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> Pertronix Ignitor III, any experience P-related or not?
sportlicherFahrer
post Dec 9 2019, 09:10 AM
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Checking out the pertronix website, it looks like they make a vac advance distributor with the ignitor II in it already. Would be curious to see how well it runs on a type IV motor. Part number D182504. Can be found on Amazon for about $176.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 9 2019, 10:49 AM
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Decision made. Ordered new 009 dizzy from AA and 1874A Ignitor directly from Pertronix for $87.......and they told me they were 15% off last Friday......Pertronix told me the 1874A was the correct unit for the 009 and would indeed work with MSD ignition.....

We'll see what happens.....

GN
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ClayPerrine
post Dec 10 2019, 07:17 AM
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QUOTE(Gatornapper @ Dec 9 2019, 10:49 AM) *

Decision made. Ordered new 009 dizzy from AA and 1874A Ignitor directly from Pertronix for $87.......and they told me they were 15% off last Friday......Pertronix told me the 1874A was the correct unit for the 009 and would indeed work with MSD ignition.....

We'll see what happens.....

GN


The 009 distributor has a lousy advance curve for use in a Type IV. I would not recommend using it. You will be disappointed with it.

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rbzymek
post Dec 10 2019, 07:46 AM
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Clay,
What is the best option for a 1.8L dizzy short of 123ignition? 050? Thanks.
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IronHillRestorations
post Dec 10 2019, 07:56 AM
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009 is a great distributor, for a generator engine
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ClayPerrine
post Dec 10 2019, 10:52 AM
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QUOTE(rbzymek @ Dec 10 2019, 07:46 AM) *

Clay,
What is the best option for a 1.8L dizzy short of 123ignition? 050? Thanks.



The stock 1.8L distributor also works great with carbs. If you can find an 050, it is good. But finding a cap and rotor for an 050 is not easy these days.

There is a pertronix for the stock 1.8L distributor. We have run two different ones in Betty's car for over 20 years. The first one dies because I hooked it up to the coil backwards and fried it. That was my dumb@ss move, not a fault of the pertronix. They have never even hiccuped in all that time.

I have also run the pickup coil/igniter unit from a Toyota 22RE engine. It triggered off the point cam, and was totally reliable. The Igniter module got us protested at an AX, so I switched it to pertronix.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 12:25 PM
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Asked Pertronix about this - it will not fit/work in Type 4 engines. Only Type 1's.

They also told me that either the 1874A or V would work with the 009 dizzy, and either is $87 from them........someone somewhere stated that the V would not work with the 009....

GN

QUOTE(sportlicherFahrer @ Dec 9 2019, 10:10 AM) *

Checking out the pertronix website, it looks like they make a vac advance distributor with the ignitor II in it already. Would be curious to see how well it runs on a type IV motor. Part number D182504. Can be found on Amazon for about $176.
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sportlicherFahrer
post Dec 10 2019, 12:33 PM
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Saw reviews on Amazon and Summit of guys running them on type IV engines. Said the body of it had to be rotated to avoid the tin, and basically put the plug wires to where they make sense and in the right order.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 12:37 PM
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Clay -

Thanks. Car had an 009 in it when I got it, and after I got the Weber's dialed in, it ran great - I could find no faults whatsoever putting car through all possible load tests.

As I think I noted before or elsewhere, a top 914 shop in Colorado advised me to bend the stop tabs a bit in an 009 reducing the total advance degrees, and then setting the advance to about 30 deg. at 3500 rpm.

When I win the lottery (which I don't play, but figure my odds of finding a winning ticket on the ground are about the same) I'll get a 123ignition - or when I have a bit more cash on hand in the future..... ;-)

GN



QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Dec 10 2019, 08:17 AM) *

QUOTE(Gatornapper @ Dec 9 2019, 10:49 AM) *

Decision made. Ordered new 009 dizzy from AA and 1874A Ignitor directly from Pertronix for $87.......and they told me they were 15% off last Friday......Pertronix told me the 1874A was the correct unit for the 009 and would indeed work with MSD ignition.....

We'll see what happens.....

GN


The 009 distributor has a lousy advance curve for use in a Type IV. I would not recommend using it. You will be disappointed with it.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 12:52 PM
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Jim -

Very interesting - but the 009 is on the way.

But I have to wonder what the advance curve looks like on it - compared to the 009......

Pertronix flat told me it would not work.....or I would have ordered it for sure......

Thanks,

GN


QUOTE(sportlicherFahrer @ Dec 10 2019, 01:33 PM) *

Saw reviews on Amazon and Summit of guys running them on type IV engines. Said the body of it had to be rotated to avoid the tin, and basically put the plug wires to where they make sense and in the right order.
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rhodyguy
post Dec 10 2019, 02:08 PM
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It will work. Just not optimized curve. Find TDC on #1 before you start the chore and don't rotate the engine.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 02:50 PM
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Clay & Perry -

What is it about the advance curve in the 009 that is the problem?

Total advance too much? Starts at too low rpm?

There are those who say the 009 is fine.....

or that it has no vacuum retard?

Just curious......

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/www.speedsterowners.com-21449-1576011957.1.jpg)

GN

QUOTE
009 is a great distributor, for a generator engine


QUOTE
The 009 distributor has a lousy advance curve for use in a Type IV. I would not recommend using it. You will be disappointed with it.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 03:13 PM
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Sitting on TDC right now........of course, no mark on 2.0.

QUOTE(rhodyguy @ Dec 10 2019, 03:08 PM) *

It will work. Just not optimized curve. Find TDC on #1 before you start the chore and don't rotate the engine.
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sportlicherFahrer
post Dec 10 2019, 03:18 PM
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Should be able to see the notch on the flywheel through the inspection window at the top of the transmission. Once that is lined up you could use a paint pen, fingernail polish, etc to make a TDC mark on the fan.
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 03:22 PM
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Ok, seeing from this chart what may be the issue.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/uploads_offsite/rennlist.com-21449-1576012948.1.jpg)

On the 050, the advance curve is pretty linear from 1000 rpm up.

On the 090, the curve is not linear, but stays flat from 6 deg. advance at 1700 rpm to 2400 rpm where it starts to suddenly rise at 2400 rpm to 3400.

I can see where this could cause problems.

Interesting the two charts differ somewhat.......

GN
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 03:23 PM
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Already did that. Used small mirror to see 27 deg. BTDC red mark and go from there.....

Used paint pen.

Thanks.

QUOTE(sportlicherFahrer @ Dec 10 2019, 04:18 PM) *

Should be able to see the notch on the flywheel through the inspection window at the top of the transmission. Once that is lined up you could use a paint pen, fingernail polish, etc to make a TDC mark on the fan.
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yeahmag
post Dec 10 2019, 05:58 PM
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It may have been mentioned, but the 009 has too much advance. What ends up happening is you end up with way too little advance down low so that you don't over advance above 3K RPM. The Mallory's that Jake use to sell were fairly linear and had 16 deg total advance (12-28).
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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 06:32 PM
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Aaron -

Thank you.

Ok, guys. What are my alternatives if I don't want to use my 009 and don't want to belly up for the big bucks for the 123ignition.........

Suggestions, please.......

With thanks in advance.....

GN

QUOTE(yeahmag @ Dec 10 2019, 06:58 PM) *

It may have been mentioned, but the 009 has too much advance. What ends up happening is you end up with way too little advance down low so that you don't over advance above 3K RPM. The Mallory's that Jake use to sell were fairly linear and had 16 deg total advance (12-28).
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Tdskip
post Dec 10 2019, 06:39 PM
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Great chart, helps to visualize the considerations.

Hoping to NOT muddy the water here but what about something like this?

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Gatornapper
post Dec 10 2019, 06:53 PM
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TD -

No mud at all. I looked at these and seriously considered it.....want to see the advance curve first - and see how one would keep the advance to no more than 22 deg.

Checking now to see if I can get the advance curve off of Pelican's site.......if not, I'll call them tomorrow.

On another note, I can get the Pertronix FlameThrower for $133 on Amazon - but one thing that concerns me is about 1/3 of all buyers have something wrong.......not good.......but those for whom it works rave about it.........

GN

QUOTE(Tdskip @ Dec 10 2019, 07:39 PM) *

Great chart, helps to visualize the considerations.

Hoping to NOT muddy the water here but what about something like this?

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