Low oil pressure - oil pump a workable fix? |
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Low oil pressure - oil pump a workable fix? |
Tdskip |
Apr 18 2019, 02:21 PM
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#1
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
Yeah, yeah, I know. It's not likely the oil pump but humor me.
The red aka turbo car is showing low oil pressure. It has a front mounted oil cooler and some sort of big bore engine. Oil level is full cold and when hot. When cold my oil pressure is good, when hot it isn't. I'm under 10 PSI per 1000 RPM hot. I don't have a history on the engine. I am running 20w50, Mahle filter. I have not put a mechanical gauge on it but it is already running a retrofitted VDO oil pressure gauge. Goal is to get another summer out of driving it if I can. I supposed it wouldn't hurt to try a mechanical gauge and heavier weight oil, but is there a chance it is the oil pump rather than bearings? |
crash914 |
Apr 18 2019, 02:23 PM
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#2
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its a mystery to me Group: Members Posts: 1,826 Joined: 17-March 03 From: Marriottsville, MD Member No.: 434 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region |
no, its the bearings. blew up my motor with the same symptoms.
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dr914@autoatlanta.com |
Apr 18 2019, 02:31 PM
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#3
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 7,772 Joined: 3-January 07 From: atlanta georgia Member No.: 7,418 Region Association: None |
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Tdskip |
Apr 18 2019, 02:34 PM
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#4
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
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sixnotfour |
Apr 18 2019, 02:40 PM
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#5
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914 Wizard Group: Members Posts: 10,392 Joined: 12-September 04 From: Life Elevated..planet UT. Member No.: 2,744 Region Association: Rocky Mountains |
pull the sump screen and run your finger around in the case , hope you done get a sliver
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Tdskip |
Apr 18 2019, 02:45 PM
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#6
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
If it is the bearings, which probably is the case, that’s a full engine rebuild at that point, correct?
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kahluver |
Apr 18 2019, 02:59 PM
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#7
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Newbie Group: Members Posts: 49 Joined: 3-October 14 From: Huntington Beach, ca Member No.: 17,973 Region Association: Southern California |
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Tdskip |
Apr 18 2019, 03:13 PM
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#8
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
If it is the bearings, which probably is the case, that’s a full engine rebuild at that point, correct? Afraid so. Gotta pull it all apart to replace bearings. Thanks - it is what it is. Might be time to dust off that 3.2l engine. The remaining bits that I need to buy to do that conversion will probably be close to the cost I’m having this thing rebuilt. |
jcd914 |
Apr 18 2019, 06:06 PM
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#9
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,081 Joined: 7-February 08 From: Sacramento, CA Member No.: 8,684 Region Association: Northern California |
Test, don't guess.
Test the pressure with a gauge you know to be accurate. Then if it does really have low oil pressure look at possible causes before you condemn the engine outright. A stuck oil pressure relief valve that does not seat well could create the symptoms you are seeing. Chris at Tangerine Racing makes a replacement oil pressure relief valve that addresses the poor seating problem these cases and relief valves have. Jim |
Tdskip |
Apr 18 2019, 06:11 PM
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#10
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
Test, don't guess. Test the pressure with a gauge you know to be accurate. Then if it does really have low oil pressure look at possible causes before you condemn the engine outright. A stuck oil pressure relief valve that does not seat well could create the symptoms you are seeing. Chris at Tangerine Racing makes a replacement oil pressure relief valve that addresses the poor seating problem these cases and relief valves have. Jim Well that seems like good advice - let me get a gauge on it. How do you confirm if the oil pressyre relief valve is an issue? |
jcd914 |
Apr 18 2019, 06:24 PM
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#11
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 2,081 Joined: 7-February 08 From: Sacramento, CA Member No.: 8,684 Region Association: Northern California |
Test, don't guess. Test the pressure with a gauge you know to be accurate. Then if it does really have low oil pressure look at possible causes before you condemn the engine outright. A stuck oil pressure relief valve that does not seat well could create the symptoms you are seeing. Chris at Tangerine Racing makes a replacement oil pressure relief valve that addresses the poor seating problem these cases and relief valves have. Jim Well that seems like good advice - let me get a gauge on it. How do you confirm if the oil pressyre relief valve is an issue? It is a bit subjective but if the pressure is low I would pull the pressure reilif valve and inspect ir and the bore and seating surface in the case. There is a machines step in the bore in the case that is not always in good shape. You may be able clean the bore of the oil and and see wear marks where the valve seats and evaluate if it is seating well or not. You may need ot use some bluing or dye to see the seating surfaces and evaluate the seal. Also the bore waers and the relief valve can stick in the bore so it does not move as intended. Jim |
porschetub |
Apr 19 2019, 11:10 PM
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#12
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,695 Joined: 25-July 15 From: New Zealand Member No.: 18,995 Region Association: None |
[quote name='jcd914' date='Apr 19 2019, 12:24 PM' post='2706582']
[quote name='Tdskip' post='2706574' date='Apr 18 2019, 05:11 PM'] [quote name='jcd914' post='2706569' date='Apr 18 2019, 07:06 PM'] Test, don't guess. Test the pressure with a gauge you know to be accurate. Then if it does really have low oil pressure look at possible causes before you condemn the engine outright. A stuck oil pressure relief valve that does not seat well could create the symptoms you are seeing. Chris at Tangerine Racing makes a replacement oil pressure relief valve that addresses the poor seating problem these cases and relief valves have. Jim [/quote] Well that seems like good advice - let me get a gauge on it. How do you confirm if the oil pressyre relief valve is an issue? [/quote No point in condemning this motor to quickly.OP needs to fit a gauge straight off the engine as mentioned. The following should be looked @ ; Is the engine clean, is the timing spot on, is the motor in tune ? values done recently, is the thermostat for the cooler working correctly, is the cooling system working as it should, The above listed have a lot to with oil temp with ends up being oil pressure !!!. |
Tdskip |
Apr 20 2019, 07:13 AM
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#13
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
Thanks gentlemen, I’ll slow down and do a better check. My hunch is that it is toast but maybe not!
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Tdskip |
May 3 2019, 03:18 PM
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#14
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
So I picked up a replacement oil pressure relief spring, from what I’ve learned from you all it’s probably not a bad thing to have on hand anyway.
I believe the cover for this is located next to the oil filter on the bottom of the engine, correct? Will this cover and screw readily with just a long screwdriver or do I need to remove the oil filter to get better access? Not my car but I believe this is what the cover looks like, correct? Thanks! |
dr914@autoatlanta.com |
May 3 2019, 03:20 PM
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#15
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914 Guru Group: Members Posts: 7,772 Joined: 3-January 07 From: atlanta georgia Member No.: 7,418 Region Association: None |
yes and the other one through 74 is in the relief on the left drivers side of the block
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Tdskip |
May 3 2019, 06:23 PM
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#16
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
Thanks George.
To install a mechanical oil gauge to test the oil pressure I simply remove the oil pressure sender in the taco plate? Thanks! |
porschetub |
May 3 2019, 06:25 PM
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#17
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 4,695 Joined: 25-July 15 From: New Zealand Member No.: 18,995 Region Association: None |
It will be tight,find the widest blade screwdriver you can to fit the slot.
In my collection of "make do" custom tools I have an old 19mm wood chisel ground to fit the slot for T1,T4 and 911 motors,never failed me,remember to hit upwards on the plug it will free some tension ,good luck. |
Dave_Darling |
May 3 2019, 10:49 PM
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#18
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914 Idiot Group: Members Posts: 14,974 Joined: 9-January 03 From: Silicon Valley / Kailua-Kona Member No.: 121 Region Association: Northern California |
To install a mechanical oil gauge to test the oil pressure I simply remove the oil pressure sender in the taco plate? No. The sender in the taco plate is oil temp, not oil pressure. WOuldn't do any good to measure pressure there, it would always be zero. (The oil is just sitting there in the sump; you need to measure it in one of the oil passages that has been pressurized by the pump.) The usual way to hook up an oil pressure gauge is to replace the oil pressure "idiot light" sender that lives near the distributor on top of the crankcase. --DD |
Tdskip |
May 3 2019, 11:06 PM
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#19
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,674 Joined: 1-December 17 From: soCal Member No.: 21,666 Region Association: None |
To install a mechanical oil gauge to test the oil pressure I simply remove the oil pressure sender in the taco plate? No. The sender in the taco plate is oil temp, not oil pressure. WOuldn't do any good to measure pressure there, it would always be zero. (The oil is just sitting there in the sump; you need to measure it in one of the oil passages that has been pressurized by the pump.) The usual way to hook up an oil pressure gauge is to replace the oil pressure "idiot light" sender that lives near the distributor on top of the crankcase. --DD Oops! Thanks for putting me straight on that Dave. |
Chi-town |
May 3 2019, 11:07 PM
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#20
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 850 Joined: 31-August 18 From: Disneyland Member No.: 22,446 Region Association: Southern California |
I popped the relief plug loose with a gentle tap on an impact driver
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