Home  |  Forums  |  914 Info  |  Blogs
 
914World.com - The fastest growing online 914 community!
 
Porsche, and the Porsche crest are registered trademarks of Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche AG. This site is not affiliated with Porsche in any way.
Its only purpose is to provide an online forum for car enthusiasts. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners.
 

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

2 Pages V  1 2 >  
 Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Factory 2.0 L Exhaust Nut vs Copper Nut, A Compairson of the Two
914Sixer
post Feb 26 2015, 10:12 PM
Post #1


914 Guru
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 8,863
Joined: 17-January 05
From: San Angelo Texas
Member No.: 3,457
Region Association: Southwest Region
This might explain difference in cost between the two. The 2.0 nut is used and the copper is new. Note the copper one has elongated hole.


Attached image(s)
Attached Image Attached Image
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
GeorgeRud
post Feb 26 2015, 10:20 PM
Post #2


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,725
Joined: 27-July 05
From: Chicagoland
Member No.: 4,482
Region Association: Upper MidWest
I believe the elongated center in the copper nut is done to provide a self locking feature. Regular locknuts cannot work in the high heat exhaust area as the nylon ring in the locknut doesn't hold properly, but the deformed copper will.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
McMark
post Feb 27 2015, 10:22 AM
Post #3


914 Freak!
***************

Group: Retired Admin
Posts: 20,179
Joined: 13-March 03
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Member No.: 419
Region Association: None
Yup, the top threads are squished. It's the way most locking nuts are done. Nylock is fine for a lot of things, but if they're gonna be by a heat source, forget it. This includes clutch cables.. The squished thread lock nuts are destined with a certain amount of deformation, so they won't damage the studs...
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Dave_Darling
post Feb 27 2015, 10:59 AM
Post #4


914 Idiot
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 14,980
Joined: 9-January 03
From: Silicon Valley / Kailua-Kona
Member No.: 121
Region Association: Northern California
Sixer, can you look at the OEM nut to see if there is a slice in the side anywhere? I remember one from the exhaust nuts I took off my car way back when...

--DD
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Cap'n Krusty
post Feb 27 2015, 11:10 AM
Post #5


Cap'n Krusty
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 10,794
Joined: 24-June 04
From: Santa Maria, CA
Member No.: 2,246
Region Association: Central California
I have one sitting right here. No slice, no deformity, no plating and no no. Just a steel nut with a thick flange on one end and Helicoiled threads on the inside. They are NOT self locking nuts, nor were they meant to be such.

The Cap'n
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
JamesM
post Feb 27 2015, 12:05 PM
Post #6


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,888
Joined: 6-April 06
From: Kearns, UT
Member No.: 5,834
Region Association: Intermountain Region
The copper nuts are awesome at pulling exhaust studs!

OEM nuts are great if you can find them.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Al Meredith
post Feb 27 2015, 12:13 PM
Post #7


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 958
Joined: 4-November 04
From: Atlanta, ga
Member No.: 3,061
I like the copper nuts BUT I run a 8X125 tap through the nut to eliminate the "pinch"
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Cap'n Krusty
post Feb 27 2015, 12:23 PM
Post #8


Cap'n Krusty
**********

Group: Members
Posts: 10,794
Joined: 24-June 04
From: Santa Maria, CA
Member No.: 2,246
Region Association: Central California
Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
rjames
post Feb 27 2015, 12:46 PM
Post #9


I'm made of metal
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,910
Joined: 24-July 05
From: Shoreline, WA
Member No.: 4,467
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
Okay, so what's the proper replacement for the originals and install procedure? Sound like the copper PLATED ones aren't recommended for fear of stripping the threads that receive the exhaust stud.
And if a regular nut is recommended, what should one use to keep it in place? I recall Jake recommending milk of magnesia on the threads.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Al Meredith
post Feb 27 2015, 12:46 PM
Post #10


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 958
Joined: 4-November 04
From: Atlanta, ga
Member No.: 3,061
Correct ! I like them because they don't slip through a socket.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
JamesM
post Feb 27 2015, 12:58 PM
Post #11


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,888
Joined: 6-April 06
From: Kearns, UT
Member No.: 5,834
Region Association: Intermountain Region
QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 11:23 AM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n


Force of habit as that is how they are advertised EVERYWHERE.

Personally if I can't find OEM ones I will go with these:

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/ACN-Flanged-R...-p/acn-nuts.htm

REALLY nice when dealing with larger OD header stubs.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
914Sixer
post Feb 27 2015, 04:27 PM
Post #12


914 Guru
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 8,863
Joined: 17-January 05
From: San Angelo Texas
Member No.: 3,457
Region Association: Southwest Region
James, you may find the nuts your are looking at are too small in diameter for the exhaust flange on HE's.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Woody
post Feb 27 2015, 04:50 PM
Post #13


Sandbox Rabblerouser and head toilet scrubber
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,858
Joined: 28-December 10
From: San Antonio Texas
Member No.: 12,530
Region Association: Southwest Region
QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 12:23 PM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n



Exactly. The copper plated nuts are still in use on new Porsches as well. A good portion of the nuts used on the current cars have a pinch or dimple and are one time use.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
pete000
post Feb 27 2015, 06:51 PM
Post #14


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,885
Joined: 23-August 10
From: Bradenton Florida
Member No.: 12,094
Region Association: South East States
QUOTE(JamesM @ Feb 27 2015, 10:58 AM) *

QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 11:23 AM) *

Again, you're joining the ranks of those who call those things "copper" nuts. They're NOT copper, they're STEEL, with a copper plating. Clearing out the "pinch" makes them regular nuts with a hefty price tag.

The Cap'n


Force of habit as that is how they are advertised EVERYWHERE.

Personally if I can't find OEM ones I will go with these:

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/ACN-Flanged-R...-p/acn-nuts.htm

REALLY nice when dealing with larger OD header stubs.



These are the ones I went with. They worked fine with my SSi's and were no trouble to install.


User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
PlaysWithCars
post Feb 28 2015, 08:45 PM
Post #15


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 521
Joined: 9-November 03
From: Southeast of Seattle
Member No.: 1,323
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
QUOTE(Dave_Darling @ Feb 27 2015, 08:59 AM) *

Sixer, can you look at the OEM nut to see if there is a slice in the side anywhere? I remember one from the exhaust nuts I took off my car way back when...

--DD


I remember the same thing on the last ones I replaced. The slit allowed the nut to be slightly bent across the axis to create a locking feature instead of squashing the nut perpendicular to the axis.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
patssle
post Feb 28 2015, 08:57 PM
Post #16


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 981
Joined: 28-August 09
From: Houston, TX
Member No.: 10,741
Region Association: None
I went through this myself last year when completing my /6 conversion. I read posts of people having problems with copper lock nuts pulling out the exhaust studs. Just not worth the risk IMHO.

I have a mix of flanged and regular nuts on my exhaust. It seems my MSDS headers have welds that get in the way of the flanges - so that was an issue but minor.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
JamesM
post Feb 28 2015, 11:45 PM
Post #17


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,888
Joined: 6-April 06
From: Kearns, UT
Member No.: 5,834
Region Association: Intermountain Region
QUOTE(914Sixer @ Feb 27 2015, 03:27 PM) *

James, you may find the nuts your are looking at are too small in diameter for the exhaust flange on HE's.



The flange is still 13mm. I have used them before.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
aircooledtechguy
post Mar 3 2015, 09:24 AM
Post #18


The Aircooledtech Guy
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,966
Joined: 8-November 08
From: Anacortes, WA
Member No.: 9,730
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
As the Cap'n mentioned, OEM nuts were steel with a helicoiled thread. It's precisely this helicoil thread that keeps them from bonding to the studs in the first place which is why this nut type is so desirable. VW also used this type of nut on their motors as exhaust nuts from the factory albeit without the shoulder on them.

Unfortunately, I have found no where that this type of helicoil nut is now made. However, the same style of nuts are used to hold the transmissions together on the 914 (without the shoulder). Yes, the same 8x1.25x13 with the helicoil centers are likely holding your transmission together right now. Since the transmissions don't get hot enough to really need this type of protection, I replace the trans nuts with standard nylocs and save these special nuts for exhaust nuts.

Just an FYI for those of you wanting a real seize-free exhaust nut. . . (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
914werke
post Mar 3 2015, 09:39 AM
Post #19


"I got blisters on me fingers"
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 9,995
Joined: 22-March 03
From: USofA
Member No.: 453
Region Association: Pacific Northwest
Or if your a hoarder (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) your already sitting on a stash of em....
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Phoenix914
post Mar 3 2015, 09:51 AM
Post #20


Member
**

Group: Members
Posts: 389
Joined: 6-December 06
From: Oviedo, FL
Member No.: 7,322
Region Association: South East States
Is it appropriate to use something like this on the exhaust nuts?

Attached Image
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
« Next Oldest · 914World Garage · Next Newest »
 

2 Pages V  1 2 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 

Display Mode: Standard · Switch to: Linear+ · Switch to: Outline

Track this topic · Email this topic · Print this topic · Subscribe to this forum

- Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 19th April 2024 - 01:07 PM
Invision Power Board v9.1.4 © 2024  IPS, Inc.
All rights reserved 914World.com © since 2002
914World.com is the fastest growing online 914 community!
We have it all, classifieds, events, forums, vendors, parts, autocross, racing, technical articles, events calendar, newsletter, restoration, gallery, archives, history and more for your Porsche 914 ...