Front mount oil cooler, rubber hoses? Options

[yarin]

Any comments?

Every front mount application i've seen uses Aeroquip braided steel lines. Is rubber a bad idea? Thanks

[Qarl]

You can use rubber, but the steel hose is probably stronger, and offers "some" wear protection with the stainless steel braiding.

You can also go with bent steel or brass lines, but they would be a bitch to form correctly.

You can run your lines underneath the rockers, through the heater ducts on the passenger or driver side, but it would mess up your heat if you have it, or inside the cabin along the tunnel on the passenger side (not recommended in case the line bursts and shoots scalding hot oil on the driver!)



I would put grommets in the through-holes to prevent chaffing of the body sheetmetal into the lines.

[cha914]

this is the kind of rubber hose + fittings I have if I ever get around to mounting my front cooler:

http://www.racerpartswholesale.com/aero5.htm

- Tony

[campbellcj]

I used the spendy steel braided (aeroquip type) lines and AN fittings, run thru the heater ducts (I have no heat nor a need/desire for it.) Unless there are severe budget worries, I probably would not lean towards rubber lines or inferior connectors, especially push-on (barbed) stuff. That's an awfully long run and obviously a leak/puncture could be catastrophic.

[si2t3m]

I've calculated 27feet of hose to mount my cooler up front. I'll be going under the rocker panel as i need to keep the heat system.

How long of hoses did you guys need?

TIA

Marc-André

[MJHanna]

I have run the hose that Tony has posted for years in the car. If you read the specs on the hose, it is the same hose as the Steel braided without the “stainless cover”. Plus it is easier to work with. Once the ends are on, they do not pull out, you have to cut the hose to get them off. Just watch for wear points. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mueba.gif)

[bander]

Mcmaster Carr all the way.
http://www.mcmaster.com/
search on part numbers 5279k213 and 5440k113. I used 1/2" but you could go with 3/4 if you wanted to. This hose is awesome stuff and the barb fittings have nuts like the AN so they can be disconnected easily.


HOSE, 5279k213 1/2"id, $2.67/ft


SAE-Rated Hydraulic Rubber Hose Assemblies and Hose
• Tube: Buna-N rubber
• Cover: black chlorinated synthetic rubber, Mine Safety and Health Administration (MSHA)-accepted
• Reinforcement: SAE 100R1-AT, one high-tensile steel wire braid; SAE 100R2-AT, two high-tensile steel wire braids
• Temperature Range: -40° to +257° F
Male Coupling

Hydraulic service requires hose that can handle the higher pressures. These hoses meet Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) standards and are suitable for use with petroleum-based hydraulic fluids.



FITTINGS, 5440k113 $1.39 ea

Brass Ball-Seat Hose Nipples

Assembled Nipple
A ball seating inside the nut of these nipples creates the seal, minimizing leaks that can occur with pipe thread connections. For easier installation, fitting consists of two pieces: a barbed hose stem and a separate NPSM (mechanical straight thread) female swivel nut. Just insert the barbed hose stem into the swivel nut, attach the hose to the stem, then swivel the nut onto the pipe connection. Swivel action during installation helps prevent hose from kinking. Maximum working pressure is 250 psi.

[yarin]

Thanks for the info.

I'm looking to buy a car with a front mount oil cooler and rubber lines.

Oils temps reach 225 on the highway and 190 in autox and street. These temps are safe, correct?

[john rogers]

The only soft hose I would use is the "Parker" type kevlar lined hose that the off road guys use. The hose noted above is too close to the upper temperature limit for me to feel comfortable with it. I am like Chris, my race car uses braided lines with AN fittings. I have seen several vintage cars (not only Porsches) be rejected at tech with soft hoses. If you decide to buy the braided hose, a good method to use for the lengths is to buy a length of cheap garden hose and the fittings youll need and use the hose to hook it up for a prefit. Then have the Earl's guy do the cutting and fitting install as so far I have not seen any of their fittings leak. Good luck

[J P Stein]

I agree with Mr. Rogers & Chris. This is no place to screw around. Buy the best stuff you can find.

SS hose is a PITH (hands) but doable by the average guy. I found that I had to attach many fittings "in place" as the fittings wouldn't go thru the
same holes as the hoses.....it ups the PITH a bit. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

[drew365]

I'm close to doing this project. Where's a good supplier for the SS lines and fittings and what size do yall recommend?

[bander]

John, Whats the temp rating of the Parker hose?

[scotty]

I found that I had to attach many fittings "in place" as the fittings wouldn't go thru the
same holes as the hoses.....it ups the PITH a bit.

You could always make the holes a 'tad' bigger...after cutting the frigging things too small the first time...BTDTBTTS (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

[maf914]

Does anyone know what the flow rate of a typical automotive oil pump is? Gallons per minute or lliters per minute. I would like to calculate the pressure loss through an external cooler system.

Mike

[J P Stein]

I'm close to doing this project. Where's a good supplier for the SS lines and fittings and what size do yall recommend?

Summit Racing.
12AN minimum.

BTW, for flow:
Go out and turn on your garden hose full blast.
There is 4 bar thru a 1/2 inch line. The 9eleben oil pump is NOT typical. The scavenge side of the pump will put out in excess of 150 psi with cold oil & a cooler. Dunno diddly bout a t-4 pump.

Bigger....right, the other end is even worser

[maf914]

JP,

Good points about about garden hose and 911 pressure. But it doesn't really give an idea about flow. A positive displacement gear pump will produce tremendous pressure at low flow or against high resistance, hence the various pressure relief devices in engines. When the engine is nice and tight the pressure is high because of this. Just because you have 150 psi, say 10 bar appoximately, in the 911 doesn't mean it will flow 2.5 times the volume of a garden hose that normally sees 4 bar or 60 psi. The 4 bar in the street main is pushing as much as it can through the 1/2" hose. The 10 bar at the 911 pump is pushing everything it can through small bearing clearances and other ports, all small by comparison to a garden hose.

Just rambling I guess. I don't know the answer. Something to think about though.

Mike

[J P Stein]

The 4 bar is normal pressure for a 911 motor ...hot, at 4000 rpms..on the pressure side...feeding the bearings & stuff. The garden hose was a rough parallel, discounting viscosity & all.

The scavenge side feeds.....ah....the ex-cooler & the oil filter.....no pressure reliefs...it just "has at" any restrictions. It WILL empty 12 quarts onto the ground in 10 sec or so when it finds a way out. BTDT, got the t-shirt & pics. Fluidyne coolers are gud, but not that gud

[brant]

just want to clarify for people...

the size (AN10.. AN12.. AN16) is different dependant upon your motor needs.

12 is common on 6 cylinders
10 is common on 4 cylinders
and my buddy with a 3.6 conversion is using 16 and up....

brant

[campbellcj]

My new cooler has AN-12 lines sourced from Earls, and a Troutman thermostat. The cooler is a MazdaComp (now called MazdaSpeed Motorsports or something like that) which is about 22" x 6" x 2.5"...huge...it was very expensive but came highly recommended and since I drive in >100F heat regularly, I cannot take shortcuts on cooling.

[914Timo]

Marc-André, I have about 4 meter steel hydraulic pipe under the rocker coves.