Is this picture photo shopped?, I never saw a 904 up close Options

[Tom_T]

Scale the weights... All Porsches up til the mid- 70's weighed no more than 2200 lbs... 914s are just at 1800-2000, and those are street cars.

The 904 was just a fiberglass shelled "unibody" race-car. Definite death trap in collision on the street. That Cayman is a Pig at 2900 lbs.

Actually, you're a tad low on your weights - except for lightened cars for race/AX/rally/etc.

The 70's 911's were over 2200#, as were our 914's being in the 2000-2270-ish range on the -6 range.

Note the `73 R&T test of the 914-2.0 below lists CW at 2145# ....



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Tom
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[Rand]

Thanks for the facts, Tom. I was a little baffled at the 1800# claim too. That's where my last one was, but it took a whole hell of a lot of work to get down there. There were zero amenities left, lots of controversial losses. Like the emissions crap, including the charcoal canister delete that some scoff at - but a pound is a pound and you have to get it everywhere you can. You cannot get to #1800 without some serious work and sacrifices.

[Tom_T]

Say what you want about how big the modern Porsches are but they also make it possible to drive them daily. I use my Cayman S like I would a modern SUV (minus the hauling of big stuff) and it's great. Long trips or spending several hours in the car are not an issue. Also, the A/C is great.
I still have a couple of 914's for that raw, true sports car feeling but I wouldn't trade the convenience of my Cayman S for anything.

IMHO I think they both have their place - including those between the earliest up to the latest, & coming ones! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

I think folks are just noting the differences in size/wt., & not necessarily bashing the Caymans etc.

And I was saying above, that our 914s are not as unsafe as some were assuming. They also could be had with AC then & now, for those sticky South TX & hot/dry SoCal summers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

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Tom
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[Tom_T]

Thanks for the facts, Tom. I was a little baffled at the 1800# claim too. That's where my last one was, but it took a whole hell of a lot of work to get down there. There were zero amenities left, lots of controversial losses. Like the emissions crap, including the charcoal canister delete that some scoff at - but a pound is a pound and you have to get it everywhere you can. You cannot get to #1800 without some serious work and sacrifices.

Wouldn't it be great Rand - if Porsche would stick their new turbo flat-4 WBXs from the new 718 Boxster/Cayman - into a somewhat smaller sub-Boxster body/chassis that weighed-in in the 2000-2500# range now - even if they won't give credit to our 914s in the naming!!?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)

I'm sure that they could even modify the original Boxster prototype a bit to get to that size & weight goal - & then beat the pants off of the Miata/Alpha/Fiat contenders with a middie engine. even if it cost a bit more than those contenders in the sub-Boxster/Cayman segment! IIRC, that prototype started out smaller & lighter & therefore closer to a "current sub-Boxster" - as they have grown a bit.

The perfect "extra car" weekend racer, AXer, & weekend fun car!



Maybe even another JV with VW is in line?? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)
- on paper this time so Porsche doesn't get jacked around again as they were on the 1st on the 914 - then VW can do their own design take for a "new Ghia" too! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)


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Tom
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[stuttgart46]

No offense taken Tom. They're all great cars. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I'm trying to find a pic of the 919 compared to a new Boxster or Cayman. I'm curious as to what the size difference is there.

[Tom_T]

No offense taken Tom. They're all great cars. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I'm trying to find a pic of the 919 compared to a new Boxster or Cayman. I'm curious as to what the size difference is there.

Try to find one comparing the 917, 918 & 919 - that would be an interesting comparison too.

The cars shows where I've seen 918s next to Boxter/Cayman - the 918 is similarly lower, but a tad wider & longer - like in the 917-914 pic.

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Tom
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[JmuRiz]

In person the 919 and Audi R18 are very small.

[Dave_Darling]

BTW, the car maker is ALFA, not Alpha. It's actually an acronym, which stands for (rough translation) "Company in Lombardy that Makes Automobiles". Just like FIAT is an acronym for "Maker of Italian Automobiles in Turin".

Sadly, I'm pretty sure the sub-Boxster will never happen. Porsche's goal is to make money, and the higher-end the cars are the more money they make. A lower-cost "mass-market" car is not going to be the profit-generator that their current lineup has.

--DD

[Tom_T]

BTW, the car maker is ALFA, not Alpha. It's actually an acronym, which stands for (rough translation) "Company in Lombardy that Makes Automobiles". Just like FIAT is an acronym for "Maker of Italian Automobiles in Turin".

Sadly, I'm pretty sure the sub-Boxster will never happen. Porsche's goal is to make money, and the higher-end the cars are the more money they make. A lower-cost "mass-market" car is not going to be the profit-generator that their current lineup has.

--DD

Thanx for the ALFA/FIAT correction Dave - I actually knew that back in the gray cell recesses, but I must've hit the wrong spellcheck option for my too-fast typing! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

At $40-50K of the initial years of the Boxster, it wouldn't exactly be an economy sports car, & the base Macan S was introduced in March 2015 at $49,900 IIRC, & the base V6 Cayenne was around that range when it was introduced in `04 I think (V8 Cay S came out first).

So Porsche has a long history of both having their financial butts saved by such more mundane or commonplace cars for the masses (according to the 911-only & up crowd) - as our 914/4s did for them in the early `70's, as well as starting them out in a reasonable price range.

Speaking of which - both the Macan & Cayenne are both shared VW/Audi/Porsche platforms, & are saving their fannies now, enabling them to make the more expensive & higher margin cars.

They also need to sell more cars with higher mpg to meet the upcoming CAFE standards - even with the recent downsizing of them - & a few very high priced hybrids & future EVs will nOT let them meet them. Whereas, if they sold as many sub-Boxters with more mpg than the then current CAFE level - then it's a simple matter of math - division of many high mpg cars in the fleet, to offset those with lower mpg than the standard.

Many cars with just a small mpg over the target, will be easier to offset the total fleet numbers - than will a few very hi mpg hybrid/EV cars whose "overage mpg" would have to be very high for an equal effect.

It's just that their management folks are as or more fickle than a "high-acquaintance woman" (or man), & keep dithering on the sub-Boxster. IMHO, the math of CAFE mpg & being able to sell that 3rd Porsche (or 4th, 5th, etc.) to the wealthier, as well as some as entry level NEW Porsches will eventually bring them around.

After all, they've announced, recinded & re-announced a couple of times already on it!

JMHO, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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[carr914]

The 904 was just a fiberglass shelled "unibody" race-car. Definite death trap in collision on the street.

There were 904s and 906s that were Sold for Street Use!

[914forme]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

904 was also crash tested.



Seemed to do pretty well for being dropped from a crane, into a concrete pad

[Unobtanium-inc]

The 904 was just a fiberglass shelled "unibody" race-car. Definite death trap in collision on the street.

There were 904s and 906s that were Sold for Street Use!

Butzi's wife had one with higher doors, so they would clear the curbs when she went shopping downtown.

[JmuRiz]

And I know Jeff Zwart drives his 906 to cars and coffee on the street. I've seen pictures and it's scary to see bumpers over head-height.

[mbseto]

Actually folks, Porsche did a pretty good job about designing in crumple zones & crash survivability into our 914s, & I have a couple of friends, as well as there being some members on here, who are alive &/or not seriously injured thanx to that design!
...
So do not sell our little 914s short in that respect, relative to a current Porsche - even with today's higher speeds! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

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Tom
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Tom; I'm in total agreement, and I also have a friend that totaled a 914 and walked away because of good design. Just pointing out that the crumple zones are getting larger.

[SKL1]

I remember when in high school I had friends with a TR3 and a MG Midget- we didn't worry about it back then and we lived thru it... another buddy had a 427 'vette, and we were VERY lucky to have lived thru many rides in that beast!!
If you are constantly worried about getting hit if you're driving your 914, or any classic for that matter, then sit at home on the couch and never leave your house!

[Tom_T]

I remember when in high school I had friends with a TR3 and a MG Midget- we didn't worry about it back then and we lived thru it... another buddy had a 427 'vette, and we were VERY lucky to have lived thru many rides in that beast!!
If you are constantly worried about getting hit if you're driving your 914, or any classic for that matter, then sit at home on the couch and never leave your house!

My uncle had a 58 Vette with a 327 which he pumped-ed in the 60's, which he drove from Santa Ana back to Pittsburgh PA when we still lived there - 48 hours flat on old 66 - not interstates back then, & then I rode in it with him back there & after we moved to San Diego in `63, & got to drive it some. He also raced it at the old OC Raceway drag strip & held 1st in class for a couple of years until he built it's "Rail," he also built a 32 Ford Roadster (with Rumble Seat intact) with a 427 - eventually blown/supercharged, in which I also rode around in, & the Vette & 32 Roadster were both "street legal" then (more or less). (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Riding around with my Uncle Merrill in his HiPo specials gave "hair raising" a completely new meaning! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/yikes.gif)

Fiberglass Vette body, chopped 32 Ford steel partial body, steel tube frame with tiny fiberglass shell on the Rail - none were much crash protection!

Later in `75 when I bought my 73 914-2.0 he chided me mercilessly for "...paying as much for a little 4 cylinder Porsche, as for a nice used V8 Vette!" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

However, after I took him out in it with me on one of our OC twisties (Live Oak Canyon Rd. for those who kow the area here), he did concede that it was pretty fun! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif)

He never could drive it though, at 6'-5" 275 with UUUUGE size 16 shoes - they had to get one of the pro Steelers to donate their old set of size 16 cleats in order for him to play HS Football back in the late 40's/early 50's - so it was absolutely impossible for him to work the pedals on our 914s! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

So I guess I agree, if you're concerned or lack the Cajones - use the Camry or stay at home! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

And I'm of the same opinion about all the "Nannies" on modern sports cars & sedans that mask all of the driver's & car's shortcomings, & often likewise save their fannies. Although useful for the latter in safety - they never let a driver learn & hone their driving skills thru their own mistakes - what with all that electronic "cover-up."

So my point is, that our 914s & the other old school basic sports cars/coupes/sedans serve a purpose even today, & shouldn't be discounted because they're smaller & lighter than today's offerings.

By the same token, I think this is a valuable discussion on here, & am not discounting the values of the current vehicles.

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Tom
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[TJB/914]

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[sixnotfour]

Only thing around to compare with...

[Rand]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) Does this 914 make my Deere(iere) look fat?

[Tom_T]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

Great pix Tom!

Although I must say, that the brown grass looks more like CA out here in the drought now! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
Tom
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