195/65R15 tire thread, discuss, review, and post pictures of tires, wheels and cars Options

[scott_in_nh]

I almost tacked this on to one of the many existing tire threads

But I found that the OP typically just had a question or two and then floodgates open on the best combo of rim and tire size

195/65's come up all the time because they have a larger footprint then stock but are pretty close to stock height

Everyone who has shopped for this size knows that high performance summer tires pretty much don't exist with the alternative being bland all-season tires

I have Eagle GT's on the car now, but while they have worn great and evenly, they won't pass inspection this year

So with the big name tire manufacturers not providing anything interesting in this size, I decided to see what the small or off brand tire manufacturers had

The first tire I landed on was the Accelera 951 that I found at multiple online retailers for cheap

They were discontinued and therefore maybe a little older date code, but the reality was that nobody actually had them in stock (I had to place orders to find out as nobody answers email these days)

So I think I found a couple of good choices, but landed on this one

Before I reveal the brand or comment on it myself, I am just going to post some pictures of the tire - post what you think

[Dougal Cawley]

Oo!

why wouldn't you fit the good stuff

There are plenty of excellent options on here https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/classic-ca...914.html#page=1

And if you want to get silly there is also Pirelli P7 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirelli-co...nturato-p7.html

Or Michelin TB15 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michelin-c...tyres/tb15.html

At least with these tyres you will fit a carcass that is designed to be fitted to acar like yours and will therefore handle better.

[scott_in_nh]

Oo!

why wouldn't you fit the good stuff

There are plenty of excellent options on here https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/classic-ca...914.html#page=1

And if you want to get silly there is also Pirelli P7 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirelli-co...nturato-p7.html

Or Michelin TB15 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michelin-c...tyres/tb15.html

At least with these tyres you will fit a carcass that is designed to be fitted to acar like yours and will therefore handle better.

Some of those tires are great for the concours guys, which most of us are not

I disagree that they are the "good stuff" or that they will make my car "handle better" than modern tires - YMMV

The idea for this thread (though obviously I have little control of the direction it takes) is to hone in on the available options in a 195/65R15 as they are a preferred size for many that maximizes the amount of rubber on the road, while also not overly affecting gearing or speedometer accuracy, and with a sufficiently tall sidewall to not look out of place on a 914 - that's it!

There are plenty of other threads that discuss the merits of any tire that will fit under the fender that already include "classic tires"

[Dougal Cawley]

Oo!

why wouldn't you fit the good stuff

There are plenty of excellent options on here https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/classic-ca...914.html#page=1

And if you want to get silly there is also Pirelli P7 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/pirelli-co...nturato-p7.html

Or Michelin TB15 https://www.longstonetyres.co.uk/michelin-c...tyres/tb15.html

At least with these tyres you will fit a carcass that is designed to be fitted to acar like yours and will therefore handle better.

Some of those tires are great for the concours guys, which most of us are not

I disagree that they are the "good stuff" or that they will make my car "handle better" than modern tires - YMMV

Sorry, but that is where you are wrong. Your car will handle better on a period 165HR15 or at a stretch a period 185/70VR15 than it will on a 195/65R15. That is just a fact.

Yep a wider more modern tyre will give you greater grip in a straight line than a 165R15. but in the corners it won't unless you modify the car to suit. these cars aren't set up for modern low profile square shouldered tyres unless you lower them, add adverse camber and stiffen the springs etc.

but then you aren't making them handle better quite the opposite, but you are arguably giving them greater road holding which is different. but they won't be anywhere near as nice to drive.

[horizontally-opposed]

Sorry, but that is where you are wrong. Your car will handle better on a period 165HR15 or at a stretch a period 185/70VR15 than it will on a 195/65R15. That is just a fact.

Yep a wider more modern tyre will give you greater grip in a straight line than a 165R15. but in the corners it won't unless you modify the car to suit. these cars aren't set up for modern low profile square shouldered tyres unless you lower them, add adverse camber and stiffen the springs etc.

but then you aren't making them handle better quite the opposite, but you are arguably giving them greater road holding which is different. but they won't be anywhere near as nice to drive.

^ Sorry, but that's disinformation.

I've tried my 914 on so many different tires over the last 30 years that I probably couldn't list them if I tried. I've also been evaluating cars as part of my work for 25~ years on both road and track.

The idea that a 914 will handle "better" on 165R15s or 185/70R15s runs counter to so many examples from trusted sources—from Ginther and Johnson in 1970 forward through decades of autocrossers and other 914 tinkerers—that the assertions above are frankly preposterous. You can say a 914 on period 165s or 1985s will handle more "correct" or more "period correct" or "as intended" (and I'd agree), but better? I'm not so sure there, and I think an argument can easily be made that the 914 chassis was well ahead of the tire technology of its time. In other words, it was ready to employ better tires than were available at the time—and uses them even better with some very minor tweaks (dampers that most cars have since been upgraded to, lower ride height that many 914s now sit at, alignment tweaks, etc—which you do mention).

The best my 914 ever handled was probably on 205/60R15 A-008R TU tires with stiff sidewalls, rounded shoulders, and beautifully predictable breakaway. Downside was too little tire life from the R-compounds of that era—would have loved to try AVS intermediates on a 914, as they were brilliant on other cars I had, including a 911 SC. Next best was probably a 205/55R15 street tire from BFG (Comp T/A 3, iirc), which had a very rounded shoulder. One thing we will agree on is the "square shoulder" of some modern performance tires, and a set of Yoko AVS ES100s with super square shoulders weren't for me, and probably played a part in my desire for something more "age appropriate." So I switched to Vred Sprint Classic 185/70s and loved the ride and delicate steering response—but that was about it. I found the car (a lot) less fun, and ended up giving the Vreds away after 1000~ miles. I'm on Avon CR6ZZ now, and they're okay (wish I had gone softest compound rather than hardest since I'll time them out rather than wear them out), but for me the apex of period "right" and performance came in the 1980s and 1990s with 195/65R15 and 205/60R15 tires such as Yokohama's A-008 and AVSi. Next best was probably Falken's Azenis tires in similar sizing, and then some of the 205/55s.

Have been tempted to try BFG Comp T/As in 205/60R15, but can't quite get over the perception (wrong or right) that they're muscle car tires.

Tires for the 914 are either super easy or very tricky. For some, period tires like the CN36 or XZX/XWX are the only way to fly. I respect that. For others, and all-season is just fine. I respect that, too. For still others, max (or modern) performance from a 205/50, 205/55, or something like that is the way to go. I get that, too. Then there's the rest of us, who are still looking for that Goldilocks 914 tire. I've been looking for it since the demise of the A-008…

[mepstein]

Sorry, but that is where you are wrong. Your car will handle better on a period 165HR15 or at a stretch a period 185/70VR15 than it will on a 195/65R15. That is just a fact.

Yep a wider more modern tyre will give you greater grip in a straight line than a 165R15. but in the corners it won't unless you modify the car to suit. these cars aren't set up for modern low profile square shouldered tyres unless you lower them, add adverse camber and stiffen the springs etc.

but then you aren't making them handle better quite the opposite, but you are arguably giving them greater road holding which is different. but they won't be anywhere near as nice to drive.

^ Sorry, but that's disinformation.

I've tried my 914 on so many different tires I couldn't list them if I tried. I've also been evaluating cars as part of my work for 25~ years on both road and track.

The idea that a 914 will handle "better" on 165R15s or 185/70R15s runs counter to so many examples from trusted sources—from Ginther and Johnson forward through decades of autocross's and other 914 tinkerers—that it's frankly preposterous. You can say it will handle more "correct" or more "period correct" or "as intended" (and I'd agree), but better? I'm not so sure there, and I think an argument can easily be made that the 914 chassis was well ahead of the tire technology of its time. In other words, it was ready to employ better tires than were available at the time—and uses them even better with some very minor tweaks (dampers that most cars have since been upgraded to, lower ride height that many 914s now sit at, alignment tweaks, etc—which you do mention).

The best my 914 ever handled was probably on 205/60R15 A-008R TU tires with stiff sidewalls, rounded shoulders, and beautifully predictable breakaway. Next best was probably 205/55R15 street tires from BFG (Comp T/A 3s, iirc). One thing we will agree on is the "square shoulder" of some modern performance tires, and a set of Yoko AVS ES100s with super square shoulders weren't for me.

I switched to Vred Sprint Classic 185/70s and loved the ride and delicate steering response but that was about it. I found the car less fun, and ended up giving the tires away after 1000~ miles. I'm on Avon CR6ZZ now, and they're okay, but for me the apex of period "right" and performance came in the 1980s and 1990s with 195/65R15 and 205/60R15 tires such as Yokohama's A-008 and AVSi. Next best was probably Falken's Azenis tires in similar sizing, and then some of the 205/55s.

Have been tempted to try BFG Comp T/As in 205/60R15, but can't quite get over the hump.

Tires for the 914 are either super easy or very tricky. For some, period tires like the CN36 or XZX/XWX are the only way to fly. For others, and all-season is just fine. For still others, max performance from a 205/50 or something like it is the way to go. Then there's the rest of us, still looking for that Goldilocks 914 tire. I've been looking for one since the demise of the A-008…

I had the same size A008's on my car mounted to 2.0 Fuchs. Awesome ride.

One day my dad followed me in his Corvette into my favorite decreasing radius off ramp. I came in at 2x the posted speed, kept my foot on the gas and never slowed down. He backed way off and told me he thought I was going to lose it at that speed. The car stuck like velcro and I had a big grin on my face when he caught up to me. I was still a teenager but I had been racing my bike for years so 4 sticky tires felt like cheating.

Back in the day, we raced on narrow 21-23mm tires. Now racers ride 25-28mm tires. They are faster on the straight and in the turns. Wider is Better.