Oil temp at 240 |
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Oil temp at 240 |
57lincolnman |
Jul 19 2017, 10:58 PM
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 174 Joined: 14-September 10 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 12,175 Region Association: Southern California |
I'm in SoCal and last weekend I was passing through the San Fernando Valley on the 101 where the air temp was about 110. There's a mountain climb for about 2 miles on this route and the oil temp gauge was reading 240 during the climb. Because of the hot temps, the oil stayed at this temp even after I reached the top. I had to run the engine this way at 240 for about 20 miles. The oil pressure gauge was at 20 psi so I figured at least I had decent oil pressure even with the oil thinning out. I drove very conservatively at 50 mph. Did I do damage to the engine? If so, what should I look for?
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Elliot Cannon |
Jul 19 2017, 11:23 PM
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#2
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914 Guru Group: Retired Members Posts: 8,487 Joined: 29-December 06 From: Paso Robles Ca. (Central coast) Member No.: 7,407 Region Association: None |
Do you use synthetic oil? Some suggest that if you use synthetic oil (I use Mobil one), oil pressure is more important than temp. My oil temp went to 260 on Mt. Hood at the WCR a number of years ago. Pressure was fine but I stopped, let it cool and it was OK. I would suggest if it happens again and you're concerned about it, pull over if you have time and let it cool down.
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Tom_T |
Jul 20 2017, 12:17 PM
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#3
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TMI.... Group: Members Posts: 8,318 Joined: 19-March 09 From: Orange, CA Member No.: 10,181 Region Association: Southern California |
Actually, if you stop vs. slowing down, then you get zero airflow from fan & moving along, so I'd say he did the right thing on an aircooled car.
Water pumper, yes, probably better to pull over. I'm not sure that 240 is too hot there - given ambient temp at 110 & probably 150+ at just above the pavement, but I never had the OT gauge in my 73 2L to know specifically. My mechanic who is Porsche trained on 914s since `69 always said to slow down & keep the oil, air & car moving to keep it cool as much as possible in those situations. Although I did that drive in summer/hot weather many times back in the day going from OC to Thousand Jokes & beyond - sometimes several times a week while working on the T-Oaks Library in 78-80 .... in my suit, coat off, suit pant legs rolled up above the knees, fan blasting cuz I had no AC! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Tom /////// |
porschetub |
Jul 20 2017, 03:11 PM
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#4
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,697 Joined: 25-July 15 From: New Zealand Member No.: 18,995 Region Association: None |
Actually, if you stop vs. slowing down, then you get zero airflow from fan & moving along, so I'd say he did the right thing on an aircooled car. Water pumper, yes, probably better to pull over. I'm not sure that 240 is too hot there - given ambient temp at 110 & probably 150+ at just above the pavement, but I never had the OT gauge in my 73 2L to know specifically. My mechanic who is Porsche trained on 914s since `69 always said to slow down & keep the oil, air & car moving to keep it cool as much as possible in those situations. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Tom /////// (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) or slow down and drive in a lower gear to get the fan speed up,I have always placed a lot of importance on good spark plug seals,engine tin seals and a good clean engine this can make a noticeable improvement in max oil temp. |
boxsterfan |
Jul 20 2017, 05:23 PM
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#5
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914's are kewl Group: Members Posts: 1,776 Joined: 6-June 03 From: San Ramon, CA Member No.: 791 Region Association: Northern California |
If all other things are in good shape (timing, spark, fuel, valves, etc...) then study the oil pressure relief valve. Then see tangerine racing for a replacement.
I never got around to replacing my oil pressure relief valve, but I had been all over my setup for a 1974 2.0L and no matter what it always ran hot. I think that some of the bypass "leakage" in a 40 year old not-so-well-designed oil pressure relief valve may have contributed. |
michael7810 |
Jul 20 2017, 10:02 PM
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#6
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,080 Joined: 6-June 11 From: Scottsdale, AZ Member No.: 13,164 Region Association: Southwest Region |
I don't think 240 is bad. Mine has hit 250 on a number of occasions on long mountain hill climbs. It always drops to around 230 once I crest the hill and take it easy for a while. I have a $$$$ Setrab cooler and fan under the rear trunk and the Tangerine OP relief valve and use JG Racing DT50 oil. I don't think I've damaged my engine; at least that I can tell.
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Kansas 914 |
Jul 22 2017, 02:16 PM
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#7
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,999 Joined: 1-March 03 From: Durango, Colorado Member No.: 373 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Is there a temp/duration when viscosity breaks down and the oil is shot?
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SKL1 |
Jul 22 2017, 02:48 PM
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#8
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,597 Joined: 19-February 11 From: north Scottsdale Member No.: 12,732 Region Association: Upper MidWest |
Boy 240 seems pretty high to me. On my '73 2.0 I added an external cooler as it lives in AZ. Don't drive it much in summer months as I'm usually back in IA enjoying the humidity, but when there I take it out in the morning, or late in the day, and it doesn't take long to get up to 200-210. Of course, air cooling isn't that great when the ampient temp is 100+!
I've got an oil pressure gauge too (with the kit to increase oil pressure) so that doesn't seem to be an issue. |
dangrouche |
Jul 23 2017, 09:53 AM
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#9
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dangrouche Group: Members Posts: 550 Joined: 1-May 04 From: San Francisco Bay Area Member No.: 2,012 Region Association: None |
Jake cited some stuff about oil temps....
JAKE RABY SAYS : Here are my tolerances for OIL temps: 180-225 is normal 225-235 Very warm and will thermally breakdown oil in 1500 miles (dino oil) 235+ HOT- Will kill idle oil pressure and erode rod bearings and break down oil in 1K miles HEAD TEMPS = 275-325 VERY good for flat running with short bursts to 350+ while pulling a hill. About the only time you'll see these temps is with a non stock, more efficient engine. Stockers with injection seldom run this cool. |
Kansas 914 |
Jul 23 2017, 09:55 AM
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#10
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,999 Joined: 1-March 03 From: Durango, Colorado Member No.: 373 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
Jake cited some stuff about oil temps.... JAKE RABY SAYS : Here are my tolerances for OIL temps: 180-225 is normal 225-235 Very warm and will thermally breakdown oil in 1500 miles (dino oil) 235+ HOT- Will kill idle oil pressure and erode rod bearings and break down oil in 1K miles HEAD TEMPS = 275-325 VERY good for flat running with short bursts to 350+ while pulling a hill. About the only time you'll see these temps is with a non stock, more efficient engine. Stockers with injection seldom run this cool. Thanks for the info. |
stugray |
Jul 23 2017, 11:07 AM
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#11
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,824 Joined: 17-September 09 From: Longmont, CO Member No.: 10,819 Region Association: None |
If your temp gauge read 240F and your oil pressure gauge said 20 PSI, then I would first suspect the temp gauge as reading high.
Get an independent temp gauge and check it |
larryM |
Jul 24 2017, 12:13 PM
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#12
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emoze Group: Members Posts: 891 Joined: 1-January 03 From: mid- California Member No.: 65 Region Association: Northern California |
...'way too hot! & psi 'way too low
you always want at least 10 psi/1000 rpm - or shut 'er down sometimes - "straight grade" SAE 30 oil will eliminate of lot of problems attach a "real" analog gauge to the engine if you suspect goofy senders or mismatched gauge-sender problem (which is easy to happen in our project cars) - but first 'hoping' it's a gauge-sender problem is dangerous wishful thinking fwiw- my 3.2 with oem-gt front cooler runs consistently 185-190*, 3.5 bar (50 psi), cruising at 2800, on the hottest CA valley days - with all correct gauge-senders - on Rotella 20W-40 and -yes- there is a "magic temperature" = 210*F (100*C) - the SAE reference temp at which multi-grade oil is tested - above that the oil is "not g'teed" shall we say to be at the advertised "heaviest" viscosity http://www.viscopedia.com/viscosity-tables...ces/engine-oil/ Mechanical Engineer's Reference Book: |
stownsen914 |
Jul 25 2017, 08:36 AM
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#13
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 913 Joined: 3-October 06 From: Ossining, NY Member No.: 6,985 Region Association: None |
240 degrees is too hot, but a short stint at that temp won't do anything serious.
I'd be more worried about 20 psi. You didn't mention at what RPM you're seeing that pressure, but as mentioned you want 10 psi (or almost) per 1000 RPM. High temp will cause lower pressure due to thinning oil, but 20 psi sounds very low to me. I believe there is a pressure relief kit you can buy to increase oil pressure. I'd look into why it's so low. Could be a sender or gauge issue too. Scott |
Kansas 914 |
Jul 25 2017, 08:40 AM
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#14
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,999 Joined: 1-March 03 From: Durango, Colorado Member No.: 373 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
I believe there is a pressure relief kit you can buy to increase oil pressure. Scott Chris' oil pressure relief kit seems to be well received: http://www.tangerineracing.com/engine.htm |
57lincolnman |
Jul 25 2017, 11:38 PM
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 174 Joined: 14-September 10 From: Los Angeles Member No.: 12,175 Region Association: Southern California |
I've ordered a new oil pressure relief valve from Chris Foley at Tangerine Racing. Thanks for the suggestion. When the oil temp was at 240, I had 20 psi according to the gauges. The oil temp gauge was specially calibrated for me by Palo Alto Speedo and the sensor has been checked so I have confidence in that. I have an external oil cooler with a temp fan and a NACA duct forcing air onto the auxiliary oil cooler.
At the time I experienced the high oil temp, I was at about 2400 RPM, so 20 psi isn't all that out of line with the 1,000 RPM/10 psi benchmark. After I get the new oil pressure relief valve in, I'll give it run out to Palm Springs with air temps around 115 and report back. But then there's no A/C thing, so maybe not. |
ChrisFoley |
Jul 26 2017, 06:43 AM
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#16
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I am Tangerine Racing Group: Members Posts: 7,921 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Bolton, CT Member No.: 209 Region Association: None |
Harve,
The shipping address I have for you is in GA. If you want me to ship it to you in CA, email me the address. |
larryM |
Jul 28 2017, 09:11 PM
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#17
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emoze Group: Members Posts: 891 Joined: 1-January 03 From: mid- California Member No.: 65 Region Association: Northern California |
yes - when i do the Hot August Night Cruises, the only salvation is to keep the engine revved up & lots of airflow thru the engine cooler
i have toyed with adding fans on the front cooler - since it's only a once/yr issue it's a lot of work for miniscule reward - easier to go make a fast run on I-80 to cool it all down & then get back into the cruise stream - no need to go round-n-round Actually, if you stop vs. slowing down, then you get zero airflow from fan & moving along, so I'd say he did the right thing on an aircooled car. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) or slow down and drive in a lower gear to get the fan speed up, |
Dtjaden |
Jul 30 2017, 09:05 AM
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 232 Joined: 25-May 13 From: Morgan Hill, CA Member No.: 15,915 Region Association: Northern California |
Just to add oil to the fire, Mobil 1 is stated to resist breakdown at temperatures up to 500 F. I run Mobil 1 V-Twin and change oil once a year which is usually only a few thousand miles.
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GregAmy |
Jul 31 2017, 07:59 AM
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#19
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,284 Joined: 22-February 13 From: Middletown CT Member No.: 15,565 Region Association: North East States |
My '74 2L has always run hot in the summer. Yesterday, for example, I took it on a longer highway trip, low 80s temp outside, and the oil temp got up to around 235 on the dipstick. I got stuck in some light traffic and it almost got to 250 and didn't come down when we got back up to speed. Chris installed his oil pressure kit a couple summers ago.
And yet...if the temps are in the 60s or so outside, oil temp rarely gets above 225-ish, even in stop-and-go traffic. I've been threatening to add an external cooler, still haven't done it. |
HIPPIEKILLER |
Aug 5 2017, 06:27 PM
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 84 Joined: 25-July 17 From: Huntington Beach, CA Member No.: 21,286 Region Association: Southern California |
I've ordered a new oil pressure relief valve from Chris Foley at Tangerine Racing. Thanks for the suggestion. When the oil temp was at 240, I had 20 psi according to the gauges. The oil temp gauge was specially calibrated for me by Palo Alto Speedo and the sensor has been checked so I have confidence in that. I have an external oil cooler with a temp fan and a NACA duct forcing air onto the auxiliary oil cooler. At the time I experienced the high oil temp, I was at about 2400 RPM, so 20 psi isn't all that out of line with the 1,000 RPM/10 psi benchmark. After I get the new oil pressure relief valve in, I'll give it run out to Palm Springs with air temps around 115 and report back. But then there's no A/C thing, so maybe not. Hi! Did you have a chance of installing and testing the new oil temp after the new relief valve? Share your experience and thoughts please! Andrés. |
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