 Thoughts on Installing Steel Flares, Epoxy or Weld? |
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| DuckRyder |
 Feb 1 2005, 03:01 PM
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#41
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Avatars Mode: OFF because of the recalcitrant few.  Group: Benefactors Posts: 767 Joined: 8-January 03 From: Georgia Member No.: 110   |
My 323i was an 80, although most states consider it an 81. It was built 10/80 and carried a VIN that identifies it as an 81 the US 10th digit system. The HTK identifies it as an 80. The European system of titling and registering apparently has some quirks, it was even suggested that they are titled as year sold over there. Any way, I strongly advise ordering parts by VIN or build date vs. titled year.
If you have not already joined the E-21 digest Yahoo Group I highly recommend it, it is like 914Club for E21's (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smilie_pokal.gif) Does not have some of the nice features as a BBS (Since it’s primarily an E-Mail list) but the knowledge is just as great.
Some of the guys use taildragger Fuel distributors on the E21 323i. Jack over there posted the specifics not long ago. I believe I would go with the 325i Motronic on my next one though. I forget the particulars but there is one control unit that is V1.3 vs. 1.1 and has some adaptive qualities. It is a good one to look for. HTH |
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| John Kelly |
Feb 1 2005, 03:55 PM
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#42
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 692 Joined: 1-May 03 From: Moclips WA. Member No.: 640 |
My concern would be the same as Ed's... the panel cosmetics down the road. Strength of epoxied or welded panels should not be the issue. There is no need for anything stronger than a good weld. With any stiffener (improper weld or an epoxy joint) there may be issues of crumple zone effectiveness...making a panel that is supposed to absorb energy in a crash tranfer energy instead....or a area that bends and fails (rips) because it is too stiff.
John www.ghiaspecialties.com |
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| Series9 |
Feb 1 2005, 04:36 PM
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#43
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Lesbians taste like chicken. Group: Members Posts: 5,444 Joined: 22-August 04 From: DeLand, FL Member No.: 2,602 Region Association: South East States |
I thinks you guys have all been (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smoke.gif) .
Just get out the welder and (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/welder.gif) . Jeeze... |
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| SpecialK |
Feb 1 2005, 05:03 PM
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#44
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aircraft surgeon Group: Benefactors Posts: 3,211 Joined: 15-March 04 From: Pacific, MO Member No.: 1,797 |
I knew you were going to say that! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) |
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| jwalters |
Feb 1 2005, 05:46 PM
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#45
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Sooo Close....... Group: Members Posts: 1,677 Joined: 14-May 04 From: Huntsville, AL Member No.: 2,068 Region Association: Europe |
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif) I would say that I have to agree with both methods---
Case in point is the fact of crash repair--- A welded joint would be very easy to cut and replace w/o losing much material-- With the bond, most of these epoxies do not adhere to old glue in the same manner as glue on virgin steel, but not allot of time to remove the glue with a grinder--it is just getting the pieces apart to do so. With the proper stuctural epoxy and application method there is NO worry about fatigue strength--that car will never ever flex enough to cause the seams to disintegrate-- Being an aerospace worker--I can attest to this fact. One small example : The Grumman line of light single and light twin aircraft are almost wholly glued together--and these are 30+ yrs old with nil adverse affects--Flight environment aside--it is the landings that these things give credo to--the average training landing has an acceleration of 2.3 G's---plus factor in the number of cycles this has happened, say, close to 500,000+ fleet wide!!! I myself am using fiberglass flares--being as I live in south Florida, and the odds of someone hitting me with thier car is exponentially high--I decided to not bond the flares on, and instead are screwing them on with a coat of filler over the seam for smoothness---there is just to much chance that sometime in the next 2 yrs I will have to pull one or more off for body repair-- (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad.gif) Both methods are very good--just look down the road and take the path that will give you your most bang for the buck--- |
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| redshift |
Feb 1 2005, 05:51 PM
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#46
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Bless the Hell out of you! Group: Members Posts: 10,926 Joined: 29-June 03 Member No.: 869 |
I have SEEN IT DONE! There are some pics from about... 2 years ago over on Pelican. M |
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| redshift |
Feb 1 2005, 05:53 PM
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#47
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Bless the Hell out of you! Group: Members Posts: 10,926 Joined: 29-June 03 Member No.: 869 |
If you are in a wreck that you would hope crumple zones would save you... in a 914..
Nice knowing you.. M |
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| jwalters |
Feb 1 2005, 06:15 PM
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#48
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Sooo Close....... Group: Members Posts: 1,677 Joined: 14-May 04 From: Huntsville, AL Member No.: 2,068 Region Association: Europe |
A small ass 914 with or with out crumple zones is still a dicey affair----
The problem with these glues is the initial cost and the ability to properly glue the joint--there is NO margin of error to achieve advertised strength-- The hysol line of products I use are mixed by weight--if you are off by more than .2 GRAMS of catalyst or matrix the glue is worthless.. Ohh it will still bond mind you--but nowhere the strength as advertised-- These hysol ones have an exceptionally high peel strength--which would mean total destruction of a prolly fixable flare ,to remove it to fix any sheetmetal that is bent.....that is.... Also, proven by our big brother overseers--in a crash, the glue joint contributes to a crumple zone--it is bonded into one part, which gives more energy release before entering the passenger compartment--whereas a tacked joint, such is all of our sheetmetal, will pull apart and allow that crash energy to continue into the pass compartment, and in some cases it actually magnifies it-- NASA, with all its structural knowledge,ordered the space shuttle to be designed as a mostly glued together spacecraft--it is superior for its intended description, which is temp extremes and crash worthiness for survivability. But his is just a teener--I don't think he will be doing space travel soon (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif) By the way, you all seen the new Chrysler plastic car??? The entire car is made of thermoplastic and is glued together--tests have shown that the crash survivability is vastly superior to metal..... Wierd how all this stuff was proven out over 40 yrs ago and is just now getting into mainstream auto design.... |
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| Sparky |
Feb 1 2005, 07:25 PM
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#49
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Mahna Mahna! Group: Members Posts: 1,134 Joined: 21-June 03 From: Spencer, MA Member No.: 847 |
Go with what the shop your using feels comfortable and has expertise with. If your doing it yourself, well your more apt to have the correct or sufficient weding equiptment at home then bonding equiptment. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/unsure.gif)
My best, Mike D. |
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