70-914-6 Clean Up, Carbs and Starting - QUESTIONS Options

[ctc911ctc]

Engine ready to go, if you passed my house this is what you would see when the garage is open.

[ctc911ctc]

Got the engine in, hooked up the battery

Turned the key

Hhhhmmmmm, gas smell is pretty strong…………

Rebuilt engine baptism - 93 octane, look for the circle in the picture

AND

Filled the oil res with a quart, looked for leaks, none yet!

Started to put in another 5 quarts from a big gallon style bottle, funnel broke…. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

Oil baptism on the other side

2 hours of cleaning or as I like to think of it: back sliding

[bkrantz]

Wow, two visits from the Stuff Happens fairy in one day.

[dtmehall]

dude

you might want to clean up that battery tray. looks like there might be some corrosion there!

[dtmehall]

ask me how i know

[ctc911ctc]

Entire engine bay was dry iced, sprayed the areas where paint came off with flat clear

Looks rough, but the entire hell hole is in very strong shape, did not want a have-ass engine bay job, went with a cleanup and kept the ‘ patina’. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

dude

you might want to clean up that battery tray. looks like there might be some corrosion there!

[ctc911ctc]

Wow, two visits from the Stuff Happens fairy in one day.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[DennisV]

Hang in there. You're making progress...

[ctc911ctc]

Worked on the car yesterday and today - starts first crank, idles perfectly and then it starts to idle higher - Help me out here:

1. I need to set the idle lower and then use the manual idle increase handle to bring it up and then when it starts to warm up and climb, move the handle

2. There is something else causing the idle to climb so high

https://youtu.be/dElimRx702A

[ctc911ctc]

Hooked all of the controls up to the engine, throttle (yup, new cables, wrapped around the clutch cable the first time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif) ), clutch, etc.

Started the car previously and noticed that the car was in gear. NP, with the linkage hooked up I will just, er, ah,darn thing, cannot select gears.......... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Now, I have re-built 4 901s so of course I am now an expert and I had that feeling that perhaps this one was not as straight forward as the others.....did I follow the evil ways correctly? Soo, I drained it and started at the back - opened the first access panel and the selector knob was within the selector bar.....whew! One down.

I then opened the side access (Side Shifter access hole) and everything seemed to be...........wait, the top selector rod was forward. It was not in neutral position meaning the car was locked in 2nd. Starts fine in second though the tires were spinning kinda fast (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

I of course from the evil videos have a calibrated BIG AND UGLY screw driver just for this purpose. CLICK and now all 3 selector bars are aligned and the car is in neutral. Put it all back together and it shifts fine..

I must of somehow forgot to push all of the selector bars (3) into position when I closed the back of the transmission.

ALL GOOD NOW....

[gereed75]

Nice work. Way above my pay grade. Love these sort of rolling keep it original restos. Really nice car!!

[Spoke]

Engine/trans look great. Good job getting it running. It's gotta be a blast to drive.

[ctc911ctc]

Got the car off the rack - tightened the lugs, check one more time for leaks.......

Car started first try, backed out of the driveway and went around the block

Drive strong.....very strong......

#2 cyl-carb is still 'spitting' definitely not backfiring. Chasing this through my trusty guide:

https://www.performanceoriented.com/special-procedures-1

See "notes" section

Seems that when I performed the Lean Best Idle procedure #2 failed during the procedure......the diagnosis within the document states that either the path in that carb #2 is blocked or the jet is the wrong size - my bet is a clog......though the carbs were very clean when I got the car.

There is a little noise from the right side, that in a 914-2L 4Cyl would be considered quiet, my hope is that it is not valve noise and may be exhaust leaking......did I tighten the heater manifold small nuts????? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/dry.gif)

Carb advice sought from those that have chased a SPITTING Carb

THANK YOU TEENERS! Almost there!!!

[ctc911ctc]

Transmission - Shifter

While I am chasing the 'carb-spitting' issue, I am also chasing the shifter being.....OFF

This is manifesting itself as the DREADED 1st to reverse problem.......As to the condition of the 901, gears are all within spec, new syncs 1st and second, new slider for 1st reverse - new dog teeth for 1st and second.

Let me explain,

When I put the car into 1st or reverse, I (as well all of you) push the lever from RIGHT to LEFT and feel the spring pressure of the shift plate.

About 1/4 of the way to the full extent of the spring compression the there is strong resistance. BUT i can CONTINUE to push to the left. I believe that I have reached the limit of the various linkage components and that what I am REALLY doing at this point is torquing the linkage. I can then continue to torque the linkage until I have reached the full travel of the shift lever spring plate



What happens is; when the shift comes out of 1st, there is no SPRING BUMP to push the selector in the transmission from the 1st-reverse position to the 2nd-3rd or middle position.

I have cut pictures from Clay Perrine's excellent 901 cut-away to depict what is happening

Transmission is in Neutral on the other side of the selector bars is a vertical channel, there is a knob that is in ONE of the THREE channels - when moved the selected bar moves left to right



Now, the knob is in the channel of the lowest bar AND the bar is slide to the left for FIRST GEAR



My shift LINKAGE - not the shift lever - when moved forward never gets the BUMP from the spring and as a result STAYS in the LOWEST position THOUGH the shift lever HAS moved to the right and you think that the shift is in the correct place BUT NO, it ends up pushing the SAME slider BACKWARD into reverse



OUCH!!!!!

What should happen is the selector should get a bump to the next position from the spring and end up here.




MY PLAN

I am going to adjust the Shift bar about 20 degrees until I do not get any mechanical loading, not sure if 20 degrees is correct......feels right.......

[ctc911ctc]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/icon_bump.gif)

could not find this thread and I bumped it for additions

[ctc911ctc]

All,

Here is the latest installment

I have the car on the road, the power/torque is low between 1k-3k, I have not chased dynamic timing yet.

Have performed the lean-best process a few times, think it is now optimum…BUT

It runs very smooth though takes 2-5 min to get there, here is the complete story:


Starting takes a a great deal of work, there is gas in all 4 bowls – all 6 carb barrels are squirting – verified

When I try to start the car, start with the lever pulled for higher idle;
Crank #1
3 steps on the gas – slow and full, one or two cylinders start popping
same for the next 4 tries........
Crank #5
3 steps on the gas – starts to run though rough with a great deal of spitting
Keep pumping the gas to keep it running

Starts to catch……and settles in at;
Running about 1200, occasional spiting on #4, lots of ignition in the muffler – popping not banging….thinking that it is raw gas going past a few cylinders

After about 2-5 minutes of it running while spitting and banging…….

ALL OF A SUDDEN the RPMS go to 2500+

I put the starting handle back down to zero and the engine is running smooth – very little if any spitting - huh (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

So, my next move is to:

Replace all of the plugs – I only replaced 2 to trouble shoot

Then, my current hypothesis is that 4-5 cylinders are running and the others are dragging the rpms down – then, after things warm up the other cylinders engage and the RPMS rise……

Any thoughts from the master 914-6 gurus here at 914-world?

Thank you Teeners!

[Robarabian]

This will sound dumb... but it sort of happened to me once...

Hard to start carburetor and the erratic between idle and warm up. Make sure all the nuts to the manifold are tight... ie., carb to head, and carb to manifold. If you have an air leak, it will make the start hard... and once it warms and things expand, youre getting full seal and it is revving.....

Spitting barrels at start up are usually lean on pilot circuit.... My 40's don't really spit or cough when it is cold on my 2.7...

The symptom I describe above is learned on my 428 Cobra Jet mustang.. the carb nuts to the manifold worked themselves loose and it wasn't pulling vacuum / air through the carbs.....

Again, take it in the spirit of "take a quick look and eliminate it..."

All,

Here is the latest installment

I have the car on the road, the power/torque is low between 1k-3k, I have not chased dynamic timing yet.

Have performed the lean-best process a few times, think it is now optimum…BUT

It runs very smooth though takes 2-5 min to get there, here is the complete story:


Starting takes a a great deal of work, there is gas in all 4 bowls – all 6 carb barrels are squirting – verified

When I try to start the car, start with the lever pulled for higher idle;
Crank #1
3 steps on the gas – slow and full, one or two cylinders start popping
same for the next 4 tries........
Crank #5
3 steps on the gas – starts to run though rough with a great deal of spitting
Keep pumping the gas to keep it running

Starts to catch……and settles in at;
Running about 1200, occasional spiting on #4, lots of ignition in the muffler – popping not banging….thinking that it is raw gas going past a few cylinders

After about 2-5 minutes of it running while spitting and banging…….

ALL OF A SUDDEN the RPMS go to 2500+

I put the starting handle back down to zero and the engine is running smooth – very little if any spitting - huh (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

So, my next move is to:

Replace all of the plugs – I only replaced 2 to trouble shoot

Then, my current hypothesis is that 4-5 cylinders are running and the others are dragging the rpms down – then, after things warm up the other cylinders engage and the RPMS rise……

Any thoughts from the master 914-6 gurus here at 914-world?

Thank you Teeners!

[ctc911ctc]

Thank you for the tip - I will triple check the bolts......

This will sound dumb... but it sort of happened to me once...

Hard to start carburetor and the erratic between idle and warm up. Make sure all the nuts to the manifold are tight... ie., carb to head, and carb to manifold. If you have an air leak, it will make the start hard... and once it warms and things expand, youre getting full seal and it is revving.....

Spitting barrels at start up are usually lean on pilot circuit.... My 40's don't really spit or cough when it is cold on my 2.7...

The symptom I describe above is learned on my 428 Cobra Jet mustang.. the carb nuts to the manifold worked themselves loose and it wasn't pulling vacuum / air through the carbs.....

Again, take it in the spirit of "take a quick look and eliminate it..."

All,

Here is the latest installment

I have the car on the road, the power/torque is low between 1k-3k, I have not chased dynamic timing yet.

Have performed the lean-best process a few times, think it is now optimum…BUT

It runs very smooth though takes 2-5 min to get there, here is the complete story:


Starting takes a a great deal of work, there is gas in all 4 bowls – all 6 carb barrels are squirting – verified

When I try to start the car, start with the lever pulled for higher idle;
Crank #1
3 steps on the gas – slow and full, one or two cylinders start popping
same for the next 4 tries........
Crank #5
3 steps on the gas – starts to run though rough with a great deal of spitting
Keep pumping the gas to keep it running

Starts to catch……and settles in at;
Running about 1200, occasional spiting on #4, lots of ignition in the muffler – popping not banging….thinking that it is raw gas going past a few cylinders

After about 2-5 minutes of it running while spitting and banging…….

ALL OF A SUDDEN the RPMS go to 2500+

I put the starting handle back down to zero and the engine is running smooth – very little if any spitting - huh (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

So, my next move is to:

Replace all of the plugs – I only replaced 2 to trouble shoot

Then, my current hypothesis is that 4-5 cylinders are running and the others are dragging the rpms down – then, after things warm up the other cylinders engage and the RPMS rise……

Any thoughts from the master 914-6 gurus here at 914-world?

Thank you Teeners!

[930cabman]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

having similar issues with my /6 conversion, hard starting, but gearbox OK. I am considering going up one size with idle jets to help with the popping

have yet to dig in, she is in the paint shop getting original Palma Green

[rgalla9146]

Hey Cary
Determine what jets (idle, main, air correction and emulsion) and venturis are in the
carbs.
Go with Paul Abbots recommendations. Probably too lean on idle circuit.
Also, 30mm venturis not 27s
The hand throttle is not needed on startup in warm weather or on a warm engine.
Confirm that links between throttle shafts (butterfly shafts) on each carb are tight and
coordinated.
Those are newer production carbs so should not have high mileage issues.