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> A arm and ball joint
Stltri
post Jul 16 2020, 12:28 PM
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Plan to replace a arm bushings. Started removing the front driver a arm but my ball joint spindle won’t budge from the carrier. Tried tuning fork, map torch, pbblaster, and two opposing BFH. It’s rusted in there. Anybody got alternative strategies? Perhaps I need a special tool although I don’t think the tie rod remover will work here?

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mepstein
post Jul 16 2020, 12:52 PM
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I’ve removed at least a dozen pairs from very rusty (east coast) struts. If you still have the rubber cover on your ball joint, you aren’t getting it hot enough. 8-10 minutes with MAP gas, spray with penetrating oil as it cools, hit the bottom of the ball joint with a big hammer to shock it and rinse and repeat.

I always remove the strut from the a arm with the ball joint and then work on the ball joint/strut removal off the car. If you have trouble getting the ball joint nut off the bottom of the a arm, the same removal technique as above and use an impact gun with a good ball joint tool.
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Stltri
post Jul 16 2020, 06:35 PM
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QUOTE(mepstein @ Jul 16 2020, 11:52 AM) *

I’ve removed at least a dozen pairs from very rusty (east coast) struts. If you still have the rubber cover on your ball joint, you aren’t getting it hot enough. 8-10 minutes with MAP gas, spray with penetrating oil as it cools, hit the bottom of the ball joint with a big hammer to shock it and rinse and repeat.

I always remove the strut from the a arm with the ball joint and then work on the ball joint/strut removal off the car. If you have trouble getting the ball joint nut off the bottom of the a arm, the same removal technique as above and use an impact gun with a good ball joint tool.


Thanks for the pointers! So I was able to pry it loose after a lot of heat, prying, and pbblaster. But just when I thought I was free I got stuck pulling it completely out so I thought by loosening the rest of the bolts and in turn drop the arm out I can wiggle spindle out. Nope. Still stuck. Do I just hammer it out or use more heat and oil?Attached Image
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mepstein
post Jul 16 2020, 06:59 PM
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More heat on the strut and then using a piece of metal over the a arm, give it a couple hits with the hammer. Don’t hit the a arm directly with the hammer.

Are you just doing a arm bushings or going all in. Ball joints, tie rods, powder coating, etc?
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Stltri
post Jul 16 2020, 07:21 PM
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QUOTE(mepstein @ Jul 16 2020, 05:59 PM) *

More heat on the strut and then using a piece of metal over the a arm, give it a couple hits with the hammer. Don’t hit the a arm directly with the hammer.

Are you just doing a arm bushings or going all in. Ball joints, tie rods, powder coating, etc?


Initially, was only doing the bushings, but looks like I will need to replace the ball joints which I'm dreading since it was a pain to get this one out (I still have to do the other side after all this) .. sounds like ball joint spindle will a pain to get back into the strut? Maybe I'll need a new strut? I just switched to Turbo tie rods last year, but I will inspect the tie rod ends.
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mepstein
post Jul 16 2020, 07:41 PM
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The hole for the ball joint just needs to be cleaned up a bit. It’s very common on 50 year old parts.
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iankarr
post Jul 16 2020, 10:15 PM
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When you're ready...there's an A-arm bushing install video on my YouTube channel. Link in my sig below.
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Stltri
post Jul 16 2020, 11:04 PM
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QUOTE(cuddy_k @ Jul 16 2020, 09:15 PM) *

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When you're ready...there's an A-arm bushing install video on my YouTube channel. Link in my sig below.


Actually used your videos on a bunch of my 914 projects already. That includes this current project. Thanks for all your contribution to this community! I was going to wait for your rear trailing arm bushing video but I decided to tackle that first. Thanks to members of this forum for their insights especially @tvdinnerbythepool for his help with my rear trailing arm refurb. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Jack Standz
post Jul 17 2020, 09:22 AM
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QUOTE(Stltri @ Jul 17 2020, 07:35 AM) *

QUOTE(mepstein @ Jul 16 2020, 11:52 AM) *

I’ve removed at least a dozen pairs from very rusty (east coast) struts. If you still have the rubber cover on your ball joint, you aren’t getting it hot enough. 8-10 minutes with MAP gas, spray with penetrating oil as it cools, hit the bottom of the ball joint with a big hammer to shock it and rinse and repeat.

I always remove the strut from the a arm with the ball joint and then work on the ball joint/strut removal off the car. If you have trouble getting the ball joint nut off the bottom of the a arm, the same removal technique as above and use an impact gun with a good ball joint tool.


Thanks for the pointers! So I was able to pry it loose after a lot of heat, prying, and pbblaster. But just when I thought I was free I got stuck pulling it completely out so I thought by loosening the rest of the bolts and in turn drop the arm out I can wiggle spindle out. Nope. Still stuck. Do I just hammer it out or use more heat and oil?Attached Image


Yes, heat, PB Blaster & all that. Be very careful with hitting on the a-arm if you decide to go that route even with a wood block to cushion the hits.

You can use an engine hoist by putting heavy washer/nut on top of strut (insert being replaced anyway), heavy chain, then wood block between a-arm and underside of hoist.

To remove the ball joint, carefully use cutoff wheel to cut the nut (can cut from center of underside of ball joint to the outside, you don't need to cut all the way through), then hit with chisel in the slot to unscrew it. Impact hammer/chisel works too sometimes.

Sorry, no photos of using this technique on a 911 front end that just would not let go after all these years (mid 70s? With original struts and ball joints). She really fought us.
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Stltri
post Jul 17 2020, 07:47 PM
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I finally got ball joints free. Instead of hammering the arm, I used a block of steel as spacer so I can use the pickle fork. Worked well. Was also able to free the other side same way. It was also seized and rusted but not as bad. Now onto replacing the ball joints and bushings. Thanks everyone!

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Finally.. quick question.. what the heck is this behind the torsion bar? Disintegrated spacer vs bushing vs washer vs oil/dirt???

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mepstein
post Jul 17 2020, 08:40 PM
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OEM foam seal. You can buy from Porsche for ~$10 each or use some pipe insulating foam or similar.
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jonferns
post Jul 17 2020, 08:40 PM
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Felt washer/seal. Mine was disintegrated as well, so I cut new ones from a chunk of closed-cell foam.
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Stltri
post Jul 17 2020, 10:06 PM
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Interesting. Anybody have a pic or part number? Does it simply keep moisture out of the torsion bar space?
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mepstein
post Jul 18 2020, 05:13 AM
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QUOTE(Stltri @ Jul 18 2020, 12:06 AM) *

Interesting. Anybody have a pic or part number? Does it simply keep moisture out of the torsion bar space?



https://nemigaparts.com/cat_spares/pet/pors...14/570u/401000/

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jonferns
post Jul 18 2020, 09:10 AM
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QUOTE(Stltri @ Jul 17 2020, 11:06 PM) *

Interesting. Anybody have a pic or part number? Does it simply keep moisture out of the torsion bar space?


https://www.aasesales.com/products/d1e-b52-337i-104166
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914e
post Jul 18 2020, 11:05 AM
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QUOTE(jonferns @ Jul 18 2020, 08:10 AM) *

QUOTE(Stltri @ Jul 17 2020, 11:06 PM) *

Interesting. Anybody have a pic or part number? Does it simply keep moisture out of the torsion bar space?


https://www.aasesales.com/products/d1e-b52-337i-104166


I guess I should order those now. Is the any other consumable parts that are overlooked? There always seems to be some small part, clip, washer, that I need to order that I overlooked.
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mepstein
post Jul 18 2020, 11:15 AM
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QUOTE(914e @ Jul 18 2020, 01:05 PM) *

QUOTE(jonferns @ Jul 18 2020, 08:10 AM) *

QUOTE(Stltri @ Jul 17 2020, 11:06 PM) *

Interesting. Anybody have a pic or part number? Does it simply keep moisture out of the torsion bar space?


https://www.aasesales.com/products/d1e-b52-337i-104166


I guess I should order those now. Is the any other consumable parts that are overlooked? There always seems to be some small part, clip, washer, that I need to order that I overlooked.

Check your torsion bars to make sure they aren't gouged from riding low on worn out bushings.
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Stltri
post Jul 22 2020, 08:21 AM
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Just an update and a few question.. got the arm bushings installed, cleaned the strut hole as @mepstein recommended, and getting ready to put everything back..

Do I install the ball joint to arms (with nut already torqued to 180 ft/lbs with washer and cotter pin) first then bolt arm to chassis then insert ball joint shaft into strut followed by ball joint pin? Or do I bolt arm to chassis then ball joint to strut and lastly, put nut on ball joint and torque to spec?

Last question.. Im using new ball joints, locking pins and nuts, but should I also use a new ball joint nut and washer, they look ok after cleaning, I also did not damage nuts since I used a "4WD tool" and impact drill to remove.
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mepstein
post Jul 22 2020, 09:21 AM
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Reuse the ball joint nut and washer if they are in good shape.
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Stltri
post Jul 22 2020, 12:46 PM
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QUOTE(mepstein @ Jul 22 2020, 08:21 AM) *

Reuse the ball joint nut and washer if they are in good shape.


Thanks Ill do that then. My question about the sequence of assembly asks if it’s easier to torque the ball joint nut on the bench or on the car?
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