st gear. Also the trans is out of warranty.

[cpavlenko]

Thanks Dr. Evil, i'll keep that in mind, if things look bad for me. I'm just tired of these mechanics who say they know what's going on, and don't really know.

[Dr Evil]

The trans does shift in into reverse with no grinding and no problems . Also it doesn't seem to get into first gear, can't feel it getting in. I can shift threw all the gears fine , except 1st. Like I said, it doesn't feel like it's going into 1st gear. Also the trans is out of warranty.

If it is not going into 1st, that is an indication that the synchro band is expanded and keeping the slider from going one (if all was assembled correctly). This happens when your block inside your synchro band brakes or otherwise jams pushing the synchro band out. Easy fix. All of 1st is pretty easy to fix. You will need a few tools.

[cpavlenko]

I will try to put trans into 1st gear from tranny Monday or Tuesday and c what happens. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

[cpavlenko]

Forgot to mention that there's no grind when trying to get into 1st gear.

[cpavlenko]

Well here's some good news, Bill the owner of Arizona transaxle is going to take care of 1st gear issue if it's internal. Bill told me that he stands behind his work done to my trans. So Tuesday I'll b cruising 130 miles down to Phoenix. Just using 2-5th. He will b checking all shifting bushings points and adjustment to. I'll keep u posted with out come. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif)

[stugray]

I have a complete tail shift linkage from the shifter to the trans and a welmeister short shift kit, and ALL New bushings if you end up needing to replace parts

[r_towle]

Well here's some good news, Bill the owner of Arizona transaxle is going to take care of 1st gear issue if it's internal. Bill told me that he stands behind his work done to my trans. So Tuesday I'll b cruising 130 miles down to Phoenix. Just using 2-5th. He will b checking all shifting bushings points and adjustment to. I'll keep u posted with out come. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bye1.gif)

Good vendor.

Rich