Weber idf 44 leak!, Help! Options

[Milkman7286]

Hello all,
I've got a 71 4 banger with dual weber idf 44's on it and the driver's side front barrel has sprung a leak.
Here is a little detail before I go further into the leak:
The webers are about 6 years old and have about 7,000 miles on them. The car sat in storage for about 3 years but was started and driven every 6 months or so. For all I know this leak has been there all along and I never noticed, but I don't think that is the case.

The leak:
The carb is leaking gas down the front barrel on the drivers side. It appears to be coming from the progression / transition holes but it is hard to tell. The other thing I noticed is that the gasket just above the float bowl is very wet and the gasket between the carb/manifold is also a little wet. I have been dealing with this for about 2 weeks now and have read every possible thing I can find and none have solved this.

Here is what I have done so far:
-Float set at 10.5mm measuring with the gasket in place.
-Butterfly was loosened and repositioned in the bore.
-Needle and seat have been tested both with fuel and air and are good
-float is free in movement and does not hang up in the bowl
-float is still a float and does not sink
-idle circuit is free flowing and not clogged
-fuel pressure is 2.5
-float bowl gasket does not accidentally cover any holes or vents


Any ideas on this one? I feel like I have tried everything and for the life of me I can't figure it out. Last night I was watching the fuel puddle on top of the butterfly and it seemed like maybe it was coming from the seam at the float bowl gasket. Any reason why fuel would be coming from there?

As FYI:
This happens when the car is hot or cold, doesn't matter.

[rhodyguy]

can you see a dribble when the fuel pump is energized and engine not running?

[Milkman7286]

can you see a dribble when the fuel pump is energized and engine not running?

It isn't a constant dribble from what I can tell. If it is it is very hard to see. It will do it when the fuel pump is off or on, doesn't matter. It doesn't appear to do it when the motor is running but I have only spent about 5 seconds checking it with the motor on.
I can hear the carb make a gurgling noise once every 30 to 60 seconds as well.

[Mark Henry]

If it's leaking from a press in plug in the body clean and sand it good and use epoxy or JB Weld.
If it leaking/overflowing from the floats you need a good pressuure regulator. The little chrome regs are pure shit and the Holley doesn't go low enough.
Most pumps, even so called low pressure pumps are crap at maintaining low pressure these days.

Hands down best low pressure regulator is a Malpassi.

[Milkman7286]

If it's leaking from a press in plug in the body clean and sand it good and use epoxy or JB Weld.
If it leaking/overflowing from the floats you need a good pressuure regulator. The little chrome regs are pure shit and the Holley doesn't go low enough.
Most pumps, even so called low pressure pumps are crap at maintaining low pressure these days.

Hands down best low pressure regulator is a Malpassi.

It doesn't appear to be a press plug. This is leaking inside the carb and down into the motor. Could a plug cause that?

With regards to the regulator, I see a lot of people have these holley ones. I was able to get mine down below 2 psi yesterday actually. I have not seem anything above 3 psi after I set it though. I don't think 3 psi could cause this if the needle and seat are good and the float is good and the pump isn't even on.

[Mark Henry]

Leaking inside the carb is you have a fuel enrichment circuit stuck open.

It's the little lever on the side of the carb that is not used/hooked up. It may have been replaced with a plate with 2 screws.
The plungers inside one (or more) is cracked open. In fact I have tapped, plugged and permanently disabled these plungers before.

3-3.5psi is what you want.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/images.thesamba.com-26-1404233971.1.jpg)

[Milkman7286]

Leaking inside the carb is you have a fuel enrichment circuit stuck open.

It's the little lever on the side of the carb that is not used/hooked up. It may have been replaced with a plate with 2 screws.
The plungers inside one (or more) is cracked open. In fact I have tapped, plugged and permanently disabled these plungers before.

3-3.5psi is what you want.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/images.thesamba.com-26-1404233971.1.jpg)

Well...this is one area I have not checked yet. How do I go about this? Just open the side plate and clean and check everything?

Also, would this cause fuel to leak out of/onto the float bowl gasket?

[ThePaintedMan]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) With Mark.

If one of the circuits is stuck open, it can DUMP fuel into the cylinder(s) and into the engine really quick. Do not run it like that if you can avoid it.

If that is the case, the easiest way to fix it is with the carburetor off of the engine. You may get lucky and get it to unstick by actuating the lever that Mark pointed to in the diagram, but you might also end up sticking up the other enrichment valve. Again, better to pull the carb off and then remove the carb top to inspect and/or plug the circuits.

Interestingly, I have not yet seen a Weber 44 with enrichment circuits - only on 40s. If it's got the lever on the side of the carb top, it almost definitely means that the carb has the circuits though.

[Milkman7286]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) With Mark.

If one of the circuits is stuck open, it can DUMP fuel into the cylinder(s) and into the engine really quick. Do not run it like that if you can avoid it.

If that is the case, the easiest way to fix it is with the carburetor off of the engine. You may get lucky and get it to unstick by actuating the lever that Mark pointed to in the diagram, but you might also end up sticking up the other enrichment valve. Again, better to pull the carb off and then remove the carb top to inspect and/or plug the circuits.

Interestingly, I have not yet seen a Weber 44 with enrichment circuits - only on 40s. If it's got the lever on the side of the carb top, it almost definitely means that the carb has the circuits though.

Mine does not have a lever, just a little block off plate with the weber logo.
Not sure if that changes things...

[ThePaintedMan]

Mine does not have a lever, just a little block off plate with the weber logo.
Not sure if that changes things...

The only way i know to verify if the carb has patent enrichment circuits is to remove it, and the carb top. There will be two recesses behind that block off plate. Each holds a valve assembly, assuming that the carb body was drilled for them from the factory.

As Mark said, someone could have removed the lever assemblies but kept the valves in place (and put the blockoff plate in place of the lever), hoping that they would stay seated and not open. But they're only held shut by a very thin spring and often they do indeed pop open. You might have enough room to pull just the blockoff plate off and see if there are two brass valve assemblies inside that recess. But it would be easier to take the carb off again IMHO.

The float bowl gasket is in contact with fuel - it does get wet.

[ChrisFoley]

Even without the entire enrichment assembly there are spring loaded pistons inside the carb which can become dislodged, move into a stuck open position, and allow fuel to leak through that circuit.
Take off the top plate and check the pressed in washers that retain the spring/piston assy.
Also remove the side cover and make sure the pistons are in their closed position.

[Elliot Cannon]

I have had 44idf's on my car for 10 years and have had great use out of these. http://www.cbperformance.com/ProductDetail...roductCode=3193

[Milkman7286]

Even without the entire enrichment assembly there are spring loaded pistons inside the carb which can become dislodged, move into a stuck open position, and allow fuel to leak through that circuit.
Take off the top plate and check the pressed in washers that retain the spring/piston assy.
Also remove the side cover and make sure the pistons are in their closed position.

Got it, I'll take it apart this afternoon and make sure everything is working right.


On a side note:
If gas was leaking from float bowl gasket down into the barely what would that indicate?
I swear I saw a little gas run down the side of the barely and it came from that seam where the gasket is and it was on the opposite side of the float bowl (hope that makes sense)

[Milkman7286]

Barrel*....damn autocorrect

[ThePaintedMan]

Sorry, I should have been more specific. The valves/pistons inside the body that Chris is referring to are part of the entire enrichment circuit. The levers on the outside were there just to actuate the pistons to provide a function similar to a choke when the engine is cold. The problematic parts, as Chris described are the pistons and springs though.

If you are confused where they're housed, there are pictures in my carb rebuild thread:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=207017

Same applies to 40s and 44s. Though like I said, I haven't seen 44s with patent enrichment circuits yet.

The leaking from the bowl into the barrel could theoretically be from either a gasket that is pinched, or even a carb top that isn't true anymore. If you have a piece of glass you can set the carb body and the top on it to check for trueness or use a straightedge.

[Mark Henry]

If leaking/spilling over the float bowl you more likely have a a float level or fuel pressure issue

[Milkman7286]

Well,
It wasn't the choke pieces, the plungers weren't even there.

Would bad gaskets cause something like this?

[Jake Raby]

How new are these carbs? Do you have a pic of one of them, preferably from the float bowl side?

[Milkman7286]

How new are these carbs? Do you have a pic of one of them, preferably from the float bowl side?

Jake,
Carbs were purchased new about 6 years ago.
I don't have a photo on me but I will snap some pics for you this afternoon.

[jmill]

Would bad gaskets cause something like this?

Gaskets should be changed every time you crack the top. Fuel sloshing around in the float bowl could leak around a bad gasket or a warped top.

How new are these carbs? Do you have a pic of one of them, preferably from the float bowl side?

You thinking inferior casting?