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Rear Brake Caliper Removal, This should be so simple...

zoomCat	Jun 8 2005, 03:58 PM Post #1
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	Hi everybody! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wavey.gif) I'm in the process of trying to resurrect my Sleeping Beauty from her slumber. She's been asleep for a few years. I've changed out the oil and gas and got her started; ran like crap but I figured I'd have to rebuild the carbs anyway. I'm now trying to get the rear brake calipers off but I'm having some difficulty. This is kinda embarassing, since 1) all the descriptions I've found make it sound pretty simple, and 2) I've done it before. So I start by taking my 11mm flare wrench and go to remove the brake line from the caliper and I can't get the wrench onto the flare nut. Huh? Aft of the hard line the control arm is in the way, and forward of the line is a boss on the caliper itself as shown below (i hope). It would seem that I have to split the hard line from the flexible line at the control arm pivot. It that correct? Oh, and this is a factory /6, does that matter? (i was going to post some pictures of her when i get her out of the garage and cleaned up a bit, but i thought i'd get some brakes working first....) Attached image(s)

Replies(1 - 19)

skline	Jun 8 2005, 04:14 PM Post #2
Born to Drive Group: Members Posts: 7,910 Joined: 26-December 02 From: Costa Mesa, CA Member No.: 17 Region Association: Southern California	Just remove the caliper and then remove the hard line. I would also consider cutting the lines and replacing them anyway.

Joe Bob	Jun 8 2005, 04:50 PM Post #3
Retired admin, banned a few times Group: Members Posts: 17,427 Joined: 24-December 02 From: Boulder CO Member No.: 5 Region Association: None	If those are stock 914/6 calipers....they are very rare. The Ferrari used them and the limited amopunt 914/6s...if you want to sell them, they will finance an upgrade for BOTH the front AND rear brakes. Agree with Scott, pull them off and cut the lines, soak the nuts with a penetrant and remove them after a day or so. Get new ruuber and steel lines.

zoomCat	Jun 8 2005, 05:24 PM Post #4
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	I'm not entirely sure what the caliper in question actually is. The car came with non-stock calipers from the PO, some 911 front setup with a vented disk but no parking brake. They started to stick, and I got a used pair from a vendor in the early/mid 90's that looked good, but had single bleeders only on the bottom. Volvo? Ferrari? Don't know. I might look into tapping another bleeder hole in them and using them in Some Future Project. I then found a used set of what were purported to be actual /6 calipers that had been widened, and that's what I'm looking to put onto this car. Hopefully, I'll get vented rotors and a parking brake. This car has a 2.7 in it, so vented rotors are probably a good idea. Looking at the purported /6 calipers I have they appear to have the same boss that's my problem above, and they were shipped to me with the hardlines still attached. I guess they come out by splitting them at the union with the flex line. My confusion comes from the various threads and tech articles that say pretty consistently to remove the hard line from the caliper first before removing the caliper from the control arm. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) I guess my concern then is that I still don't have 914 calipers, either /4 or /6. The good news is that the brake line broke free at the union without any struggle. Now I just gotta go buy a couple of quarts of brake fluid, suddenly realizing I don't have enough in house to handle this. So, I guess the question I have now if I've got one or two pairs of calipers that won't work? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wacko.gif)

SirAndy

Jun 8 2005, 05:41 PM

Post #5

Resident German

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QUOTE (zoomCat @ Jun 8 2005, 04:24 PM)

I got a used pair from a vendor in the early/mid 90's that looked good, but had single bleeders only on the bottom.

bottom? how are you supposed to get the air out then?

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/confused24.gif) Andy

ArtechnikA	Jun 8 2005, 06:29 PM Post #6
rich herzog Group: Members Posts: 7,390 Joined: 4-April 03 From: Salted Roads, PA Member No.: 513 Region Association: None	we're gonna need better pictures ...

zoomCat	Jun 9 2005, 12:59 PM Post #7
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	OK, more pictures... First is a pic of a caliper sold to me in the early 90's purported to be a used /6 caliper. I'm showing the inboard side of the passenger side caliper, with the bleeder highlighted. What I find interesting is that the hydraulic line and the bleeder are on opposite ends, which would put the bleeder on the bottom as installed in a 914. Attached image(s)

zoomCat	Jun 9 2005, 01:05 PM Post #8
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	And here's another, this one showing a comparison between the previous caliper and a caliper that was sold to me as a used /6 caliper. Note the highlighted bleeders. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/huh.gif) Attached image(s)

Eric_Shea

Jun 9 2005, 01:08 PM

Post #9

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I hope you didn't cut the line...

QUOTE

I would also consider cutting the lines and replacing them anyway.

QUOTE

Agree with Scott, pull them off and cut the lines,

Those lines are NLA (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

The Ferrari caliper has the bleeder on the bottom. They will need to be retro-fitted with "dual" bleeders like the later 914-4 calipers.

The one's in the picture appear to be 914-6 calipers. They do not have the raised spine on the back.

ArtechnikA	Jun 9 2005, 01:09 PM Post #10
rich herzog Group: Members Posts: 7,390 Joined: 4-April 03 From: Salted Roads, PA Member No.: 513 Region Association: None	i have some 914.6 calipers in a box at home (doesn't everyone?) and i'll check 'em out for comparison purposes... the widened (vented disk) caliper is out on the workbench, the stockers are in a box. film at 11... (well - digital pictures somewhere around 2100 EDT...)

Eric_Shea	Jun 9 2005, 01:11 PM Post #11
PMB Performance Group: Admin Posts: 19,275 Joined: 3-September 03 From: Salt Lake City, UT Member No.: 1,110 Region Association: Rocky Mountains	Here's a picture of a pair of factory 914-6/GT calipers. This shows the proper relationship of the bleeder and arm. Attached image(s)

zoomCat	Jun 9 2005, 01:13 PM Post #12
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	Here's a shot of the width between some bosses that the disk fits between. Its also a shot of my latest manicure and my fancy-schmancy Harbor Frieght digital calipers. Is this a widened caliper for a vented rotor, or will it need a solid rotor? Attached image(s)

ClayPerrine	Jun 9 2005, 01:16 PM Post #13
Life's been good to me so far..... Group: Admin Posts: 15,485 Joined: 11-September 03 From: Hurst, TX. Member No.: 1,143 Region Association: NineFourteenerVille	I sold Rusty my factory /6 calipers. But I do remember that the bleeders are on top. Do the calipers have spacers for vented rotors already installed? If the bleeders are on the bottom, and they have spacers for vented rotors, then these are Ferrari 308 calipers. Don't worry, the 308 calipers and the 914 /6 calipers are identical other than the location of the bleeder and the spacer between the caliper halves. The Ferrari guys will buy 914 /6 calipers for their cars if they can find them.

Eric_Shea

Jun 9 2005, 01:20 PM

Post #14

PMB Performance

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Now... back to your question.

QUOTE

the question I have now if I've got one or two pairs of calipers that won't work?

They'll "all" work. One pair with less effort than the other. If you need to use the other it would still be less expensive to install the second bleeder than it would be to buy another pair but seeing as how you have a second pair...

So, the rusted one looks to be from a Ferrari. The silverish one is from a -6. To install vented rotors with the -6 caliper you will need to install 10mm factory spacers, get custom pad pins (10mm longer in the center) and custom 5mm rotor spacers made. The Ferrari calipers should have had the spacers in them. My guess is someone took them out. (unless you're currently sitting on vented rotors.

We just finished a set for Tom Krueger and the total was $527.70 ($245.00 of which was a standard -6 rebuild) The ones pictured above are off Tony Samojens GT.

Eric_Shea

Jun 9 2005, 01:21 PM

Post #15

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QUOTE

Is this a widened caliper for a vented rotor, or will it need a solid rotor?

That's for vented. It has the 10mm spacers in it.

zoomCat	Jun 9 2005, 01:35 PM Post #16
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	It looks like both sets I have have the 10 mm spacer already installed. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/mueba.gif) So it looks like the guy who sold me the used /6 calipers (forget his name, it was a while ago...) spoke the truth. I've also got some new vented rotors lying about, now I just need to find/fabricate spacers. Is my memory correct that it should be 5mm? Is it too naive to think I could just find some flat stock, take a hack saw and my drill press.... Oh, i still find myself looking back at the pics of your handiwork Eric. That stuff is gorgeous.

Eric_Shea

Jun 9 2005, 01:41 PM

Post #17

PMB Performance

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Thanks! Your's can look like that (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

QUOTE

Is my memory correct that it should be 5mm?

Is it too naive to think I could just find some flat stock, take a hack saw and my drill press....

Yes.

and... yes (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Actually, depending on how handy you are with the old hack saw and drill press... maybe. You need to space out the rotor because, as you already know, there's not much room to move the caliper back.

zoomCat	Jun 9 2005, 02:28 PM Post #18
Member Group: Members Posts: 161 Joined: 13-August 04 From: Cincinnati, OH Member No.: 2,526 Region Association: None	So looking around the usual sources I find a lot of wheel spacers, but no hub spacers. Is there something I'm overlooking or are these things that unusual? Or can I just use wheel spacers, just stick them behind the hub? I'd expect the tolerances to be a bit tighter for hub spacers.... So, anybody got any favorite source?

ArtechnikA	Jun 9 2005, 02:37 PM Post #19
rich herzog Group: Members Posts: 7,390 Joined: 4-April 03 From: Salted Roads, PA Member No.: 513 Region Association: None	i'll go measure my spacers, but IIRC, they're 3mm (near 'nuff - 1/8"). i don't think i ever actually measured the thickness of the caliper spacers themselves - i just had the work done and bolted it all up when i got the parts back. and they all worked great... since the face of the hub is flat, and the inside face of the 911 disk hat is flat, almost any reasonably hard alloy of aluminum should work just fine. you have the full clamping force of 5 lugs keeping things tight.

Eric_Shea

Jun 9 2005, 04:33 PM

Post #20

PMB Performance

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QUOTE

Is there something I'm overlooking or are these things that unusual?

Or can I just use wheel spacers, just stick them behind the hub? I'd expect the tolerances to be a bit tighter for hub spacers....

These things are unusual. Custom made at this point.

Wheel spacers are too large to fit "under" the rotor but you could turn them down if you find them in the proper size.

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