COULD IT BE DONE TO A 914, PORSCHE VW Options

[redshift]

whoa..

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad.gif)

You are scaring me


M

[Mark Henry]

I feel sorry for your buddy but I don't think there's a make or model that someone hasn't been killed in.

Hell people get killed crossing the street...what are you going to do...never leave the house? Bugs are no more dangerous than any 30yr/old car.



BTW my wifes 71 super has been with us about 7yrs, including the cost of the car we've spent $3000 on it.

I'm pretty sure my wife is screwing her mechanic though. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

[pete-stevers]

exactly... why would you do it TO a 914, when you can do IT IN a 914 i think that would be more my style, lots more usable cabin space in fourteen (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/grouphug.gif)

[MecGen]

Hi People
I have had this conversation many times...
usually its about my investment (car), and time, four year rebiuld, BUT I usually get compared to a Chevy (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/screwy.gif)
Think about it... Invest 20000$ in a 69 Chev convertable, and its worth how much today ?, invest 20000$ in a 74 914 targa, 2.0l, same question?
Apples and oranges, two different cars, so is the 914 and Bug.
At the age of 16 I bought my first Bug, I worked all summer on it, Cannary yellow, 1.6l, Exhaust, cam, carrbed.
I used to get the tires to come loose going into 3rd gear. Had 3 Bugs in total, worked on lots of them. I love this car, I love my Porsche, not the same way.
There was a time I siriously priced out a monster type 1 and adapter to put it in the 914
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/screwy.gif)
Jake will sure agree with me when I say 2.0l were expensive to do right back then too. I think the deals availible today are much better, still pay huge $$$ but now things are even better. 12 years ago 3000$-4000$
was the going rate for a "real" rebiuld. My Koblesmtch (sp) were going for 1200$ 10 years ago.
OOPPPPSSss got sidetracked...
Porsche and VW ...Why not swap stuff, if it works...cool, back in the day, type1 powerplant was a great , dollar vs HP swap, but what always stopped me was origionalty, or the Porsche badge.
Where I grew up you had to own a Bug before you moved up to a 914, it was an unritten law. When you had your Bug long anough to lite your smoke with the gas heater, you can start looking for a 914.
Just my idle ramblings
Peace
Joe



(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rock_band.gif)

[Air_Cooled_Nut]

My $0.02, yes, it's about the "wow" factor. I've spent enough money on my baby to get me a very nice 914-6 -- over the span of 20+ years (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Yeah, it's the wow factor and what you like to drive. I get the occational 911 behind me checking out my engine (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/huh.gif)

[DBCooper]

QUOTE (Steve @ Feb 23 2005, 02:20 PM)

I love bugs but there only good for 1/4 mile drag strips and total sleepers on the avenue. I love to hang corners, auto cross etc. When I see a bug get top time of day at an autocross or willow springs I might look into investing my money in one.

Actually the bug in the photos at the top of the thread was made with handling in mind, and when bugs are set up they can be more than respectable. Don't forget the early bugs only weighed 1600 pounds, and those supers, when they have 951 suspension and brakes, handle a heck of a lot better than most 911's. As for racing at Willow Springs (actually Streets of Willow) it's been done. Check this out:

http://www.vwtrendsweb.com/features/0112vwt_gforce/

That wasn't an autocross, but van Wettering's red bug was built at Bugformance in San Jose and holds class records nearly everywhere it's been raced, TTOD at some. If I recall correctly it came in second overall in that G-Force Challenge, beating, among other cars, a pretty nice 914. Granted Jack's bug is more of a race car than the nice street bug in the photos that started the thread.

Jake's right about the pleasure of a fast bug that can embarass owners who simply can't admit that their car could be thrashed by an old VW. There's a lot of satisfaction in that. It may be perverted satisfacton, but hey. And if you think it couldn't happen to you, well...

And Toast, disliking the car you were in because somebody else hit it? What exactly does that have to do with anything?

[r_towle]

The 944 suspension is a direct copy of the superbeetle suspension geometry, so much of a copy that the rear trailing arms from a 944 bolt right into a super beetle.

The super beetle suspension geometry was designed before the 944 suspension.

The 944 used better parts to accomplish the same thing..

So, you swap a 944 suspension into a beetle and the world of high performance suspension and brakes opens up in front of you...

Toast, VW is like any other car company, they are big and only out to make a buck....

Personally I will never stop being a fan if vw,s

I have 7 right now including my three 914's

That is why I like the 914, cause its a low fast vw....
I love beating 911's with basically a bus engine....makes me smile...

Rich

[Garland]

What else could I say.

[jeff m]

My first job in the early 80s was at so cal import dismantlers a porsche /vw salvage yard ,first car 68 vw squareback second 69 vw bug class 11 ,rode in a unlimited class 5 car (baja bug )in the baja 1000,and a couple of nice prerunners ,best friend had a 69 w/wicked 2180 (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beerchug.gif) If i didnt have so many cars now id have a oval window rag with a killer motor and a nice prerunner

[BigD9146gt]

I'll admit thats pretty cool stuff on that car, no doubt.

But from a logistical point, those GT3 or GT2 calipers are way overkill. After spending bank on the equipment (which again is nice stuff) you now have to re-engineer the braking physics to work for the car through perportioning valves. Those calipers use power assisted units because of the volume they use, and just putting a larger master cylinder doesn't always work.

Hats off to them if they got it all dialed in, blingity bling toys.

[Steve]

QUOTE (Paul Illick @ Feb 23 2005, 07:07 PM)

QUOTE (Steve @ Feb 23 2005, 02:20 PM) I love bugs but there only good for 1/4 mile drag strips and total sleepers on the avenue. I love to hang corners, auto cross etc. When I see a bug get top time of day at an autocross or willow springs I might look into investing my money in one. Actually the bug in the photos at the top of the thread was made with handling in mind, and when bugs are set up they can be more than respectable. Don't forget the early bugs only weighed 1600 pounds, and those supers, when they have 951 suspension and brakes, handle a heck of a lot better than most 911's. As for racing at Willow Springs (actually Streets of Willow) it's been done. Check this out: http://www.vwtrendsweb.com/features/0112vwt_gforce/ That wasn't an autocross, but van Wettering's red bug was built at Bugformance in San Jose and holds class records nearly everywhere it's been raced, TTOD at some. If I recall correctly it came in second overall in that G-Force Challenge, beating, among other cars, a pretty nice 914. Granted Jack's bug is more of a race car than the nice street bug in the photos that started the thread. Jake's right about the pleasure of a fast bug that can embarass owners who simply can't admit that their car could be thrashed by an old VW. There's a lot of satisfaction in that. It may be perverted satisfacton, but hey. And if you think it couldn't happen to you, well... And Toast, disliking the car you were in because somebody else hit it? What exactly does that have to do with anything?

That article does not mention the skid pad ratings or that it even beat the 914.
That article also does not mention any actual track times at willow springs or any other track.
We can compare them to Otto's 914GT track time at Willow.
We can also compare those records to the 911's that it supposedly beat.

[DBCooper]

You're right, I know that only because I'm familiar with that car and read the original article. That linked web blurb is just excerpts because I couldn't find the complete original article online. If you're really interested there are actual times and final rankings on the Import Tuner magazine site, at http://www.importtuner.com/features/0111it...it_gforcepromo/

It's nothing definitive and wasn't a real open autocross event, just a hokey magazine comparison. I mentioned it only because there'd been doubt expressed about whether a bug could be made to handle and how one would do at Willow Springs. Voila. And if you google Jack Van Wettering you'll see some of his results at norcal autocross events. Apples to Oranges or course, but not bad at all.

[Toast]

QUOTE (Paul Illick @ Feb 23 2005, 08:07 PM)

[QUOTE=Steve,Feb 23 2005, 02:20 PM] Jake's right about the pleasure of a fast bug that can embarass owners who simply can't admit that their car could be thrashed by an old VW. There's a lot of satisfaction in that. It may be perverted satisfacton, but hey. And if you think it couldn't happen to you, well...

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif)
I would love to be next to a vet or camero or rice rocket and be able to take them off the line. What was really funny is when I would be first in line to a red light, and watch people behind me pull in the other lane. Then when the light would turn green, I would blaze away, and I would watch all those people who moved over at the red light come back over to the lane I was in, now that I was already 1/2 mile up the road. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

QUOTE

And Toast, disliking the car you were in because somebody else hit it?  What exactly does that have to do with anything?

Its not only the fact that it would get totaled very shortly after I spent years fixing it up. It was also all the times It broke down, all the times I had to have it towed, all the times I would push it down the freeway, all the times I had to fix it on the side of the road, how many times I got screwed by paying someone to build or rebuild my engine (yea, thanks for scewing me Steve Tims and Mikes Racing Engines!). Shit, all three of my engine rebuilds cost me nearly 7,000 alone!
And also the fact that someone close to me died in my vw, and all the fucking shit I had to deal with afterwards.

[Eric_Shea]

Here's the start of my 10 step program:

"I have a 911. I'm an asshole."

I've decided to change my ways... I'm gonna sell everything and drive what Jake drives (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wub.gif)

[Jake Raby]

Eric, if you do that you'll just be a plain "ass" like me...LOL

[anthony]

QUOTE (Jake Raby @ Feb 23 2005, 07:37 AM)

These guys are my best customers- They do their cars right and don't bitch about the cost of it!

Jake, stop call 914 owners a bunch of cheapskates. The VW market for your business is larger because they made like 20 million Beatles. Even though a miniscule percentage of those guys build $20,000+ show cars that represents a lot of business for you.

They only made 100,000 914s. I'd bet that a much larger percentage of 914 owners have built $20,000+ cars.

[TROJANMAN]

QUOTE (Sammy @ Feb 23 2005, 07:21 AM)

Cool. You can spend $25k+ on a beetle that will almost keep up with a $5k 914 and will allegedly smoke a $15k 911 (color me skeptical). When you get done it will be worth a third of what you spent on it if yer lucky. I appreciate people building things because they are different, rare, cool, whatever, but they still do not make any sense at all.

aren't all 914's worth only a third of what we spend on them?

[Mark Henry]

QUOTE (glstrojan @ Feb 24 2005, 11:52 AM)

QUOTE (Sammy @ Feb 23 2005, 07:21 AM) Cool. You can spend $25k+ on a beetle that will almost keep up with a $5k 914 and will allegedly smoke a $15k 911 (color me skeptical). When you get done it will be worth a third of what you spent on it if yer lucky. I appreciate people building things because they are different, rare, cool, whatever, but they still do not make any sense at all. aren't all 914's worth only a third of what we spend on them?

Here I can get way more for a nice bug than an equal 914. I turn work away all the time.

Fixing up a 914 to sell is a waste of my time.

I have a half dozen big T4 builds in progress, save a 356 they're all bugs.

In the last year or so I've done as many 914 rebuilds, all bare bones el-cheapo rebuilds. I've only had 1 tire-kicker, 914, big T4 guy and he had totally unrealistic time frame so I passed.

Any restored car will not be worth what you spend on it...what's it worth to you.

If you want senseable go buy a civic or neon, but even then you lose a 1/3 when you drive off the lot.