OT: 230v welder wiring, using a dryer circuit Options

[sj914]

That extension cord would work, but I think the problem is the dryer outlet is a different plug. He'd have to change the plug to a dryer plug to make it work.
A CSOB 914 owner would have to either change out the plug or make a short conversion cord. And that would lead to more spending for a CSOB. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif)

Not that us 914 owners are CSOB's (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif)

[jonwatts]

QUOTE (sj914 @ Jan 16 2006, 06:42 AM)

That extension cord would work, but I think the problem is the dryer outlet is a different plug. He'd have to change the plug to a dryer plug to make it work. A CSOB 914 owner would have to either change out the plug or make a short conversion cord. And that would lead to more spending for a CSOB. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif) Not that us 914 owners are CSOB's (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif)

Exactally. It's a combination of CSOB syndrome, needing to adapt the dryer outlet, and that the dryer (and fuse panel) are on the other side of the garage.

But that's a better price on the 25 ft extension than the $90 that I saw.


Jon

[914GT]

QUOTE (jonwatts @ Jan 16 2006, 12:51 AM)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/icon_bump.gif) All hail the god of archives (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/pray.gif) I searched before asking and found some good threads on this subject, including this one. But I still have a few questions. 1. What's the upper limit on how long a 220V extension cord can be before it becomes a problem? 2. If the welder is rated at 20 amps why did they put a 50 amp plug on it? Don't they know that most of their customers are guys trying to repair rusty cars in their garages?

1. Depends on the minimum voltage the device with correctly operate under peak and continuous operating current. Generally you want less than a 10% voltage drop, but for a welder I'd keep it under 5% so you don't have problems with the wire feed motor at max. peak amps. Use a wire gauge chart such as this one to size the wire.

2. Possibly because 25-30 amp single-phase receptacles are not as common for household use. More people probably have dryer outlets close to the garage. You could go down to a smaller amp plug rated higher than the max. input amps on the welder, but you'd still have to buy the matching receptacle. And it shouldn't be a standard plug used for 115V equipment even though they exist with 20 amp ratings.

[r_towle]

the industry has changed from 3 wire to four wire.

Im MASS, the code now calls for 4 wire.

Get a flexible wire...

I run 100 FT of extension for my 220 machinery.

With the welder, it does draw alot more amps while running than a typical machine due to how it is using the electricity.

I would say that you hard wire it to as close as you can with the stiffer 8 or 10 guage so you experience less voltage drop.

You will feel the voltage drop, and you would notice it more if you were starting a larger motor on a saw/mill.

With this voltage drop your welder will perform less than it should.

The hard wire larger guage will let the voltage to flow easier.

Think of it like water...it flows better through a larger pipe.
With less resistance you will have a better solution.

then you can plug the welder in directly to a plug.
Wire it directly to the circuit box, it will be a better solution.

Rich

[jd74914]

QUOTE (r_towle @ Jan 16 2006, 11:58 AM)

the industry has changed from 3 wire to four wire. Im MASS, the code now calls for 4 wire. Get a flexible wire... I run 100 FT of extension for my 220 machinery. With the welder, it does draw alot more amps while running than a typical machine due to how it is using the electricity. I would say that you hard wire it to as close as you can with the stiffer 8 or 10 guage so you experience less voltage drop. You will feel the voltage drop, and you would notice it more if you were starting a larger motor on a saw/mill. With this voltage drop your welder will perform less than it should. The hard wire larger guage will let the voltage to flow easier. Think of it like water...it flows better through a larger pipe. With less resistance you will have a better solution. then you can plug the welder in directly to a plug. Wire it directly to the circuit box, it will be a better solution. Rich

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif)

Just hardwire it and be done once and for all. We finished wiring our garage a few weeks ago and just put in special 50A outlet and breaker in the panel for the welder. Much safer than a huge extension cord and less voltage draw. IIRC we used 8ga wire to link the outlet to the panel. Nice and easy and now we can forget about it. No cords to trip over. Its very simple to do and much easier to run than the four strands of #1 wire that were run from the house to the garage. Pulling those things are hard, wiring a simple outlets not bad and it saves lots of trouble in the future. It should be comprable pricewise to and cord you could make because you only need to buy one plug as opposed to 2 for an extension cord, and then you just need a breaker on top of that and the same length of wire. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif)

Also, like Clayton said earlier, ground and neutral are 2 different things, don't run them together. Ground is ground whereas neutral measures current loss for GFI breakers so that they blow when the current loss it too great, like when you are dancing because you are getting electricuted. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif)

In any case, go by building code and be safe, that much voltage can hurt really bad (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

[fiid]

Nothing electrical here, but for MIG sets, please make sure your gas bottle is secured. In the picture above the bottle appears to be just stood upright on it's own.... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sad.gif)

Those things have 1000s of PSI in them when they are full.

A friend of mine tells a story about one which got knocked over and smashed the brass valve. After it had flown around the room a few times, it flew through a brick wall, and they found it a quarter of a mile away.

I would get a welding cart and make sure the bottle is secured to the top of the back of the welder.

Just my 2c. Be safe.

[jonwatts]

QUOTE (jd74914 @ Jan 16 2006, 09:27 AM)

Just hardwire it and be done once and for all. We finished wiring our garage a few weeks ago and just put in special 50A outlet and breaker in the panel for the welder.

That's a great solution but I'm not rewiring my garage.

Thanks for the answers. I'm only looking to make about a 30' extension cord (like bondo was talking about earlier).

[914GT]

I know my local home depot has 4-conductor #6 flexible cord. If they have 3 conductor too then that's all you need since it's just two hots and ground on the welder. Wire one end directly into the welder and the other to a dryer plug and you're done.

[IronHillRestorations]

QUOTE (fiid @ Jan 16 2006, 09:28 AM)

A friend of mine tells a story about one which got knocked over and smashed the brass valve. After it had flown around the room a few times, it flew through a brick wall, and they found it a quarter of a mile away.

I saw a hole in the wall of a concrete block building from a similar incident. No one got hurt real bad, but one of the guys got some pretty good burns. The guys told me the thing took off like a rocket, literally.


Also turn off your regulator too. It's better for the diaphram in the regulator, and less of a hazard. If you leave the regulator "on" and open the valve the compressed gas cylinder, there's a sudden rush of gas that heats up the valve in the regulator. This is especially critical on oxygen cylinders. If by chance there's ANYTHING combustible inside that valve (like a spider web) it's BOOOM! I've seen pictures of the results.