AC keep it or lose it? Options

[yellow75]

My 75 1.8 has dealer installed AC. Of course it doesn't work. I really don't need it either. Question is should I keep it? It was dealer installed not factory as with all of them, so it won't be on the Cardex. In my opinion is it's just taking up space. I have another trunk floor I can weld it when I take the condensor out. The bigger question is work much work will removing everything be?
____________

[PlantMan]

I removed mine recently as I continue to dismantle my car. It will take you a couple hours to get it out. You will need to spend sometime patching all the holes required to run the equipment, like the front trunk patch you mentioned. It caused a significant amount of rust problems in my car.

There are a couple interesting threads about the latest upgrades in technology that I would be interested in trying though.

We will see.

[Frankvw]

well...it depends.
The cosmetic things to solve after removal will be the hole below the condensor unit in your trunk, but also (maybe) the lower part of the dash, where the cold wind (should) vent out.
Sometimes removing them will leave some nasty holes in the lower dash, but that depends on your setup. Some of those AC lower pads look like they are factory, really nice, some are not so nice. The switch can be installed on the lowerpad, and wiill then be removed together with the pad, but maybe they drilled an extra hole in your dash....
The pump can be removed from the engine, together with the belt.
Hoses will problably run behind one of the rocker covers, and can be taken out (you will problably see them in the wheelwell going into the trunk.
A pic will help !
The fact that you can weld the trunk yourself does save a lot of labour/money from a shop, and if you can weld....you can do the rest yourself as well !
Good luck !

[Mark Henry]

You can sell the bits, southern guys like AC, so try not to wreck it as you remove it. the hoses will likely be replaced.

Restoration Design sells the bottom trunk (IIRC $200, or $300 for the full bottom) to repair the area, if you don't want to mess with a used bottom. It's a nice panel.

[Tom_T]

Hey PGH! ... from a PGH born in SoCal.

In PGH/Western PA you won't use the AC as much as in SoCal/Southwest or humid Southeast, but I know it still gets hot & humid there in PGH.

The dealer AC equipped cars are few & far between - relatively speaking - so IMHO not a negative to have it intact & usable.

As an alternative to removal, you might consider updating the system with a modern Sanden/sim. rotary compressor (which will only "rob" 1-2 HP, vs. 4-8 HP with the original York), will run on R134 Freon, & provide better cooling.

I'm pretty sure that you can install it in the original period correct dash vent unit, while the 1 or 2 evaporator/condensor units may need their own shrouds/housings.

Auto Atlanta, Retro Aire & some others offer good updated AC systems for 914s.

You can tell which dealer installed AC you have, by looking at the condenser coil in the front trunk - if it has a rectangular housing, then it's a VPC unit (VPC = Volkswagen Products Corp.); if it has a round conical (flat topped) housing, then it's a DPD unit. Both the VPC & DPD were "commisioned" to make AC unitis for Porsche 911/912/914

The DPD is better for allowing the spare to sit over it & at about the normal height so the floor board is at its normal height & you don't lose much trunk space. Whereas, the VPD has the big flat condenser which the spare sits on top of, & it eats up the trunk space by the height of the unit. The DPD in the cabin also has 2 vents further left to cool the driver with the controls centered under the air vent controls in the center of the dash face, whereas VPC

If you can fit the replacement condenser for the new unit within the DPD conical shroud or keep it's condenser operable with the upgrade, then you can save space with the spare nestled over it.

Note that you mount the spare with DPD AC opposite the factory position (with the inside of the wheel facing up), so that with the DPD the spare wheel outside faces up - since the inside is deeper & has the wheel sit lower over the conical housing, it's very close to the stock height position.

All that said, if you choose to remove it, as others on here have done - then beyond the front trunk floor, to do it right & avoid future rust & other problems, it's a bit more involved than just welding in another trunk floor piece. So you'll also need to remove the F-to-R AC lines (usually run behind the pass. side rocker panel) & weld up all the access holes that they drilled for the hoses to pass between the engine bay & front trunk bulkheads, etc.; remove the compressor & receiver/drier & their brackets, repair/weld any engine shelf cuts, & get a good used engine tin where they would've cut the original for the AC; & make sure to rust proof/primer all those welds before you repaint.

If you don't do it properly, then you'll make what looks to be a very nice 75, into a bit of a buggered up mess, with gaping holes inviting the "tin-worm" & other problems.

If it were mine, I'd bite the bullet & spring for the AC update, because all of the other work will cost about as much in labor & materials - even if you do it all yourself, your time is money, so apply your job's pay-rate to the time for a true comparison.

Go Steelers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
Tom
///////

[yellow75]

Hey PGH! ... from a PGH born in SoCal.

In PGH/Western PA you won't use the AC as much as in SoCal/Southwest or humid Southeast, but I know it still gets hot & humid there in PGH.

The dealer AC equipped cars are few & far between - relatively speaking - so IMHO not a negative to have it intact & usable.

As an alternative to removal, you might consider updating the system with a modern Sanden/sim. rotary compressor (which will only "rob" 1-2 HP, vs. 4-8 HP with the original York), will run on R134 Freon, & provide better cooling.

I'm pretty sure that you can install it in the original period correct dash vent unit, while the 1 or 2 evaporator/condensor units may need their own shrouds/housings.

Auto Atlanta, Retro Aire & some others offer good updated AC systems for 914s.

You can tell which dealer installed AC you have, by looking at the condenser coil in the front trunk - if it has a rectangular housing, then it's a VPC unit (VPC = Volkswagen Products Corp.); if it has a round conical (flat topped) housing, then it's a DPD unit. Both the VPC & DPD were "commisioned" to make AC unitis for Porsche 911/912/914

The DPD is better for allowing the spare to sit over it & at about the normal height so the floor board is at its normal height & you don't lose much trunk space. Whereas, the VPD has the big flat condenser which the spare sits on top of, & it eats up the trunk space by the height of the unit. The DPD in the cabin also has 2 vents further left to cool the driver with the controls centered under the air vent controls in the center of the dash face, whereas VPC

If you can fit the replacement condenser for the new unit within the DPD conical shroud or keep it's condenser operable with the upgrade, then you can save space with the spare nestled over it.

Note that you mount the spare with DPD AC opposite the factory position (with the inside of the wheel facing up), so that with the DPD the spare wheel outside faces up - since the inside is deeper & has the wheel sit lower over the conical housing, it's very close to the stock height position.

All that said, if you choose to remove it, as others on here have done - then beyond the front trunk floor, to do it right & avoid future rust & other problems, it's a bit more involved than just welding in another trunk floor piece. So you'll also need to remove the F-to-R AC lines (usually run behind the pass. side rocker panel) & weld up all the access holes that they drilled for the hoses to pass between the engine bay & front trunk bulkheads, etc.; remove the compressor & receiver/drier & their brackets, repair/weld any engine shelf cuts, & get a good used engine tin where they would've cut the original for the AC; & make sure to rust proof/primer all those welds before you repaint.

If you don't do it properly, then you'll make what looks to be a very nice 75, into a bit of a buggered up mess, with gaping holes inviting the "tin-worm" & other problems.

If it were mine, I'd bite the bullet & spring for the AC update, because all of the other work will cost about as much in labor & materials - even if you do it all yourself, your time is money, so apply your job's pay-rate to the time for a true comparison.

Go Steelers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
Tom
///////

Thanks! Great info here. W ill try and post some photos so it can be correctly identified. It IS marked VW and my spare does mount upside down as you described. Small world I moved here to new castle from FLORIDA!! Yes Go Stillers! But I REALLY can't wait for baseball season again. GO BUCS!

[mepstein]

Leaving or removing the a/c has nothing to do with the car rusting. The holes are already drilled. The engine tin and front trunk already cut. You can weld in the front trunk panel, seam seal it and paint. Cut the lines and then plug the holes from the hoses with plastic plugs. The engine tin can be easily repaired or replaced. It's not that big of a deal.

[Rsjg911]

Hey PGH! ... from a PGH born in SoCal.

In PGH/Western PA you won't use the AC as much as in SoCal/Southwest or humid Southeast, but I know it still gets hot & humid there in PGH.

The dealer AC equipped cars are few & far between - relatively speaking - so IMHO not a negative to have it intact & usable.

As an alternative to removal, you might consider updating the system with a modern Sanden/sim. rotary compressor (which will only "rob" 1-2 HP, vs. 4-8 HP with the original York), will run on R134 Freon, & provide better cooling.

I'm pretty sure that you can install it in the original period correct dash vent unit, while the 1 or 2 evaporator/condensor units may need their own shrouds/housings.

Auto Atlanta, Retro Aire & some others offer good updated AC systems for 914s.

You can tell which dealer installed AC you have, by looking at the condenser coil in the front trunk - if it has a rectangular housing, then it's a VPC unit (VPC = Volkswagen Products Corp.); if it has a round conical (flat topped) housing, then it's a DPD unit. Both the VPC & DPD were "commisioned" to make AC unitis for Porsche 911/912/914

The DPD is better for allowing the spare to sit over it & at about the normal height so the floor board is at its normal height & you don't lose much trunk space. Whereas, the VPD has the big flat condenser which the spare sits on top of, & it eats up the trunk space by the height of the unit. The DPD in the cabin also has 2 vents further left to cool the driver with the controls centered under the air vent controls in the center of the dash face, whereas VPC

If you can fit the replacement condenser for the new unit within the DPD conical shroud or keep it's condenser operable with the upgrade, then you can save space with the spare nestled over it.

Note that you mount the spare with DPD AC opposite the factory position (with the inside of the wheel facing up), so that with the DPD the spare wheel outside faces up - since the inside is deeper & has the wheel sit lower over the conical housing, it's very close to the stock height position.

All that said, if you choose to remove it, as others on here have done - then beyond the front trunk floor, to do it right & avoid future rust & other problems, it's a bit more involved than just welding in another trunk floor piece. So you'll also need to remove the F-to-R AC lines (usually run behind the pass. side rocker panel) & weld up all the access holes that they drilled for the hoses to pass between the engine bay & front trunk bulkheads, etc.; remove the compressor & receiver/drier & their brackets, repair/weld any engine shelf cuts, & get a good used engine tin where they would've cut the original for the AC; & make sure to rust proof/primer all those welds before you repaint.

If you don't do it properly, then you'll make what looks to be a very nice 75, into a bit of a buggered up mess, with gaping holes inviting the "tin-worm" & other problems.

If it were mine, I'd bite the bullet & spring for the AC update, because all of the other work will cost about as much in labor & materials - even if you do it all yourself, your time is money, so apply your job's pay-rate to the time for a true comparison.

Go Steelers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
Tom
///////

Thanks! Great info here. W ill try and post some photos so it can be correctly identified. It IS marked VW and my spare does mount upside down as you described. Small world I moved here to new castle from FLORIDA!! Yes Go Stillers! But I REALLY can't wait for baseball season again. GO BUCS!

Like Tom, I too grew up in The Burg (Sq. Hill) and agree with his recommendation to repair the unit. My reasoning is that the next custodian will place more value on the AC as opposed to repairs...plus you can still use it during the summers...like when it's raining...if you will drive it in the rain. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

So, don't be a J.O. and remove it...restore it! Tom really knows his stuff so I'm sure you could PM him for additional specifics.

Good luck and GO STILLERS (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

Ron

[Ansbacher]

I was in the same boat with my '74. I pulled all that junk out, patched the holes, etc. Car lost 67 lbs. doing it! That's a plus right there. The only component I kept was the interior vent console, as I think it makes the dash look more substantial and it's needed to retain the shorter center instrument console (which is superior to the tall one because the gauges are angled toward the driver). However I did remove all the internal guts of the vent console (blower, etc.) Pull it!

Ansbacher

[djway]

I picked up a 74 with a DPD. I ran a vacuum for about 45 minutes added the adapters with new seals and put in 134. I have made it though two summers now.

[Amphicar770]

I replaced my compressor with a rotary, ran new barrier hoses, cleaned everything up. Blows ice cold, has minimal power drag, and makes car enjoyable on those hot, humid, PA days when you might otherwise just leave it home.

[My 914]

I agree with the idea of updating/repairing the unit and getting it working again. A little cold air in a small car can feel good on a muggy day. It also works well for defogging the windshield. I think you lose more than you gain by removing it.

[yellow75]

"So, don't be a J.O. and remove it."

Shouldn't that be "So YINZ don't be a J.O. and remove it" ?

[Rsjg911]

"So, don't be a J.O. and remove it."

Shouldn't that be "So YINZ don't be a J.O. and remove it" ?

Well, I'm from uptown, not dawn tawn. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png)

[Spoke]

But I REALLY can't wait for baseball season again. GO BUCS!

I have no hope for the Bucs this year. They're going back to the downslide they were on that gave us 20 consecutive losing seasons.

The bulking up of players they did a few years ago worked. They broke the 20 year losing streak and even made the playoffs as a wild card. The 20 year losing streak was becoming a bigger issue than the game itself. Once the losing streak was broken, why keep paying players to try again. People still show up to the games.

So last year they don't pay hometown kid Neil Walker, let Liriano and Melancin go. I heard hints of trading McCutchen. It's a fire sale. Buckle up matey, it's going to be a long season. I hope I'm wrong.

The only things I say about the Bucs owner(s):

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pissoff.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bs.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/jerkit.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/boid.gif)

[Rsjg911]

But I REALLY can't wait for baseball season again. GO BUCS!

I have no hope for the Bucs this year. They're going back to the downslide they were on that gave us 20 consecutive losing seasons.

The bulking up of players they did a few years ago worked. They broke the 20 year losing streak and even made the playoffs as a wild card. The 20 year losing streak was becoming a bigger issue than the game itself. Once the losing streak was broken, why keep paying players to try again. People still show up to the games.

So last year they don't pay hometown kid Neil Walker, let Liriano and Melancin go. I heard hints of trading McCutchen. It's a fire sale. Buckle up matey, it's going to be a long season. I hope I'm wrong.

The only things I say about the Bucs owner(s):

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pissoff.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bs.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/jerkit.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/boid.gif)

Well, AL Oliver lived across the street from me and his dad got drunk and fell through my Volvo''s passenger window one evening. I knocked on their door and told them of the issue and they shut the door in my face. This despite the fact that my neighbor watched the incident unfold. Class act. I was a kid and the repair was an unexpected expense I didn't need. So, I wasn't a big Pirates fan after that.
Keep 'em on the Road and best to the Allegheny County PCA!
Ron

[yellow75]

But I REALLY can't wait for baseball season again. GO BUCS!

I have no hope for the Bucs this year. They're going back to the downslide they were on that gave us 20 consecutive losing seasons.

The bulking up of players they did a few years ago worked. They broke the 20 year losing streak and even made the playoffs as a wild card. The 20 year losing streak was becoming a bigger issue than the game itself. Once the losing streak was broken, why keep paying players to try again. People still show up to the games.

So last year they don't pay hometown kid Neil Walker, let Liriano and Melancin go. I heard hints of trading McCutchen. It's a fire sale. Buckle up matey, it's going to be a long season. I hope I'm wrong.

The only things I say about the Bucs owner(s):

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/KMA.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ar15.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/pissoff.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/bs.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/jerkit.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/boid.gif)

Yeah sadly I have been thinking the same thing..I'll still be a fan though...and I even grew up in CLEVELAND!!!

[Rsjg911]

Boy, did the Pittsburghers hijack your post or what?!

So what have you decided to do with the AC? I'd restore it.

BTW, My first 914, a 70 I bought in 71 from Ted McWilliams Porsche-Audi was Sunflower Yellow. I have also had an 87 911 Cab in Summer Yellow. Love the color.

GL!

[scallyk9]

Interesting that when I checked Hagerty before buying the CanAm, it said "add 10% for A/C". Mine has a dealer-installed VPC unit and rather than remove it, I've sourced the special staggered gauge panel that was designed for those units. I don't need air conditioning but may modify to decrease any power drag. Thanks for the tips in some earlier posts.

[yellow75]

I'm gonna keep it. This car is a unicorn anyway. No rust. I'm the third owner, Spent most of it's 68,000 miles in NC. Been in storage for the past 12 years. Has all it's records including the window sticker back to new along with the owners manual and service record book that is stamped for the first year. So keeping it original is probably the best option. I don't intend to sell it, nor is it going to Pebble Beach but I think stock is the way to go with this one.

Yeah my Pittsburgh brothers are the best. This is a sports town. "Ice or Grass we'll kick yer ass" is our motto. Actually I'm in New Castle which is about an hours drive NW of Da Burgh...