some six conversion issues... Options

[meursault]

So I'm test-fitting my engine and transmission in the car right now, and I'm having some problems. Perhaps someone can offer some advice.

Engine is a 2.7 liter, transmission is a 901 pull clutch, mount (for now) is a Patrick Motorsport piece.

Issue #1: supposedly the clutch cable to use is a 72-74 911 unit. The sheath is a little short, though, and making a bracket isn't necessarily easy because part of the crankcase prevents me from having a straight shot. I have an idea of how to do this, but I'm wondering if anyone's done this before. Here's a pic:

[meursault]

Issue #2:

Trying to find an oil line that will allow me to use the factory heat exchangers. The late style 911 hard oil line doesn't quite clear...

[meursault]

Trying a long, early oil hose was even less productive; the oil tube is in just the wrong place...

[meursault]

Issue #3:

I'm hoping this resolves itself when I get the oil tank completely secured. The supposedly correct straight oil line with male-to-male adapter just seems to want to kink. It seems to be too long.

I tucked it under the brake line for a test fitting of the heat exchanger. I don't think it's a good idea to drive it like that.

I think I need to see a pic of the 914-6 hook with the oil lines all present and accounted for. Anyone got that kind of pic?

[Steve]

I ran the same conversion and used the stock 914-4 clutch cable, roller, ect...
Patrick Motor sports sells a factory return metal oil line that he cuts off in front of the motor and welds a male fitting on. This is what I'm running on my six. The metal line runs really close to the engine so you can easily run headers or heat exchangers. the rubber line that your running looks to thick and will interfere with headers or heat exchangers.
The line from the oil cooler to the tank looks fine.

Steve

[Steve]

OOPs Sorry.
I thought you were running the stock push type clutch.
I ran stock everything when I did my 2.7.
I had no problems whatsoever with the stock 914 trans and 911 2.0 flywheel.
The only issue I had was the motor was over heating until I installed a front oil cooler.
I put 100k on my 2.7 until swapping it for a 3.2 last year.
I'm now running a KEP conversion flywheel with the stock trans.

Good luck with your conversion!!!

Steve

[meursault]

Hi, Steve! Nice car. Thanks for the suggestions. Some clarifications, though:

I can't run the roller now even if I wanted to since the clutch arrangement is now backwards. Look at my throwout fork.

The metal line interferes because of a bend near the oil return tubes. I may try cutting and splicing it. Cutting it off in front of the motor won't solve my problem. I'll get another pic of the area soon.

Maybe another pic will show the kink a little better.

[914Timo]

Issue #1
Isnt that 911 gearbox ?? I mean the one between 901 and 915 gearboxes. It is used in 911 models between 1970 and 1972, I think....

Figure #3
Hope you dont use that early oil hose. It looks like it is broken.

Issue #3
I think one problem is the 4-engine mouunt. Original six dont have them and the oil line can have bigger radius. I had the same problem and I had to remove the old engine mount. But, I use the bulk head mount....

Nice conversion. Hope you manage to solve those problems.

[914Timo]

Ok, I saw now your last pic. Cutting the engine mount doesnt help. Can you rotate the 90 degree end of the tank ??

I use longer rear brake hoses. I am not sure if they used the same brake hoses in six and fours. My longer brake hoses are fron VW LT truck.

[elmonte]

Ok, I saw now your last pic. Cutting the engine mount doesnt help. Can you rotate the 90 degree end of the tank ??

I use longer rear brake hoses. I am not sure if they used the same brake hoses in six and fours. My longer brake hoses are fron VW LT truck.

I looked at my six and the brake line is above the oil line
don't have a camera or i would shoot a pic

[meursault]

Hi, Timo!

You're right. The transmission I'm running is the '70-'71 911 (type 901) box. I flipped the ring and pinion, naturally.

The flexible hose is a used hose I found around the shop. It cracked as I tried to bend it. I thought I'd see if that type of hose would work before I bought a new one.

You still may be right about the 4 cyl. mount thing. I hadn't thought of that. I will be using a bulkhead mount for this conversion. The Patrick mount, again, is for the test fit only.

The oil tank isn't entirely attached. Two nuts hold the studs down with a few threads. I need to get some small parts from the dealer to finish the installation. I also need to wrangle with the oil line out of the tank and figure out if I can tighten it with the oil tank in the car. (I'm thinking that's not the case).

Thanks for the suggestions!

Thanks for the suggestions.

[914Timo]

The transmission I'm running is the '70-'71 911 (type 901) box.

Wow !! If I look very closely the first pic, have you converted it to side sifter too ??

[meursault]

Wow !! If I look very closely the first pic, have you converted it to side sifter too ??

Yep. It's a Frankenstein gearbox. The case, intermediate plate, and all the gearing is from the 911.

Shift rods and shift console are from a 914 sideshifter box that was sacrificed because an axle whacked the starter, destroying its case.

Just for kicks, the nosecone is an early tailshifter piece with part of the casting sawed off so it looks like a 914-6 nosecone. Since no shifting is occurring in that area, a pipe plug now fills the hole.

The bellcrank is from the 911, just cut and re-welded to get the proper 914-6 angle.

Drive flanges are from a sportomatic gearbox to better accomodate the Frankenstein big CV axles. We'll see how this all works. I'll post more pictures later on this week.

Thanks for your interest. I hope to work everything out soon!

[914Timo]

I am sorry I am nearly destroing your topic with all my questions, but I have to ask this; are you using 914 or 911 drive axles ??

I suppose you have bigger six bolt CV joints (outer diameter 100mm) if you have drive flanges from a sportomatic. So, you have to use 911 axles also.... Do you ??

Sorry about all my replys, but you have really interesting conversion. Good luck. I hope some will come and give you good answers, so that you can soon (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_flagge24.gif)

[meursault]

I suppose you have bigger six bolt CV joints (outer diameter 100mm) if you have drive flanges from a sportomatic. So, you have to use 911 axles also.... Do you ??

I'll try to answer this as best as I can. Everything from the flanges to the hubs is 911. I'm using the large CVs, as found on '69-'71 911s. Basically, these are the same size as turbo CVs. Whereas turbos use 6 bolts to attach the CVs to the flanges (I think), I'm running the 4 10mm bolts and two rollpins, as the '69-'71 911s did.

This conversion is kind of being done on the cheap, using parts I have access to and can cobble together. Here's how the axles worked out:

shafts are the longer '72-'73 911 units

CVs and boots are used '69-'71 911 units, cleaned, re-packed, and installed on the '72-'73 shafts.

Drive flanges (transmission side) are from a Sportomatic transmission of the same period.

Stub axles and hubs are again from a '69-'71 911.

I'm using 914-6 rotors and 914-4 calipers.

Hope that helps. I am concerned that at least on one side, with the wheels unsprung, I can grab the shaft and not be able to move it back and forth. I wonder whether I need to have any play at this extreme of the suspension travel.

[scotty]

Couldn't you just cut-n-splice a 90 degree bend into the line from the tank to the cooler to get rid of the kink? It looks like that line would be a perfect fit (length) if it didn't have to have that adapter on the tank...

[meursault]

Scotty-

Everything you see in that pic of the lines to the oil cooler should be 914-6 parts. They should fit. I'm trying to figure out why they don't. I don't want to go splicing factory lines unless it's absolutely necessary. Thanks for the suggestion, though.

[meursault]

More pics of my transmission:

[meursault]

and another. Hope these answer any questions.

[Steve]

That is a really cool conversion.
I wonder if the 70/71 911 trans would work with a stock 3.2 flywheel and clutch.
I'm using a stock 914 trans with a kep flywheel clutch kit.
That's weird about the return line.
When I had my 2.7 I was running a stock 914-6 metal return line to the tank.
I had to replace the fitting on the motor with an earlier fitting to make the stock 914-6 return line work.
I'm now running the stock metal 911 return line but its cut off in front of the motor.
It has an earl fitting welded to it so I can run an external thermostat.
The mocal thermostat connects to the tank and a GT front oil cooler.
The cut stock metal 911 return line is a tight fit between the oil return tubes and the heat exchangers but it works fine.
I would check with Jim at Patrick motor sports.
My return line works great.
I'm also running a stock 911 oil cooler that was cut and a 90 degree fitting was welded on. The fitting allows me to run AN fittings and a steel braided line to the tank.
All my metric to an adapters came from pegasus.

Best of luck with your conversion.
We're all very curious about your trans and CV combo!!!

Steve