Very nice Panorama 914 spread... Options

[1970 Neun vierzehn]

Very well stated, dpm. I do not believe anyone could question your enthusiasm, pursuit of excellence, motive, or vision. Personally, I think your car is absolutely gorgeous, an excellent example of what a 914 could have evolved into if the factory had been committed to the mid-engine design back in the '70s.

Paul

[Maltese Falcon]

Some of these projects are not about money, but the excitement of actually doing the conversion. If you do it yourself, it is still an expensive proposition, but the satisfaction of completing the project and driving it is priceless!

I started mine as the values of original -6 started climbing in value and you no longer wanted to modify it. An old rusty 911 Targa was worth little back in the day, so why not take the good parts and replace the chassis? A 914 4 cylinder is a great chassis to use for such a project, so go for it if you have the skills and funds available?

Good observation George ...wonder what was going through the Zuffenhausen minds when they built the 916s and couple of 908 powered 914s; the 9146 unibodies were already sold out by early 1972 , so did they utilize the 4 cyl unibody for these exotic projects (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) ?

[ConeDodger]

[quote name='Cracker' date='Feb 19 2017, 10:09 AM' post='2456068']
Maybe so Rob but I wouldn't bet on it - 60k for a conversion - even as nice as Paul's would be record setting territory - for a teener. The old saying that "there's always an ass for a seat" applies to what you are saying but it might have taken quite awhile to find that special tail.

T

[quote name='ConeDodger' date='Feb 19 2017, 12:04 AM' post='2456020']

for a comparison - consider Paul Sayegh's featured 3.6 conversion - asking price was $60K - and it sold - presumably at ask - untold cost to build


. so it goes
[/quote]

Yes. It sold at $60K and quickly. I think easily $15K - $20K more could have been had with a little patience.
[/quote]


[/quote]

Tony,
One of the things a lot of sellers forget is the international market. I've sold three cars now at top dollar to three different countries. The first time, I set the price at what I had in it. I was patient. I actually had Bird Board guys PM me and insult me because of the price. Then, I got a PM from Norway with a "what is your phone number and what time do you get up?" We chatted, as a matter of negotiation, I told him my price was firm. He asked for every photo I had, which I sent. He asked for a few more photos which I took and sent. Then, he called again and said he agreed to the price with the condition that I "facilitate" the transport, meaning I should be home and drive the car to the transport driver. This was a rough conversion car. 2.7 motor. Nowhere near stock. Barely street legal. $16K ten years ago.
My 911, admittedly nice, stone-stock, and low mileage, but sold to Germany before the 911 prices started to rise at its original sticker price.
My point is, patience and an international market and Paul's car would have sold for quite a bit more. 16 Excellence articles is a lot of provenance. I know Paul personally, he lives fairly close to me. Mine was the first butt in the passenger seat. He tends toward the obsessive-compulsive and anytime you can buy something from an obsessive-compulsive person you're getting a good bit of extra value. An example is our member Ferg. You could lick the tailpipe on anything you bought from him.
I've been offered a $116K Cayenne in trade for my 914. I've known the guy for 27 years. He doesn't kid about cars. He owns a 918 Spyder. My car is not for sale. But he keeps trying. By the way, if you guys have an exceptional 914-6 he's asked me to find one.

[Cracker]

Rob - I can assure you much of what you suggest hasn't "escaped" me...although very, very nice, Paul's car can be duplicated. I believe we have a different definition and expectation of the term provenance. To me, as it relates to anything classic or old, is a history of significance to a model or brand. Therefore, Paul's car has great "exposure", same as dhm's car - but not provenance. Car's that truly hold "provenance" cannot simply be duplicated with time and money. Simply my opinion - tons of room for differing views.

T

[forrestkhaag]

Very Nice Car. I agree with George Rudd / The beauty is in the doing of it. Money is useless if you don't spend it.

A 914-6 conversion will make you useful....... and broke........... all at the same time.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[ConeDodger]

Tony,
I'm using the artistic definition of provenance, considering the beginning of its existence to be when Paul purchased the "cheese box." With the articles, we got to see him create the art, and thus can trace the art to its origin and creation. True, if you consider the other definition of provenance, we don't have a history of ownership or all the maintenance records from new. My car is very nice. By comparison, Paul's is a work of art. Before it was for sale Paul had a buyer. Even he acknowledges he could have gotten more. He didn't want the hasssle of waiting.

That exchange rate is a magical thing. The German buyer of my 911 told me he was stealing it, after the sale was complete. I just thought I was setting a price that gave room for negotiation.

Anyway, no worries. I have a lot of patience when it comes to selling cars. Some sellers are motivated. Some, more than a little motivated.

[mepstein]

I think there will soon be conversion cars that get way more than $60k. Especially when they are custom shop builds. PMS would be one example. You also can't compare a private build to a shop build for a customer. While the guys on pelican understand that they will usually get less for the build than they put into it, not even including their hours, we count on making a profit.
And I do think many of the private builds are every bit and more when compared to many of the high end shops.

[1stworks]

Very well stated, dpm. I do not believe anyone could question your enthusiasm, pursuit of excellence, motive, or vision. Personally, I think your car is absolutely gorgeous, an excellent example of what a 914 could have evolved into if the factory had been committed to the mid-engine design back in the '70s.

Paul

+1
Beautiful car!

[jd74914]

I'm the guy with the car.

Could you post some more pictures? Beautiful car! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[GeorgeRud]

Folks have to realize that garage-time spent working on projects like this still is a lot cheaper than laying on a couch in therapy! Many of us find a certain zen-like state when we're in the garage.

[Dave_Darling]

Good observation George ...wonder what was going through the Zuffenhausen minds when they built the 916s and couple of 908 powered 914s; the 9146 unibodies were already sold out by early 1972 , so did they utilize the 4 cyl unibody for these exotic projects (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) ?

At least some of the 916s were built on 914-6 chassis.

The 914-8 cars were built on prototype chassis.

--DD

[6freak]

if you guys have an exceptional 914-6 he's asked me to find one.
[/quote]
i just happen to know i guys thats selling a nice six give your buddy my # 1 253 370 4458

[Larmo63]

As far as the 914 in the new Panorama, it's a great looking car and the article was very well written. I love his "it's my car, fuck you" attitude.

I'm building a 2.7 conversion in my garage right now. I am inspired by people & cars like Cone Dodger Rob's, Steve's, Catorse's, who have great 914 conversions, and others. The friendship and brotherhood of the whole project is cool too. A real /6 isn't easy to find, nor is it in my "fun car" budget right now, so I keep building.

All of the thinking, the planning, the sleepless nights, the discussions on the phone, the money, the parts buying and receiving, the frustrations, the mess, the missus wondering if it will EVER be done, etc.

I salute you, David. You have a bitchin car, you wrote a great article, and the best part was the whole reason you built it: to have fun.

Who cares about money? When self driving cars are the norm, our cars will probably be legislated off of the road anyway.

[Mueller]

I request a video with sound! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[TJB/914]

Congratulations (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Beautiful 914-6 conversation and color (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

This article makes our 914's more acceptable to the deep pocket 911 guys. All Porsche guys are getting excited about 914's. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/w00t.gif)
I'll sell mine for $60K to buy that 2012-14 Cayman-S:unsure:

Tom

[mountainroads]

Very nice car, very well executed, and I salute the project and owner. Great article to read. As many of us know, this kind of project takes a very long time even if much of the heavy lifting is farmed out. Then it tales lots of time PLUS a lot of money (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) .

Is it just me, or did anyone else think the car looked more like a 916 clone than a M471 914-6, based on the nose (esp. on p43), tail, and body-colored roof? I thought it was interesting that the M471 bodywork choice was written about, but no reference to a 916 comparison. Not a criticism. Just on observation.

- MR

[Mueller]

Very nice car, very well executed, and I salute the project and owner. Great article to read. As many of us know, this kind of project takes a very long time even if much of the heavy lifting is farmed out. Then it tales lots of time PLUS a lot of money (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) .

Is it just me, or did anyone else think the car looked more like a 916 clone than a M471 914-6, based on the nose (esp. on p43), tail, and body-colored roof? I thought it was interesting that the M471 bodywork choice was written about, but no reference to a 916 comparison. Not a criticism. Just on observation.

- MR

916s have those ugly as sin bumpers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Even with the color matching he did on his car, there is enough character, lines and changes in depth to make it look better than a 916 setup.

^This is how the factory should have done it!

[dlkawashima]

Very nice car, very well executed, and I salute the project and owner. Great article to read. As many of us know, this kind of project takes a very long time even if much of the heavy lifting is farmed out. Then it tales lots of time PLUS a lot of money (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) .

Is it just me, or did anyone else think the car looked more like a 916 clone than a M471 914-6, based on the nose (esp. on p43), tail, and body-colored roof? I thought it was interesting that the M471 bodywork choice was written about, but no reference to a 916 comparison. Not a criticism. Just on observation.

- MR

916s have those ugly as sin bumpers (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Even with the color matching he did on his car, there is enough character, lines and changes in depth to make it look better than a 916 setup.

^This is how the factory should have done it!

Better pictures of the car and its bumper treatment. Click pictures to super size.

[mountainroads]

Ummm... Not intended to be argumentative. Yes, there is some front bumper treatment difference, but the front oil cooler opening is very similar. For the record, I really like the look of 916s, so for me the comparison is a complement. JMO (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[ge9146]

Great article and great car dhm! You did a great job expressing your enthusiasm for your project. It has helped to rekindle some 914 passion too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)