Which motor for future turbo?, my first post. Options

[sgray944t]

Sorry for the repetitive questions, its alot to take in.

[sgray944t]

So what about the possibility of a 930 motor? Would it fit just the same as another 6 or would it not fit at all becuase of the turbo location?

[Mueller]

QUOTE (sgray944t @ Apr 3 2005, 02:49 PM)

So what about the possibility of a 930 motor? Would it fit just the same as another 6 or would it not fit at all becuase of the turbo location?

you'll have to play with the exhuast and location of the turbo.....the motor will bolt right up, but the turbo/exhaust will need to be modifed/moved around....not that big of deal, mount the turbo inside the engine compartment or hang it out in the back ...it's been done both ways...

[sgray944t]

You dont by any chance know of a webpage of someone who has done this do you? I searched google and couldnt find anything.

[Mueller]

3.0 turbo 914

Roger Clewitt 3.1 liter turbo 914

[Qarl]

Its not as expensive as others would have you believe. If you can do a little welding or know someone who can, it can be done for less than a PMO carb conversion.
The silicone intake boots that replace the stock rubber one that ties the cis intake plate and the throttle body are the tough ones, I am considering making some using silicone and aluminum sometime in the future, The ones I am using are from a BAE kit, if you can find the old bonnets from a kit, the rest is actually pretty straight forward but you will have to do your own fabricating like I have.
Even a low boost 3.0 sc engine is quite a thrilll.
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

[Qarl]

Oops, I am logged in as Qarl, This is IAMCHAPPY on Qarls computer, Oh by they way just had a ride in the Lotus, very, very cool, reminds me of the car scene in a clockwork orange.
Talk about tight.

[sgray944t]

Unfortunately I dont think BAE is in buisness anymore, so I would need to get custome exhaust manifolds if I was using the 930 motor. It seems like that might be easier than trying to boost an SC engine, since I will only need to reposition the turbo and not fabricate intake and exhaust stuff for the SC.

[Mueller]

QUOTE

Unfortunately I dont think BAE is in buisness anymore, so I would need to get custome exhaust manifolds if I was using the 930 motor. It seems like that might be easier than trying to boost an SC engine, since I will only need to reposition the turbo and not fabricate intake and exhaust stuff for the SC.

I'm 99% sure both cars above are using the same exhaust that you'd run on a NA motor...nothing too custom....

The only "custom" part of the exhaust is the tube that connects both banks together to the turbo.....

[Qarl]

Its not that easy with a 930, you still will have to fabricate intake plumbing and exhaust, and you will need to fiqure out a flywheel that will work, The 930 Cis uses 2 fuel pumps, it is not a straight forward install but nothing like this is. I picked up a used BAE kit when I started my project but if you could make up something to work like the BAE bonnets the rest is not to diffiicult to assemble..

[Mueller]

QUOTE

Its not that easy with a 930,

won't the NA parts from an SC bolt to the 930 block or are they that much different??

[ArtechnikA]

while y'all are working on intake and exhaust manifolds (stock HE's won't live long with the heat, and headers although better, especially thermal coated, are still highter-gauge and different metal than the 830's...) don't forget the other parts that made the Turbo Carrera special -- the turbo scavenge oil pump that allows the low mounting position. the factory used the same nutating oil pump that once powered the torque convertor for the SportOMatic, driven from the and of a camshaft like an MFI pump.

when you go deciding where you're going to be mounting turbos, give some serious consideration to how you're going to get the oily foam out of the bottom of the turbo and back to - where? sump? oil tank? pick a place ...

[sgray944t]

Well when I get around to it Im going to have to just make a copy of someones BAE kit for the SC motor. Although a 930 motor would be really neat, the special items it has would make it a far more complicated swap. Plus I kind of like the higher compression ratio of the SC motor vs. the 930. Although 20 years ago a low low c/r was necesarry, I think running 8-9psi on an SC motors c/r would be more fun than a 930 motor due to the off boost response.

[Qarl]

This post is by IAMCHAPPY on Qarls computer,
sc cams are one of the upgrades they do to 930 engines, my next upgrade will be changing out the piston and cylinders to a more boost tolerant combo, but I have high boost asperations with all the other nessescities in place.

The oil scavenge pump was a pretty easy install on the back of the cam on the sc engine, and the pumps can be pickup up pretty cheap, I paid 50.00 for mine then purchased two fittings from Pegasus from metric to 8an.

the sc engine really runs great at 9lbs with fuel enrichment via a 7th injector and has been proven to be very reliable over many years of hard use.

Aso the 3.0 and 3.2s are easier and less expensive to find in good condition than a 930 engine.

[Cap'n Krusty]

We need to get some semantics dealt with here. An SC IS a 930 motor. The 911 Turbo motor is based on a 930 case, as is the 911SC, with different crank, rods, pistons and cylinders, cams, and a lot of other stuff.

If you want to put a basic 911 motor in a 914 chassis, especially a big motor, you will need to gather together parts which can (and usually do) cost as much as the motor. You'll need to reinforce the chassis as well. You can EASILY get into a car with a 911 engine swap to the tune of $12-15K (including the cost of a nice roller) without labor. A lot of us have done these, and most of us have been amazed at how quickly the nickel and dime stuff adds up. As others have said, you'll need to do the brakes, and the tranny may not be sufficient to handle the increased torque of a big motor. Putting a turbo into the equation might well double the costs.

I've done a a conversion with a 2.7 RS style MFI motor and 79 turbo brakes, with 7s and 8s and SC rear flares. We're guesstimating 275 HP and the car was scary fast, without any of the heat and throttle lag problems of a turbo. By the time the car went from a 1.7 to a 2 litre, then a 2.4T, then the 2.7, including the body and paint, sound system, and interior, the guy had spent $40K. It was almost as fast as his SCCA GT2 car.

My suggestion would be to find a car someone has already done (and done right) and drive it for a while. The Cap'n

[Qarl]

This is IAMCHAPPY again not Qarl.

There is some truth to what the captn says, but if your patient and shop around it can also be done on a budget. I have about 12,000 total into mine and it still needs a paint job and some new trim pieces, but the high performance parts and additions on my car are as long as my arm and it scares me to think of what it would of cost me if I hadnt shopped around, and pieced it all together.

[sgray944t]

I know the SC and 930 motor are based off the same blocks, I was just using those references to quickly differentiate them in a way I thought people would understand. I understand that these conversions can get very pricey but Im not really concerned with that. That being said there is a limit to how much I can spend on the swap itself, but I dont see the necesity in spending 12k on the swap alone unless your buying all new parts at dealer prices. Im not trying to turn this thread into a pricing one becuase even being here only a few weeks I have read plenty. Im more concerned with getting the right parts to build a 250hp NA motor and then having the later ability to turbocharge it without having to swap all the internals out. I think that is doable on a 3.0liter street/track motor without THAT much trouble. If I'm wrong please correct me.
By the way thanks for responding guys this is the most help I've ever gotten on a forum, even ones I have been a part of for over a year!!

[Mueller]

QUOTE

I think that is doable on a 3.0liter street/track motor without THAT much trouble.

it purely depends on your skill and your definition of trouble (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)

some people are very skilled with the needed resources to get the job done, some are very skilled but do not have the needed resources but figure out a way...then there are some people that shouldn't own a screwdriver since they are not sure which end to use (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)