Mods, Mods, Mods..., here's the latest Options

[Trekkor]

braided brake lines, 8 speed bleeders and my Hoosiers. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/boldblue.gif)

Any advice on the brake line install. Seems pretty straight forward.

KT

[redshift]

Did you get the cross-drilled brake lines?

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)


M

[SirAndy]

QUOTE (redshift @ Jun 17 2005, 07:37 PM)

Did you get the cross-drilled brake lines?

i hear they vent much better!

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif) Andy

[McMark]

The rears suck. Those bastards are one of the few times that I really really really wish I had room for a lift.

[Trekkor]

The rear lines were a little testy. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/dry.gif)

Got through it though. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/cool.gif)

I'd guess I spent about three hours changing out the lines, Speedbleeders, and bleeding out the system.

Test drove with the complete upgraded system.

Porterfields- race pads
Motul
Stainless brake lines.

Wow... I now have BRAKES.

When I step on the brake pedal, it's like stompin' on a brick. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smash.gif)

Can't wait 'til Sunday.

KT

[SirAndy]

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jun 24 2005, 06:55 PM)

When I step on the brake pedal, it's like stompin' on a brick. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smash.gif)

FlatSpot™, here i come ... (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/laugh.gif)

[TravisNeff]

The easy way to remove the rears is to cut the line before the fitting, put a socket on there - other side backed by a wrench and it comes right off. Going on sucks. Easiest if the engine is out and you can do it sitting in the engine bay area.

[Trekkor]

I had the most trouble with the retaining "U- clips".

KT

[Cap'n Krusty]

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jun 17 2005, 06:34 PM)

Any advice on the brake line install. Seems pretty straight forward. KT

The Cap'n says, "Yeah, install 'em in the trash barrel, where they belong", but that's just his opinion, he could be wrong.
Seriously, if you'd done the same job with new (safer, and FAR longer lasting) OE style hoses you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. I wish you safe driving and hope you service and inspect them often. And don't drive behind me. The Cap'n

[Trekkor]

QUOTE

Seriously, if you'd done the same job with new (safer, and FAR longer lasting) OE style hoses you wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

Please don't take this as an insult.

What is that statement based on?
I've heard only good about the aftermarket SS lines.

Why would they fail before a rubber hose?

KT

[ClayPerrine]

Now you have done it.... You got the Capt'n started on the stainless steel brake lines! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/poke.gif)


He bases his opinion on some 30+ years of experience with 914s. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/pray.gif)

[Cap'n Krusty]

What's wrong with them? The failure mode of rubber lines is a deterioration of braking, swelling inside, weakening of the walls, maybe a sticking caliper. By far the most common failure mode of the SS braided teflon lines is sudden, absolute, and total loss of braking. In 32 years in the business, I've seen ONE stock line break at the end. In that same time, I've personally seen FOUR SS lines fail. Cars with SS lines make up maybe one tenth of one percent of the cars I work on. A number of folks on the Audi 20v list have personally experienced the same type of failure. MAJOR pucker factor! What's that tell you? Most people with any practical knowledge of brakes recommend frequent and thorough visual inspection of the SS lines, including tugging, twisting, checking for worn spots in the sheathing, and a real bright light to work with), and replacement every couple of years. Damaged sheathing can saw through almost any material in a few miles/minutes. The more enlightened manufacturers have begun to install a layer of another material in an attempt to minimize this problem, but you lose the "trick" look so many people want. That's why I don't like them (and will NOT install them on customers' cars) Hey, if they were that good, why don't the factories put them on every performance car? .......... The Cap'n

[Trekkor]

What caused the SS lines to fail?

My car sees less than two hundred miles per month, so I'm not worried.


KT

[lapuwali]

This really has been discussed to death. I'm tempted to just say "do a search", but I'll repeat myself just as the Cap'n has.

There are two main problems. One, 90% of the braided lines on sale aren't tested using the DOT procedures to ensure lines don't fail, esp. when they're kinked or subjected to sudden whip stress, like if they're a tad too short and the wheel goes to full droop. Two, dirt gets into the braid and slowly works away at the soft inner Teflon line. It often migrates towards the joints, where it cannot easily be seen. After awhile, the inner line gets weakened to the point where it simply fails under pressure. Cleaning them doesn't help, as you simply can't get the dirt out from under the braid. Covering the line completely in something when new helps a great deal, but once the dirt is there, it's there and doing it's slow sandpaper act.

I've had the second failure mode happen to me, and it really gets your attention. Believe me, as the Cap'n said, if you'd used fresh rubber lines, it would feel 99% the same. For track only or track mostly use, the braided stuff is probably fine, as you're going (hopefully) to be taking a good look at the brakes regularly, and you can schedule replacing the lines periodically before they fail.

I like braided lines a lot. For one thing, it's really easy to make up your own custom lines for various things, using off-the-shelf line and fittings. I've done this with two motorcycles over the years, and trusted by life to my work here. I also covered one set entirely in clear tubing at installation time, and the other in heat shrink at install time. Bike lines are easy to inspect, so it's not so big a deal.

For a regular street car, however, they're mostly out of sight and out of mind. The slow, gradual, feelable decline of rubber lines are vastly preferable to the sudden, no warning failure of braided lines on a car I'm not going to want to examine constantly. I hate replacing brake lines, so the chore of doing so regularly with braided lines is just a hassle on a street mostly car.

In your case, the braided lines are probably fine, but be prepared to get another set and swap them out in a season or two.

[Britain Smith]

My stock rubber line blew on me one night when Brad and I were bleeding the lines. It split right in half.

-Britain

[grantsfo]

Thats great Trekkor!

Had HPH work on my engine yesterday. Rich says he cant believe it was even running. Valves had no clearence on two cylinders and injectors and seals were completely screwed up. Also installed Pertronics new plugs, etc. I still have a bad cylinder that isnt firing completely at low RPM.

The car actually has power now! Its amazing how much power was degraded over time without me noticing.

Have my new wheels and tires back from Roger Kraus - all holding air now.

[Joe Ricard]

QUOTE (grantsfo @ Jun 24 2005, 11:46 PM)

Thats great Trekkor! Had HPH work on my engine yesterday. Rich says he cant believe it was even running. Valves had no clearence on two cylinders and injectors and seals were completely screwed up. Also installed Pertronics new plugs, etc. I still have a bad cylinder that isnt firing completely at low RPM. The car actually has power now! Its amazing how much power was degraded over time without me noticing. Have my new wheels and tires back from Roger Kraus - all holding air now.

Good teener kinda week then.
Great to here you car has more power Grant. Now you can really smoke that six (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/lol2.gif)

Hope you race pads and new brakes give you more braking control. It would be a damn shame to flat spot them new tiars. Curious why you chose race compound over street. Make sure you follow the bedding in process.

[bd1308]

QUOTE (grantsfo @ Jun 25 2005, 01:46 AM)

I still have a bad cylinder that isnt firing completely at low RPM.

burned valve?

[Cap'n Krusty]

QUOTE (Britain Smith @ Jun 24 2005, 11:17 PM)

My stock rubber line blew on me one night when Brad and I were bleeding the lines. It split right in half. -Britain

And how old was it? The Cap'n

[redshift]

I would much prefer the linings closing up, to a saw cutting them in half.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/smile.gif)


M