Home  |  Forums  |  914 Info  |  Blogs
 
914World.com - The fastest growing online 914 community!
 
Porsche, and the Porsche crest are registered trademarks of Dr. Ing. h.c. F. Porsche AG. This site is not affiliated with Porsche in any way.
Its only purpose is to provide an online forum for car enthusiasts. All other trademarks are property of their respective owners.
 

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

2 Pages V  1 2 >  
Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Blinkers... Flashers, just stopped working
malcolm2
post May 15 2017, 04:11 PM
Post #1


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



I noticed it at lunch today. The blinker indicator in the dash would flash 4 or 5 times, then stop.

Coming home I tried the e-flashers. Same deal. Maybe 7 flashes then OUT. Try the left side, 2 flashes, right side 4 flashes.... then OUT.

Now I get no flashes at all. Got a few honey do things to knockout this afternoon then I will start poking around.

Figured I'd start with the fuse, then relay. Seeing how it is the flasher and the blinker, I will rule out the lever and such in the column. How do you test a relay anyway?

Chime in with some thoughts.

Thanks,
Clark
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 07:32 AM
Post #2


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



I have checked the fuse....all is well.

I pulled the flasher relay and now I need to figure out a test method.

Here is what I think I have determined from the pelican current diagrams.

4 prongs on the relay.

31 = ground
49 = power in
49a = power out to the lights
C = power out to the dash indicator

Attached Image
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 07:38 AM
Post #3


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



So here is my attempt at testing this baby. Seem correct? NO CLICK = BAD?

I used a 12V drill battery.....
+ on batt to 49
- on batt to 31
relay was quiet, no clicking.

with 12v applied as above:
VOM + to 49a
VOM - to 31
VOM reads 12.8V

VOM + to C
VOM - to 31
VOM reads: jumping around, slowly rising from 6V to 9V

I am thinking I should use a light vs the digital VOM since it may not react to the "flash".

Attached Image
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Valy
post May 16 2017, 07:50 AM
Post #4


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,440
Joined: 6-April 10
From: Sunnyvale, CA
Member No.: 11,573
Region Association: Northern California



Check the voltage feeding the relay in the car. I would suspect that to be low, so maybe a voltage regulator or alternator issue.

And check the blinker fluid too.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 09:15 AM
Post #5


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(Valy @ May 16 2017, 08:50 AM) *

Check the voltage feeding the relay in the car. I would suspect that to be low, so maybe a voltage regulator or alternator issue.

And check the blinker fluid too.


I have been thru 2 alternators since 2013, the one mounted now probably has 7000 miles on it. Same goes for the regulator. I put a new one on at the same time, Behr (SP) brand I believe. I did not see any other symptoms of either part. I sure hope that the alt is ok, I HATE removing that sucker.

The new Air/Fuel Gauge has a volt meter, so I can easily check that again. During my drives this weekend it was charging at 14V.

I have the relay with me at work, so I will take your suggestion home this afternoon and measure.

I am not a fan of the blinker fluid design, so I removed the reservoir in 2013. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif)
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Spoke
post May 16 2017, 09:31 AM
Post #6


Jerry
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 5,467
Joined: 29-October 04
From: Allentown, PA
Member No.: 3,031



Below is the simplified schematic for the turnsignal network in the '74-'76 914 with the single L-R tachometer turnsignal indicator.

To test the flasher:

1) apply 12V on 49
2) connect ground on 31
3) connect known good turnsignal bulb from 49a to 31; The flasher should flash.

Don't worry about C/K2, it's only drives the tach indicator bulb. If the flasher won't flash following the above test, C/K2 operation will not work either.


Attached image(s)
Attached Image
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 09:37 AM
Post #7


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(Spoke @ May 16 2017, 10:31 AM) *

Below is the simplified schematic for the turnsignal network in the '74-'76 914 with the single L-R tachometer turnsignal indicator.

To test the flasher:

1) apply 12V on 49
2) connect ground on 31

3) connect known good turnsignal bulb from 49a to 31; The flasher should flash.

Don't worry about C/K2, it's only drives the tach indicator bulb. If the flasher won't flash following the above test, C/K2 operation will not work either.


Thanks, I did find a similar diagram in a post, but it had a 911 tach with R and L indicators. IIRC it did not have the brake stuff on it, and IIRC my brake flasher is also not flashing with the hand brake pulled up.

Shouldn't the relay start "clicking" when 1) and 2) are done above?
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Spoke
post May 16 2017, 09:42 AM
Post #8


Jerry
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 5,467
Joined: 29-October 04
From: Allentown, PA
Member No.: 3,031



QUOTE(malcolm2 @ May 16 2017, 11:37 AM) *

QUOTE(Spoke @ May 16 2017, 10:31 AM) *

Below is the simplified schematic for the turnsignal network in the '74-'76 914 with the single L-R tachometer turnsignal indicator.

To test the flasher:

1) apply 12V on 49
2) connect ground on 31

3) connect known good turnsignal bulb from 49a to 31; The flasher should flash.

Don't worry about C/K2, it's only drives the tach indicator bulb. If the flasher won't flash following the above test, C/K2 operation will not work either.


Thanks, I did find a similar diagram in a post, but it had a 911 tach with R and L indicators.

Shouldn't the relay start "clicking" when 1) and 2) are done above?


1) and 2) only apply power to the relay. 3) applies a bulb load to start the flashing.

User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 09:58 AM
Post #9


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(Spoke @ May 16 2017, 10:42 AM) *


1) and 2) only apply power to the relay. 3) applies a bulb load to start the flashing.


makes sense, and should be easy to test on or off the car.

So, if no flash, or click, relay is bad, correct?

Thanks,

Clark
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Spoke
post May 16 2017, 12:23 PM
Post #10


Jerry
*****

Group: Members
Posts: 5,467
Joined: 29-October 04
From: Allentown, PA
Member No.: 3,031



Yes, with one bulb load the relay should flash.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 01:02 PM
Post #11


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(Spoke @ May 16 2017, 01:23 PM) *

Yes, with one bulb load the relay should flash.



Good News, Bad News, I guess...

the relay worked on the bench. Using 49a I got a bulb to flash and of course the relay clicked.

I know you said not to worry about the C terminal, but for giggles, I put the bulb connection on the C term and nothing happened.

is that expected? Or maybe half of my relay is bad? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
914_teener
post May 16 2017, 01:16 PM
Post #12


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,211
Joined: 31-August 08
From: So. Cal
Member No.: 9,489
Region Association: Southern California



There was a great write up on the flasher relay itself. It is my understanding is there are actually two windings there. It needs a load for the other winding to work.

I wish I could find it as my 73 had a similar problem. I wish I could find that write up and also a current diagram for the 73 as the 74 are different.

Having a contact, ground or bulb problem can cause issues.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
timothy_nd28
post May 16 2017, 01:35 PM
Post #13


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,120
Joined: 25-September 07
From: IN
Member No.: 8,154
Region Association: Upper MidWest



7 flashes is plenty, just limit yourself to right turns
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 01:47 PM
Post #14


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(timothy_nd28 @ May 16 2017, 02:35 PM) *

7 flashes is plenty, just limit yourself to right turns


I only use the blinker if I see a cop. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving-girl.gif)

But I gotta have the flashers to park in a handi-cap spot. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 01:49 PM
Post #15


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(914_teener @ May 16 2017, 02:16 PM) *


I wish I could find it as my 73 had a similar problem. I wish I could find that write up and also a current diagram for the 73 as the 74 are different.



And I have a 75, with some HO-MADE wiring going on.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 04:37 PM
Post #16


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



OK... The bench test results are above. I just installed the flasher relay into the car.

Turned the key on and the BRAKE light is flashing and the relay is clicking. as expected

Start the car

All blinkers work as expected

E-flashers work.

Here is the question.

49 - 31 I get 12.8v with the key on and or the car running.

I release the brake and the clicking and flashing stops.

BUT with the car still running and the relay inserted, but the terminals are accessible. I check the voltage between ground and 49a and I get 13V

I check the voltage between ground and C and I get 13V.
[b] No clicking, nothing flashing.

Is that right? What is going on?
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 04:38 PM
Post #17


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



delete FLOOD post.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
Valy
post May 16 2017, 07:54 PM
Post #18


Senior Member
***

Group: Members
Posts: 1,440
Joined: 6-April 10
From: Sunnyvale, CA
Member No.: 11,573
Region Association: Northern California



C will only flash if there is load (bulb connected) on 49A.

Do your indicators stop blinking when the dash light stops blinking?
If not, check the grounding of the indicator bulbs.

BTW, you don't have LEDs , do you?
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
malcolm2
post May 16 2017, 08:48 PM
Post #19


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 2,023
Joined: 31-May 11
From: Nashville
Member No.: 13,139
Region Association: South East States



QUOTE(Valy @ May 16 2017, 08:54 PM) *

C will only flash if there is load (bulb connected) on 49A.

Do your indicators stop blinking when the dash light stops blinking?
If not, check the grounding of the indicator bulbs.

BTW, you don't have LEDs , do you?


After i re-connected the relay everything started working properly. No LEDs.

So i guess you are saying if the big bulbs are out, the dash indicator won't work either?

That was my issue on the bench. Would have needed to wire up 2 bulbs. But I don't follow the readings when the relay was mounted and the car was running. C and 49a showed voltage.

Inquiring minds want to know.
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post
914_teener
post May 16 2017, 08:55 PM
Post #20


Advanced Member
****

Group: Members
Posts: 3,211
Joined: 31-August 08
From: So. Cal
Member No.: 9,489
Region Association: Southern California



Found the thread:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...6&hl=signal
User is offlineProfile CardPM
Go to the top of the page
+Quote Post

2 Pages V  1 2 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



- Lo-Fi Version Time is now: 22nd November 2017 - 12:51 PM