Interesting...anyone else experience this? Options

[veekry9]

The rotating flow also occurs laterally,a huge drag penalty that increases with speed.
A simple aero test in the car on the freeway can be done with talc powder and cellcam.
Or a hair dryer on a scale model in the shower.
/

[veekry9]

Oops,my bad,did read the cpr long ago.
Do use the link to the site's tests,valid args made.

(The model from above),constrained flow area,disregarded below 12".
The rotating bubble at approx 20mph.
The mirror moving the flow below the fenderline.
The tumbling flow inside the cockpit is drag too.
The affected airmass is much larger than that depicted.
At the rear,the flow's direction is reversed as is the top's,tumbling into a bubble that grows with speed.
/
These are not the only aero pix we have read of over all time,hence my faux pas,selecting their stuff.
Thanks for pointing that out.
/

[Cracker]

...this topic really resonates with you! Very good. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

T

[r_towle]

If you follow the link I posted, you will see the original data and analysis that goes along with the pictures the Veekry is posting from the original scientific research.

His opinion aside, it might be worth noting that the site is copywrited, and the author has a pretty specific claim to not reprint his research.

That is why I posted a link to the entire research, it puts it all in context with some very detailed and pretty valid conclusions.

It also give credit where credit is due.

[veekry9]

About to Snap.

The other thing,that inside rear looks way wrong,the roll excessive,the angle of the dangle too steep.
It is true that the relocation of the suspension is a large task,lowering the rear to racetrack heights changes the geometry dramatically.
A raised pivot is the way,when using larger dia tires and a stance lowered to (4-4.75") 10-12cm.


When everything changed.
Note the roll is reduced,the front wheel steering into the slide.
Still slipping,on the trailing throttle,clutch engaged.

https://www.youtube.com/user/maicy123/videos
/

[Cracker]

I've got a less scientific explanation for what occured (I've watched that video two-dozen times), "In way over his head". The first indication of that was his lack of car control and poor instincts...the second was, he kicked the car upon exiting". Bush league and amateur written all over both.

T

[Cracker]

Rich - Thank you. I am aware of the professors "assignments" and have actually designed a few things within the build around the data. Thank you for the link.

T

[Dave_Darling]

John Rogers over on the Bird Board put a diverter across the back of his roof. It was a simple ~quarter-round bent piece of metal, which took some of the air going back along his roof and pushed it down toward the engine bay opening. He did it primarily for cooling, as I recall.

It would be interesting to see if it had any significant effect on aero.

--DD

[veekry9]

Agreed,though I tried to not be so harsh,and thought the lift and steering input may have been to avoid the halfwit in the blue shirt.
I too would be a little pissed,not saving the slide,tee-boning a boulder in Colorado.
I didn't notice a Hans device,that was a good jolt,and anyone on the tracks should use them.(He did)
That is the fun part of putting your favorite theory on the track,to prove out or crap out,costs too.
It's all good to analyze later what happened and make the preps to attenuate such wiggly behaviour,like riding a sidewinder.
A fast pace requires fast inputs,lock to lock,here's a few vids I chose that demonstrate.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6Thomd4BQg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKHnJ8kojKA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MpwpRQ6Vouc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeZiEfswGX4
Ask any racer if they have crashed.
I had a chance to see Mario hit Roberto Roberto Guerrero's stopped car here in Toronto.
He later said in an interview that the car's construction is what made survival possible.
He stood for a few moments on the far side of the chainlink,I would suppose,in wonder.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_cc9MXdE6A...be&t=18m35s
/

[Cracker]

Dave - I've thought about something like that...was even thinking about yesterday again (ala the old BMW 3.0 CSL batmobiles). I see allot of drag for the sake of cooling...in MY application, it does not seem worthwhile. Thanks.

T

John Rogers over on the Bird Board put a diverter across the back of his roof. It was a simple ~quarter-round bent piece of metal, which took some of the air going back along his roof and pushed it down toward the engine bay opening. He did it primarily for cooling, as I recall.

It would be interesting to see if it had any significant effect on aero.

--DD

[sixnotfour]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

[veekry9]

The road is open for familiarity runs,watch that edge.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)



LowDownSlicksterVeeWingedWonder.
/

[r_towle]

For a completely different reason I was going to try and put a second piece of lexan on the outside of the rear window, at an angle so the bottom would be about 1/2 inch away from the inner piece, and the top would be 2-3 inches away.

Similar to a sound booth (music industry) glass divider, I was hunting for noise reduction.

Given that, I wonder if it would make any difference at all for what you are trying to do.

I bet your issue could be tested with Saran Wrap.....cause you could see if bow in, or flutter out .....

Rich

[r_towle]

Rich - Thank you. I am aware of the professors "assignments" and have actually designed a few things within the build around the data. Thank you for the link.

T

Gotta admit, good way to get testing done....

[sixnotfour]

Do you run with windows down ?? if so some run holes in the plexi right behind the seat belt mount to allow the air to flow thru..

[1stworks]

I've got a less scientific explanation for what occured (I've watched that video two-dozen times), "In way over his head". The first indication of that was his lack of car control and poor instincts...the second was, he kicked the car upon exiting". Bush league and amateur written all over both.

T

I know the driver of that car and he's not a experienced driver.
Probably never drove 914 before that car.
He is a fantastic motorcycle rider.He lives and grew up in Woodland Park Colorado.Raced Pikes Peak on motorcycle a few times.....

[veekry9]

Well then,He's quite intimate with the most dangerous racetrack to the heavens.
An off here and the results,like any mountain course,is life altering.
#395,looked for the records,no find.Many drivers have failed at the Peak.
He'll be back.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTiTPAusog4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXgWWNJVdYA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFxzf6-j5O4
/

[veekry9]

LongitudinalTrailingarmTwist_101,a trait they all have.
The effect that bit his ass,crunching into that boulder.
Why,I'll bet the hornet's paint is still on the slightly perturbed pink syeno/monzo granite.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
Seriously,the solution to the problem is the use of radius rods.
Assisted roll control and axle stability parts to make a better handler.
The vid again:Clutch.
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...84482&st=10

https://www.google.ca/webhp?sourceid=chrome...0peak%20geology
/

[Cracker]

I believe one can drive in such a manner that diminishes the abuse and stress placed upon the suspension and chassis. I do not do allot of things with the car like...drift, spin the tires, drop the clutch, I "roll-on" power gradually, etc.

This will go a long ways towards extending the usefulness of the components. Not forever but a longer useful life...I may be wrong but this is how I approach driving my car.

T

[1stworks]

I believe one can drive in such a manner that diminishes the abuse and stress placed upon the suspension and chassis. I do not do allot of things with the car like...drift, spin the tires, drop the clutch, etc.

This will go a long ways towards extending the usefulness of the components. Not forever but a longer useful life...I may be wrong but this is how I approach driving my car.

T

I guess I have trouble coming my way.I do all those thing on a regular basis lol.
I've tried to break it but no dice it just keeps taking it...

Well over 1000 road miles, some auto X and drag strip.

Even my Craigslist 5.3 lm33 and eBay 100K trans seems stout.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)