billet intermediate plates, experiences? and specifically bearing question Options

[brant]

So I pulled the stack out of the race car this weekend for intermediate plate bearing inspection. Of the 4-5 tranny's I've lost racing over the last years... its always been the intermediate plate bearings that have failed.

I realize this may be due to a combination of factors
-old bearings
-flex in the intermediate plates, causing the bearing failures


So this weekend, I had good news... no impending bearing failure that I could visually detect

still I think its time to upgrade to a billet intermediate plate before too long.


1) I'd love to know which brands of billet intermediate plates people are using?

2) I'd really love to know, if anyone makes a billet plate that takes an aftermarket (much more affordable) bearing. I see PMS has the factory Porsche bearings at $400+, but wouldn't it make sense to produce a billet intermediate plate that took a more cost effective non Porsche bearing? maybe its out there, I haven't researched much yet.... thought I'd start here with the brain trust.

tia
brant

[Cracker]

Brant,

I can't offer much help here but I had installed a CMS unit on my original build, along with their shift forks and bearing retainer. The retainer made a lot of sense to me if you going that far anyway. I was pretty hard on that trans - tracked it a few times - spun the tires a BUNCH on throttle - lots of WOT passes. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)

I stripped fourth gear clean - that was with 425 hp/425 tq. I knew going into that project that a 901 was the wrong choice - I had CMS flip the R&P and rebuild my 930 box. They know what they are doing - talk to Roger if you call. If you add anything - add it all. With your power and treatment - I bet you'll be just fine for a long time.

Best wishes.

Tony

[brant]

Good info.
I will look for their website today
I have a lot of research to do on this one

[campbellcj]

Brant,

I know this is limited value but I'm pretty certain I have the classic Weltmeister billet plate and factory bearings from the early 2000's, and it has held up very well. Trans will have to be opened up sometime in 2017 for syncros and other freshening and I'll share any interesting discoveries then.

[stownsen914]

I was planning to switch to an aluminum intermediate plate for my racecar (260 hp 911 motor), so I did some research on this a while back. There are a couple others out there too - either CB or JB Racing maybe? Most people I've asked reported that it's supposed to be a good upgrade, though interestingly Brad R. posted once years ago that one aluminum plate that he installed caused the internal shift rods to be tight due to improper sizing/clearance on the bores. Maybe that's something to check or ask about. CMS has a good reputation, so I would think theirs should be a good one.

[Matt Romanowski]

We used one from California Motorsports. It will be for sale this winter with a bunch of our 901 stuff. We killed 4th gear for the last time.....

We have the intermediate plate, side plate, bearing retainer, Tangerine shifter, and a Rennshifter.

[campbellcj]

We used one from California Motorsports. It will be for sale this winter with a bunch of our 901 stuff. We killed 4th gear for the last time.....

We have the intermediate plate, side plate, bearing retainer, Tangerine shifter, and a Rennshifter.

Hey Matt - I may be very interested in a complete track-built trans or bits for one when you're ready to sell. Feel free to PM/email me when the time comes. Sounds like you're moving to a 915 or ?

[brant]

We used one from California Motorsports. It will be for sale this winter with a bunch of our 901 stuff. We killed 4th gear for the last time.....

We have the intermediate plate, side plate, bearing retainer, Tangerine shifter, and a Rennshifter.

Matt,

in all of the transmissions you have been through...
do all of the intermediate plates run a Porsche stock bearing ?
does the California Motorsports?

I keep having the bearing fail in the intermediate plate
wondered if any of the billet plates had gone to an aftermarket bearing that might be:

1)higher quality
2)not $400/more affordable (its still only a bearing)

[Matt Romanowski]

Matt,

in all of the transmissions you have been through...
do all of the intermediate plates run a Porsche stock bearing ?
does the California Motorsports?

I keep having the bearing fail in the intermediate plate
wondered if any of the billet plates had gone to an aftermarket bearing that might be:

1)higher quality
2)not $400/more affordable (its still only a bearing)

They have all taken stock bearings. I haven't had the bearings fail. It's usually part of the ring and pinion that starts going. If we miss the start and it chunks, it will hurt the bearings. Interesting that you have had bearing failures.

I would suggest you have the bearings, races, gears, ring, pinion, and anything else you can send cryo treated and REM polished. I would also suggest Amsoil gear lube. I think it was as good as the really expensive stuff.

[Matt Romanowski]

We used one from California Motorsports. It will be for sale this winter with a bunch of our 901 stuff. We killed 4th gear for the last time.....

We have the intermediate plate, side plate, bearing retainer, Tangerine shifter, and a Rennshifter.

Hey Matt - I may be very interested in a complete track-built trans or bits for one when you're ready to sell. Feel free to PM/email me when the time comes. Sounds like you're moving to a 915 or ?

I'll post it up when we're ready. We are doing a 915 with Martin's 916 kit, custom gears, and a LSD. It should be pretty awesome.

[brant]

Matt,

in all of the transmissions you have been through...
do all of the intermediate plates run a Porsche stock bearing ?
does the California Motorsports?

I keep having the bearing fail in the intermediate plate
wondered if any of the billet plates had gone to an aftermarket bearing that might be:

1)higher quality
2)not $400/more affordable (its still only a bearing)

They have all taken stock bearings. I haven't had the bearings fail. It's usually part of the ring and pinion that starts going. If we miss the start and it chunks, it will hurt the bearings. Interesting that you have had bearing failures.

I would suggest you have the bearings, races, gears, ring, pinion, and anything else you can send cryo treated and REM polished. I would also suggest Amsoil gear lube. I think it was as good as the really expensive stuff.

I like the cryogenic idea.
I don't have the torque to tear out the ring/pinion. But my rpm still creates a lot of heat and the bearings seem to be the first thing for me

[ThePaintedMan]

You're running a cooler though, correct Brant?

[brant]

You're running a cooler though, correct Brant?

Yes sir

[J P Stein]

I dunno........
I had the same trans (stocker) in my car for about 12 years.......& beat the crap out of it.
Sure, it was only at AX.
Replaced some bits and reduced it to a 2 speed.....so I was quite familiar with its guts.
Brit started feeding it around 350hp thru & began busting up driveline parts in a few months of driving it.

The intermediate plate was never a problem.......but hay, it's your money.

[jd74914]

I would suggest you have the bearings, races, gears, ring, pinion, and anything else you can send cryo treated and REM polished. I would also suggest Amsoil gear lube. I think it was as good as the really expensive stuff.

I like the cryogenic idea.
I don't have the torque to tear out the ring/pinion. But my rpm still creates a lot of heat and the bearings seem to be the first thing for me

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) I have no 914 tranny experience, but we kept breaking 2nd gear teeth on a GSXR motor in car and ended up cryoing it with great success. We used to go through at least one second gear pair per season and the cryo'd set has lasted 4 years so far. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Edit: These guys did the gears and they were very inexpensive and quite fast. http://hekimianracing.com/

[naro914]

We had a CMS intermediate plate in the 901 we had in Papa Smurf and it was the only trans that lasted (longer than the engine...ha!). Had cooling too. most other 901's ate a gear or something every year. Upgraded to a 915 because I figured it was just a matter of time for the 901 with 360+ hp...

I don't know the bearing - we bought it, installed (along with Guards LSD) and drove it.

[Jetsetsurfshop]

Found these pieces in the bottom of my transmission yesterday.
The roll pin was removed, half of it was missing.
Think these chunk are from that bearing?

[brant]

Is that the roll pin on the shifter console?

There is a trick to weld those because the can come out. You replace with a bolt I believe and the weld

Is one of those pieces an electrical fitting or brass bearing retainer? Did it shift funny or happen on an impact?

[Jetsetsurfshop]

The roll pin came from the top set of gears on the nose cone side. There was only 1/2 of it still in there. May have been like that before. Who knows?
The bearing and the brass piece, we believe, came from one of the bearings in this pic.
It did have some shifting problems after the accident. I figured it had something to do with the broken mounts. We think that when the driver hit the car was still in gear.
Time to put in the back up trans. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smash.gif)