Rear sway bar yes or no?, 22mm hollow RSR Style Tarett sway bar front, rear sway bar needed or not? Options

[CG-914]

Hi 914 suspension wizards,

I do club racing with the POC in CA on the tight handling courses so far (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) .

I'm about to install a front Tarett 22mm hollow RSR style sway bar.

Rear sway bar yes or no?

I do still drive the car on the street as well....

The car has Toyo R888, 140lbs springs so far, but it eventually is going to a 6 with 22mm torsion bars in the front and adjustable 300lbs springs in the rear and of course a 5 lug conversion.


Thanks

[colingreene]

With 300 pound rear springs no rear bar is needed.

[mepstein]

Like the previous poster said, from the research I’ve done, it’s either really heavy springs and no bar or lighter springs with a bar.

[Jetsetsurfshop]

I also would only change one suspension item at a time.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[brant]

I run a rear bar

My set up
Is race only

21 hollow front torsions
275 rear springs
A 27mm (or 28?) smart bar in front
A 16mm rear bar with adjustable drop links

[slivel]

I run a rear bar

My set up
Is race only

21 hollow front torsions
275 rear springs
A 27mm (or 28?) smart bar in front
A 16mm rear bar with adjustable drop links

I run a similar setup. Very easy to disconnect one side droplink making the bar non-functional if you don't like the handling for any given track. I like to use the rear bar on tight technical courses and disconnect it for higher speed tracks like Willow Springs.

[Chi-town]

I have a spare rear bar if you need it

[campbellcj]

I have a similar race setup, a bit stiffer though - 22 hollow tbars, SRP swaybar (#27 I think), 350lb rears w/ factory swaybar.

[CG-914]

So my plan is not to change too much between track days....

This time its going to be sway bar(s), so this time I'm only running 140lbs springs. The question is, if the tight track of Streets of Willow will work with ONLY 22mm bar front and 140lbs Springs rear or am I going to have too much understeer? (4 Cyl Car)

[mepstein]

You could mount a rear bar and leave it loose for some laps and then pop the arms in the bushings for some laps.

[dr.tim]

I have a spare rear bar if you need it

If he's not interested, I am..

[slivel]

So my plan is not to change too much between track days....

This time its going to be sway bar(s), so this time I'm only running 140lbs springs. The question is, if the tight track of Streets of Willow will work with ONLY 22mm bar front and 140lbs Springs rear or am I going to have too much understeer? (4 Cyl Car)

I believe that you are over thinking this process. As an easy to change item, a rear sway bar is a relatively trivial piece of the total suspension puzzle and can easily be functionally removed from the equation by disconnecting one side drop link. Drive the car on track and see what it does. If you are not satisfied with the handling, make ONE change and reevaluate. If the handling is worse go in the opposite direction. If it is better, you are applying a beneficial correction. If you are not already familiar with the effects of tire pressure and are not routinely taking tire temp measurements at the track to evaluate your alignment settings, then I would suggest getting very familiar with this as a first step in dialing in your car. When I was developing my 914, I used test and tune Fridays at Willow to great benefit. Good luck to you, dialing in a new track toy can be a frustrating but ultimately very satisfying task when you hit the right combination.

[stownsen914]

Another data point ... when I had 300 lb/in front springs and 175 rears on my racecar, I used a 22 mm front sway bar and a 16 rear. When I went to heavier springs at both ends (500, 275 I think), I had to delete the rear bar to get the handling balanced. If I recall correctly 300 lb front springs are similar to 21mm torsions. I'm thinking that with 140 lb rears you are going to want the rear bar, but as suggested it's easy to test. Just keep it in place and remove one drop link to "remove" it for before/after testing.

Scott

[ConeDodger]

Like the previous poster said, from the research I’ve done, it’s either really heavy springs and no bar or lighter springs with a bar.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

I use 200# rear springs and a bar on tight courses and disconnect one end of the bar on wide open courses. I use the same front bar as you will be using. There is no rubber in my suspension at all and I cornerbalance yearly.

[IronHillRestorations]

I'm no racer, but was told by a few respected guys that you use a rear bar if you had a limited slip, and you can also run a little softer rear springs.

I like a rear bar on a street car.

[914forme]

Depends on the limited slip your running factory style with plates and clutches, works great. Torque Biased style will have issues if you get some rear wheel lift.

Each car is different and each driver is very different, easy to test out, and see what you like.

[ranchman]

Does anyone have an extra Rear bar for sale? they seem hard to find. I have a 396 V8 in my car with 350# front and 300# rear springs with a 6spd Boxster S trans with a Wavetrac LSD, but on tight courses, its tail waggin! Thanks

[mepstein]

Does anyone have an extra Rear bar for sale? they seem hard to find. I have a 396 V8 in my car with 350# front and 300# rear springs with a 6spd Boxster S trans with a Wavetrac LSD, but on tight courses, its tail waggin! Thanks

I have a aftermarket Adco rear sway bar. It’s larger diameter than stock but I don’t remember exact specs. I can check in the next day or two. Will need new bushings. $100 + ship. Does not include lower shock bolts. Shipping is probably $25-30. Let me know if interested.

@ranchman

[Justinp71]

Not to derail too much but for those of you running high spring rates (250+) in the rear, do you have the GT re-enforcement kit? I was once told high spring rates will tear apart the rear shock towers if not re-enforced. Seems like a rear sway bar with softer springs could be easier on the chassis for those of us with no rear re-enforcement.

[914 Ranch]

Once upon a time (7 years ago) in a land far away (Orange County CA.) I was trying to dial in my car at El Toro. What I learned was that my 1600 pound car with a 6 and Quafed diff needed lighter springs to get to the point that I could use and adjust sway bars. I had 911 front suspension and 180 pound springs in the rear. I changed out the front with -4 torsion bars. The next time at the track I disconnected the sway bars and went out on track. The car was tail happy. Hooked up the rear bar and that planted the rear of the car. The front of the car was still pushing and I noticed that the front still needed less camber (inside edeg of the tires were not getting scuffed). I need to get all of this stuff sorted before I go out and spend the big money for the good stuff from Elephant. ( I don't have 10K to spend on the front suspension at this time.) It dosen't look like I'll have the car ready for racing till next season without Elephant parts. My hole point is that I want my suspension to be adjustable, including the bars. So if I feel a little push I can use more bar in the front or take some off of the rear depending on the tire temps.
A pyrometer is your best friend when tuning your suspension.