LS-1 conversion advice needed, Problem solved ! See pg.2 Options

[drifter914]

I have a '76 914 with a 2000 LS-1 engine & Renegade kit I have been sorting out over the past 2 years. It's now a dependable, roadworthy car w/ '84 Carrera front suspension. rear Rebel Racing Bilstein coilovers w/ 200# springs, etc, a dedicated aluminum V-8 conversion, pretty well sorted & a joy to drive !
However, the car came to me with no T-stat in the cooling system & this engine needs a thermostat to run properly.
Where & how do I install one ? I have a 3-port electric water pump mounted near the alternator on lower left side of engine. It has a large (1.25") hose on center port and 2 smaller hoses top & bottom, all located in front, center plate of pump.
The plumbing details of this cooling system are somewhat complicated, but I'm assuming they are properly arranged, as the car always runs cool.

I have an aluminum T-stat housing made to be installed in line in a 1.25" dia. hose.
Both lines running to & from the radiator are 1.25", as is the center port hose on the water pump. Not sure if I can use the housing, but I have it if needed.

So, where should I locate the thermostat & how ?
Ideally the button side of it would be next to the hot water from engine so it can open at the prescribed temp.

Hoping for a solution here.. I realize this is an air cooled forum, but have been a member here long enough to know there are many of you running SBC conversions & hoping someone will have the correct answer.
Thanks for helping... Terry

[9144me2enjoy]

You might want to contact Renegade Hybrids, they’ve usually pretty good about helping you out on these kind of questions since they’ve dealt with it themselves on some of there LS conversions. Or contact the manufacturer of the electric water pump your running to see what they would recommend. Good luck

If you have room why not go back to a stock water pump, with thermostat. There is really no reason to run an electric water pump on a daily driver unless your racing or tracking the car a lot.

[ValcoOscar]

Hey Terry-

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/welcome.png) ...it's been awhile

I sent you a PM. I have the same set up in one of my cars.
Post some more photos of your car when you get a chance.
Looks nice from that teaser photo. White w GT flares (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

Oscar

[drifter914]

Hello there 914-4me & valco Oscar ! Thanks for chiming in...
I will contact Renegade re: thermo placement.

Oscar & I have very similar projects at the moment. He is just getting back to work on his LS project, where mine is complete & a driver.
Seems we have a lot to discuss.
Still no answer to my question though... where & how to put the thermostat for a LS-1 conversion.

best to all teeners... Terry

[BIGKAT_83]

Needs to go on the high pressure hose going to the radiator .
here is what I used

[Daryl32]

Any pictures of the front of the engine and water system?

This is what I did for a friends car, it is a 1st gen 350 so I do not know much about the LS swaps.

I have called Renegade a couple of times for advice, they do not give any out. You have to call have your kit invoice # - proof you have one of their kits before they will help you-me.

The water pump is a Davis Craig unit out of Australia - got it and their header - manifold system from Summit. The water pump comes with an electronic control box that lets you pick:
temp pump starts running
Temp fan starts and stops
How long pimp and fan runs after engine is shut off.

So far we have only got the engine to fire up - still have a lot to do to be able to drive it.

[Daryl32]

Needs to go on the high pressure hose going to the radiator .
here is what I used

Thermostat goes between the engine and the radiator. It does two things - keeps water in the engine until it warms up. And second it controls the flow rate of the water speed to the radiator. If the water goes through the radiator too fast the engine will run hot as it goes through the radiator too fast to cool down.

[drifter914]

Needs to go on the high pressure hose going to the radiator .
here is what I used

BigKat... that is the housing I have... now, which is the high pressure hose & where in that hose should it be put?
Seems like it should be as near the engine as possible.
The electric pump is a Meziere with a 1.25" center port & 2x 1" ports above & below that. Does the pump take coolant in thru the large center port, or push it out.
Knowing that I would know where to locate the t-stat.
Thanks... Terry

[Daryl32]

Needs to go on the high pressure hose going to the radiator .
here is what I used

BigKat... that is the housing I have... now, which is the high pressure hose & where in that hose should it be put?
Seems like it should be as near the engine as possible.
The electric pump is a Meziere with a 1.25" center port & 2x 1" ports above & below that. Does the pump take coolant in thru the large center port, or push it out.
Knowing that I would know where to locate the t-stat.
Thanks... Terry

Terry it needs to go close to the engine in the line/hose that goes from the engine to the radiator. It needs to be "In touch" with the hot water coming out of the engine.

Typically thermostats are on the engine where the water comes out and goes to the radiator.

The pump pulls water from the bottom of the radiator and pushes this cooled water in the front of the block. If you put the thermostat in line with the water coming out of the radiator you will cause the engine to run HOT and could cause damage to it.

[drifter914]

Needs to go on the high pressure hose going to the radiator .
here is what I used

BigKat... that is the housing I have... now, which is the high pressure hose & where in that hose should it be put?
Seems like it should be as near the engine as possible.
The electric pump is a Meziere with a 1.25" center port & 2x 1" ports above & below that. Does the pump take coolant in thru the large center port, or push it out.
Knowing that I would know where to locate the t-stat.
Thanks... Terry

Terry it needs to go close to the engine in the line/hose that goes from the engine to the radiator. It needs to be "In touch" with the hot water coming out of the engine.

Typically thermostats are on the engine where the water comes out and goes to the radiator.

The pump pulls water from the bottom of the radiator and pushes this cooled water in the front of the block. If you put the thermostat in line with the water coming out of the radiator you will cause the engine to run HOT and could cause damage to it.

So Daryl... if the pump is pushing the cool water into the 2 ports on the front of the block... where is the hot engine water coming out of the block ? Then I would know which hose to place the t-stat in.

[DickSteinkamp]

I think Daryl has a traditional small block.

It looks like an LS does things the opposite of the traditional Small Block and restricts the water coming into the water pump from the rad...not the other way around...

LS cooling system



"The thermostat is located in an area between the engine and the radiator. The classic small-block Chevy V8 located the thermostat on the "outlet" side of the motor, in the intake manifold. When cold, the thermostat was closed, and this prevented flow of coolant to the radiator. When the engine warmed up, the thermostat opened and coolant was allowed to flow to the radiator and back to the engine. The newer third- and fourth-gen GM V8's locate the thermostat on the "inlet" side of the motor - specifically in the inlet housing of the water pump. With this design, when cold, coolant is pumped through the rad, but is prevented from returning to the engine until the temperature of the thermostat has been reached, at which point the thermostat opens and the cooled coolant returns to the engine."

LS Thermostat

[dwillouby]

Hello

This is how Renegade said to plumb my LS2.

I have the inline thermostat up near the radiator on the hot side.

David

[Daryl32]

Ok Terry - Dick is correct. I did not know how a LS pump went on and worked.

Sorry - I need to look at this more for my own knowledge.

[Daryl32]

Hello

This is how Renegade said to plumb my LS2.

I have the inline thermostat up near the radiator on the hot side.

David

This looks correct - basically the same as with a older v8 - stopping/controlling the water going into the radiator from the engine. So that it can warm up to correct operating temp.

[Daryl32]

Hello

This is how Renegade said to plumb my LS2.

I have the inline thermostat up near the radiator on the hot side.

David

With the Thermostat at the radiator - does your engine run a little hot unit it opens up?

Just wondering as the heat of the water has to travel from the engine all the way through the tube to the radiator thermally to get the thermostat to open up.

I am old school so still learning how LS engines work.

[Daryl32]

Terry and David

Have you seen this video?

Seems like in a 914 we would need to make sure we use an LS engine with 4 steam holes in it. To make sure the air get bled out of the rears of the heads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2_twsAziZ0

[drifter914]

Wow ! By inquiring from the Forum, I have realized how much I have to learn about the LS-1 & it's systems I am dealing with ! The cooling system in particular at this point. DickS has made a huge contribution with the link he provided, reads like the bible on LS cooling systems. Not sure I understand it all yet, but will study it until I do. The one thing that sets mine apart is the remote water pump (Meziere).
No t-stat housing incorporated like the stock LS-1 pump, so by reading Dick's link I would be inclined to cut the hose coming from the radiator just ahead of the large center port on the water pump & install the aluminum t-stat housing there with the "button" facing .... which way?
I've tried 2 locations so far: 1) just ahead of the upper radiator connection... fail, engine overheated before hot water got far enough to open the t-stat. Made me wonder if a bypass type t-stat might work better... eliminate the pressure stoppage behind t-stat. 2). below the Renegade collector box where the hose to the inlet side of rad starts... same result. Again, a bypass t-stat might work. I can make one & try it if it comes back to that.
However it appears the LS system places the t-stat in the return line from rad, just before pump.... any comments ?
I'm still undecided what to do next, but would like to make it my last & a successful attempt !

(914-4 me... great link (video) about the steam lines on the LS engines. Mine has 2 at the front corners of the engine that vent into the pressure canister (fill tank)
that has a pressure cap & may act as a pressure tank as mentioned in Dicks link.
All for now... but many thanks for the good input so far !
I want to add some pics of the car I took today, but may have to start a new thread.
See what I can do here first.
Later... Terry [attachmentid=730
967]

[DickSteinkamp]

Beautiful car. Love the white.

[drifter914]

Beautiful car. Love the white.

Gran Prix white, a 911 color. Steel flairs, body prep & paint done by Eugene Rice of Gene's Auto Haven
Sandy, Utah.

Hoping someone with a correct LS install in a 914 will respond with a solution to t-stat placement.

Meanwhile... a few more pics...

[attachmentid=731
235]

[Daryl32]

You should get a lot of good days for driving your car in Arizona!

Really like the lay out in the engine compartment - very clean!