Let's play a game called I have a good 1.7 L bottom end Options

[Tdskip]

Keep it clean gentlemen - grin.

So I find myself with a perfectly good 1.7 L bottom end, give me a radio is on what to do with it to get more power out of it as cheaply as possible but ending up with a reliable and street where the motor.

Take me to school here please, thanks!

[914work]

1911

[marksteinhilber]

1911

Concur, it uses existing crank and rods. Select 96mm pistons that will work with those rods and cylinders to go with it. You can go with reworked heads, or perhaps new 1.8 heads set up with increased valve sizes optimized for 1911. You can add power if you choose to use carbs because you can then select a more aggressive cam. Find a recipe for a 1911 that meets your budget. Check out EMW for machine shop and parts prices. Parts also available at AA. Mark

[Tdskip]

Since that was not a very good year, I'm assuming you're talking about displacement.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/evilgrin.gif)


Do I need to full crank etc. from a 2 L?

EDIT: just saw Mark's post, thank you!

[Tdskip]

Thank you for that referral, pick up the phone and had a good chat with them.

Sounds like about 1200+/- for the 96 mm pistons and head work including bigger valves.

Any other big-ticket items, as far as cost, outside of reassembly to be aware of?

[r_towle]

turbo,
ask McMark.

rich

[JamesM]

What is more important here, cheapest price or overall power increase? And what is your definition of cheap?

...because a 2257 would be a nice kick in the pants. If you are going to spend the time an money to swap pistons and most likely the cam anyways, why not go all the way?

https://aapistons.com/collections/engine-re...kits/type-4-914


https://aapistons.com/collections/cylinder-...eads-44x36-pair

[Tdskip]

What is more important here, cheapest price or overall power increase? And what is your definition of cheap?

...because a 2257 would be a nice kick in the pants. If you are going to spend the time an money to swap pistons and most likely the cam anyways, why not go all the way?

https://aapistons.com/collections/engine-re...kits/type-4-914


https://aapistons.com/collections/cylinder-...eads-44x36-pair

If I go this route it's going to be heavily budget driven, and I was also thinking it would be easier for me to tackle if I don't have to split the case. Putting a camera and would require me to split the case, right?

[Valy]

You want to split the case to replace the cam and bearings. Might as well replace the crank and do a 2056.
If you don't split the case then who knows how long the bearings will last?
Money wise, most of the $ will go on the heads anyway.

[Tdskip]

You want to split the case to replace the cam and bearings. Might as well replace the crank and do a 2056.
If you don't split the case then who knows how long the bearings will last?
Money wise, most of the $ will go on the heads anyway.

Cranks are pretty cheap then? Or, just heads expensive comparatively?

[marksteinhilber]

You want to split the case to replace the cam and bearings. Might as well replace the crank and do a 2056.
If you don't split the case then who knows how long the bearings will last?
Money wise, most of the $ will go on the heads anyway.

Cranks are pretty cheap then? Or, just heads expensive comparatively?

EMW also sells cranks or get a good 2.0 L crank to do 2056 instead of 1911ccbut it starts adding up! If you’re only driving 2-3k per year, why pay $4500 for 2256

[Tdskip]

EMW also sells cranks or get a good 2.0 L crank to do 2056 instead of 1911ccbut it starts adding up! If you’re only driving 2-3k per year, why pay $4500 for 2256

That is a big swing in cost....

[marksteinhilber]

EMW also sells cranks or get a good 2.0 L crank to do 2056 instead of 1911ccbut it starts adding up! If you’re only driving 2-3k per year, why pay $4500 for 2256

That is a big swing in cost....

By keeping a good bottom end, you save on the cost of bearings, rods, crank, and some machine shop work, most of your money goes into the shop rebuilding your heads, the cost of new pistons, cylinders, and rings, gasket set, totaling about $1200 with you doing the work I. Should be good for 20k miles, but with existing cam. Power increase is limited to larger P&C, head work, and any gain from exhaust system upgrade. Switch to car be only gains power if cam is changed .

[JamesM]

If I go this route it's going to be heavily budget driven, and I was also thinking it would be easier for me to tackle if I don't have to split the case. Putting a camera and would require me to split the case, right?

If you dont split the case pretty much the only thing you can do will be 96mm pistons and head work but I dont know if I would bother doing either one on a stock cam as you really need the right cam to make the most of it. If the heads are 1.7 machine work will be necessary to fit the 96mm cylinders so you are probably looking at $500-1000 just to get a 1911 on worn bearings with a stock cam, sure you could do it but any gains would be minimal so you would have to decide if it is worth it to you.

If it were me, I dont know if I would bother changing anything without also changing the cam but if you split the case to do the cam might as well have some fun.

We probably should have asked what you are using for fueling as that will make a difference in what you can do cheaply with the motor itself.

My thoughts, in order of cheapness:

1. Hot cam + headwork + lightened flywheel. (keep it a 1.7 but wake it up a bit)
2. above +96mm P&C (Hot 1911, add about $300 over #1 )
3. above + everything needed to 78mm stroke (AA 2257 kit, add 1500-2k)


The thing is if you go with #1 or #2 dont ever drive/ride in anyones car with a 2257 or 2270 as you ill regret having spent the money and not having just gone with #3.

[falcor75]

No matter which way you go I'd split the case to inspect the bearings, check the boss that holds the oilpickup for cracks and changeout the cam. A new cam isnt that expensive and will likely do more for the feel of the car than increasing the volume will.

[ChrisFoley]

Ok, I'll play.

Assuming you really have a good bottom end which does not need to be split for bearing replacement, and the heads aren't crying for new valve guides, and
if you have good 1.7L P&Cs and the d-jet FI, the easiest/cheapest way to pick up 8-10 HP is put one of my 1 1/2" EVO headers on it.
No machine work required, no camshaft or crank purchase required. It's a real bolt-on upgrade.
My lowest cost header exhaust system is good to 150 hp 2056 if you find the money to improve the engine a bit more later on.
Living in Southern California means you shouldn't need heat.
You'll have the best sounding 90hp, stock FI 1.7L in your neighborhood.

[majkos1]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)
Better exhaust system.

My old 1.7 woke some when I put on Kerry & Hunter Headers !

[Tdskip]

Thanks all, good tip Chris. I'll factor that into the build options as I try to figure out what I am going to do here.

[VaccaRabite]

Is this for the turbo car? If so, keep the displacement small.

My advise to keep it on a budget is to keep it to a 1911 using stock fuel injection. You can keep using cast iron cylinders that way, and either bore out your existing ones or buy new ones. I agree with using EMW for parts. Don't split the case unless you have to.

Any near stock rebuild, most of the cost is going into the heads.

I've not driven a 1911, but I have driven my 2056 and other 2056s and from stock its a nice performance jump. The 1911s are suppsoed to make about the same power but rev a little faster and may be a bit more peaky.

Zach

[Mblizzard]

Will certainly have to second what Chris said!

As you see from all of the responses, the old saying that the only thing that beats cubic inches (displacement) is cubic dollars, is very true.

But regardless of your choice of internal engine mods, the stock FI systems rarely have the ability to take full advantage of the modification.

If you have dual carbs already then it may not be such an issue.

My suggestion is leave the bottom. Add the 96mm P/Cs. Get 1.8 heads if you can.

Add an aftermarket FI system of your choice so you can tune it and get the most out of your mods.