Experienced V8 Guys, REALLY need some clutch help Options

[aircooledboy]

I am having a hell of a time getting my clutch set up (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/headbang.gif) , and now I am getting conflicting advice from Kennedy & Renegade. The problem is I like & trust the guys at both places so now I don't know what to do. I know there are plenty of you guys out there who have 901's mated to SBCs with out any problem, and I need your help here.

My problem is I cannot get the new parts I bought to work. There's more detail here, but this is the short version: I just bought a Stage III 9" KEP pressure plate and 9" Sachs organic disk. I have one washer under the pivot ball so that there is about 1/8" free play in the fork when the trans is mated to the engine. I can tighten the clutch cable so that the fork goes so far back when I step on the clutch that it hits the trans, but the clutch will not release all the way. I have had the trans in & out of the car 7 times making different adjustments, nothing helps.

Spoke to Scott at Renegade today, and he says those parts ain't gonna get it w/ a 901. Said the Stage III press plate is going to pull my pivot ball out of my trans eventually, and the Sachs disk won't work because it is too thick. Scott says I need a Stage II plate, and a kevlar disk, because the kevlar is thinner.

So I called KEP to tell them I need to send this stuff back and get the right parts. Dave at KEP says he's not in agreement with Scott that this stuff won't work. He was very nice and helpfull but he said: 1) he doesn't think kevlar disks are a good idea period, but shouldn't be neccessary anyway because 2) the pressure plate is engineered by them specifically for this application with this disk, and they work. He told me that they had a problem with their CNC setup briefly, and my press plate may have been made and sent out before they caught it, resulting in the friction ring on the plate being too think, and explaining why my clutch won't release. Dave then expressed concerns about my Renegade adaptor plate and the fly wheel I have and worried they might be creating problems too if they are not the right heights & thicknesses for the way their clutch is engineered. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/headbang.gif) KEP is willing to have me send the press plate back to them, and they will check it out, If they find a problem, they will replace it with whatever I want, but I got the feeling they won't take the disk back at all, and if there is nothing wrong the the press plate, they aren't exchanging that either. He even wanted me to send my flywheel, but I really don't want to pull it off again.

I know several of you guys have tons of experience with this, whereas this is the only one I have ever played with, so I have no frame of reference in sorting out who to believe. If you guys can offer some direction here, I sure would be grateful. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/pray.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beerchug.gif)

[aircooledboy]

Brief update: We have lift off!! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/boldblue.gif) Driving it today.

I'll fill in details & pics later, but the Stage II went in with out a hitch, and I'm driving it today. I made a few mods to improve things, one with worked prefectly, and one that was a complete waste of time. New trans gears & ratios are incredible. Feels like a new car. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif)

Felix, no need to worry whether you got my used plate because I still have it. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/huh.gif) They re-used the top part of the Stage III I sent back. I can tell by the paint scrapes around the bolt holes that this is the same "cover." You can even still see the "3" under the newly stamped "2" where it now says "Stage 2" (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

[neo914-6]

QUOTE (aircooledboy @ Apr 13 2005, 08:56 AM)

Brief update: We have lift off!! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/boldblue.gif) Driving it today. I'll fill in details & pics later, but the Stage II went in with out a hitch, and I'm driving it today. I made a few mods to improve things, one with worked prefectly, and one that was a complete waste of time. New trans gears & ratios are incredible. Feels like a new car. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif) Felix, no need to worry whether you got my used plate because I still have it. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/huh.gif) They re-used the top part of the Stage III I sent back. I can tell by the paint scrapes around the bolt holes that this is the same "cover." You can even still see the "3" under the newly stamped "2" where it now says "Stage 2" (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

Was kidding on the used plate.

What was the mod that was a waste of time?

Glad it worked for you, hope mine does too...I may not have time to install my big axles.

BTW, What was the root cause of the original problem? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) .

[aircooledboy]

Allrighty then, here we go. Starting out, I could have sworn one of these cars was black, but with all the dust from sitting for 5 months, it is hard to tell which is which (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

[aircooledboy]

1st thing I did was notch the trans housing a little bit. I saw that the clutch arm was hitting the housing before the throw out was bottoming out on the bolts holding the throw out tube. Wanting to be sure I would have maximum travel, you gotta make a notch there, right? WRONG. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/huh.gif)

This was the waste of time part. When you mate the trans to the engine, the pressure plate actually contacts the arm, and pushes it back away from the opening anyway. The notch didn't change squat. The only way you could utilize the maximum throw would be to bend the arm, but that would require a pretty complex compound bend, first forward to clear the press plate, then back further down the fork shaft or you would lose forward travel. So, DON'T DO THIS.

[aircooledboy]

I decided that rather than try to bend the arm, I would grind it some where the arm hit the pressure plate, giving me a little more room. With my old Stage II, if I tried to adjust the clutch so that I had free play, the clutch arm would rattle. I always thought it was from the arm vibrating against the opening in the bell housing, but when I pulled it apart, I found it was really the arm touching the pressure plate and "bouncing" on the humps in the plate. So, I took a new arm (donated by Brad Meyuer, THANKS BRAD (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/beerchug.gif)) and ground a groove in it to give me a little more clearance breathing room.

[aircooledboy]

Looks deeper than it really is laying flat. As you can see here, it is just about 1/8", but it worked like a charm. Allowed me to adjust the clutch to have free play, but still shift smoothly into reverse. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif)

[aircooledboy]

What was wrong with the Stage III you ask? Idunno (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif)

Kennedy said it "might" have been defective. Were they being honest or just covering their ass? Idunno. Renegade says you can't make the Stage III and Sachs disk work. Kennedy says you can. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wacko.gif) What I do know is this set up kicks wild booty.

Here you can see my Stage 3, make that Stage 2 plate. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif) Didn't photograph real great, but you can clearly make out the "3" under the "2" if you are holding it in your hand. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/w00t.gif)

[aircooledboy]

See, there was a Black car under all that dust. Here she is after a 10 minute "man I'm tired, and it's late, but I'm driving this thing in the morning and I ain't driving it this dirty" car wash.

I cannot say enough about how great this rascal is to drive now. Between the new clutch and the new gear ratios, ("H" gear in particular), it is what I think we are all looking for when we do an SBC. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif)

I gotta get used to how strong the old boy is now though. Heading out to lunch this afternoon, I stepped on it a bit to make a left turn from a stop to fit through a small opening in on coming traffic, and did a perfect 90' Bat turn, right in front of the Courthouse. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) Proly not a great habit, but it was fuhn, hehehehe. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/monkeydance.gif)

[bondo]

Sweet! Glad it's fixed! No slippage? (at the clutch that is) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

[aircooledboy]

QUOTE (bondo @ Apr 14 2005, 02:16 PM)

Sweet! Glad it's fixed! No slippage? (at the clutch that is) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

NONE, zip, zero, zilch. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif)

There is a comically steep hill not far from the Midwest NARP complex, and I could break my old clutch loose on it without much effort. Today, in 4th gear, up hill at 60, I was able to make the back tires chirp (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/w00t.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/monkeydance.gif) .

[bondo]

QUOTE (aircooledboy @ Apr 14 2005, 05:09 PM)

QUOTE (bondo @ Apr 14 2005, 02:16 PM) Sweet! Glad it's fixed! No slippage? (at the clutch that is) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif) NONE, zip, zero, zilch. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif) There is a comically steep hill not far from the Midwest NAPR complex, and I could break my old clutch loose on it without much effort. Today, in 4th gear, up hill at 60, I was able to make the back tires chirp (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool_shades.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/w00t.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/monkeydance.gif) .

Oh man.. I can't wait till mine's done.. new target for completion.. WCC 06 (is there a date set yet?) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)