fuel delvery options, d-jet vs carbs Options

[orangecrate]

I'm finally getting closer to getting the Cruel Mistress on the road . (Read I'm putting things together instead of taking them apart) I'VE dumped a ton of new parts in this rig and alot of time and energy. I want to actually use it as I believe it was designed for, a touring car. Like several thousand mile trips. AZ to WA. Hwy 1. The Rockies. Million Dollar Hwy. Road trips. Engine rebuilt. Trans refurbished . New brakes, bearings,etc. Mechanically in very good shape. Electrical Eh the light and signals work and wipers. My concern is being stranded somewhere by my 50+ yr old FI. D-jet. In terms of reliability, would I be better off to run carbs and if so what setup? She's a 72 1.7 ,stock motor. If I stick with the Djet , what spares should I take? What are your thoughts on converting to Mega Squirt to control the FI?? This is not a high end build. Thanks for your thoughts , insights and time. Robin (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[Jack Standz]

Interesting question.

Ran a carbureted '72 1.7 liter for 15+ years.

Simple to maintain, but if you set the jets for Apache Junction (elevation around 1700 feet), it can have problems with maintaining the proper air fuel ratio (AFR) at higher altitudes you're likely to run into during your travels. Use an AFR gauge to get the carbs dialed in and you'll be good around town.

Spares? Take maintenance tools (wrenches, screwdrivers, things like that), spare accelerator cable, carb cleaner (in case you get dirt in the idle circuit, etc) and a spare fuel filter. Carbs are pretty simple.

Modern fuel injection is a better (but more expensive) way to go. MicroSquirt or MegaSquirt.

[Shivers]

I put carbs on mine in 1983. They now need to be rebuilt. I did carry in the car a thin piece of wire to poke out the jets when they clogged. On the freeway I got great fuel economy when I cruised in one lane at one speed. But it was rare that I just cruised and at play and around town fuel economy was not so good. One thing I noticed after putting the carbs on was I only had to put the car in 1st after I stopped. A slow right turn with the FI would bog the engine too much and I be grinding into 1st.

[930cabman]

I am a dyed in the wool carb guy, my vote would go to a pair of Weber 40 IDF carbs

they can be a bit finicky, but I have had good luck for the past several decades with Webers

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[emerygt350]

I'm a believer in just driving it. Carbs of course would be less likely to break, but it doesn't eliminate all the other stuff that can happen. Much of which is more likely than a djet failure. The real weak items to me are the fuel pumps and mps diaphragm as far as driving goes. Most of those have been replaced or rebuilt at this point. Not sure about your car. The remainder of the system I think suffers from lack of use rather than driving.

[Ron914]

I'm a believer in just driving it. Carbs of course would be less likely to break, but it doesn't eliminate all the other stuff that can happen. Much of which is more likely than a djet failure. The real weak items to me are the fuel pumps and mps diaphragm as far as driving goes. Most of those have been replaced or rebuilt at this point. Not sure about your car. The remainder of the system I think suffers from lack of use rather than driving.

I would put a Cylinder head temperature sensor in your list if spares , unplug yours and you will see the motor will not start .and the special modified socket with a slit for the cabe so you can change it ,oh and a set of points and condenser.

[Superhawk996]

AAA and a credit card. Have fun out there!

Oh and keep a couple Benjamins in your wallet to tip the tow truck driver . . . Kidding . . . Sort of.

Drove my original 914 over 100k miles on IDF’s . . . Mostly trouble free. Have a good time . . Serious about that!

[dtmehall]

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i've been running 40idf's for 40+ years...no problems

[orangecrate]

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i've been running 40idf's for 40+ years...no problems

Seems the 40IDF's are a huge thing. What about converting to Megasquirt to run my injection?? Any views on that? What does it take?

[Superhawk996]

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i've been running 40idf's for 40+ years...no problems

Seems the 40IDF's are a huge thing. What about converting to Megasquirt to run my injection?? Any views on that? What does it take?

Knowledge + ability + $

Or $$$$ to hire it out

Way better than carbs though!

[VaccaRabite]

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i've been running 40idf's for 40+ years...no problems

Seems the 40IDF's are a huge thing. What about converting to Megasquirt to run my injection?? Any views on that? What does it take?

I've done the Megasquirt. I would not go this route at this point. MS is AWESOME, but I was constantly playing with it. And there are better systems now on the market for putting EFI on old cars.

I would be looking rally hard at Holley Sniper or Terminator X injection.
My current engine has Terminator X. I want to build an engine around Sniper EFI. Both options feature a solid self tuning ability once you have the base parameters nailed down.

There is a learning curve to EFI, and the newer the EFI the smaller that curve is.

Zach

[Root_Werks]

I'm a believer in just driving it. Carbs of course would be less likely to break, but it doesn't eliminate all the other stuff that can happen. Much of which is more likely than a djet failure. The real weak items to me are the fuel pumps and mps diaphragm as far as driving goes. Most of those have been replaced or rebuilt at this point. Not sure about your car. The remainder of the system I think suffers from lack of use rather than driving.

I would put a Cylinder head temperature sensor in your list if spares , unplug yours and you will see the motor will not start .and the special modified socket with a slit for the cabe so you can change it ,oh and a set of points and condenser.

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Your D-Jet is already there and presumably running well. Just stick with it. Carry some tools and the spares mentioned above.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[Jim Blakewell]

I put carbs on mine in 1983. They now need to be rebuilt. I did carry in the car a thin piece of wire to poke out the jets when they clogged. On the freeway I got great fuel economy when I cruised in one lane at one speed. But it was rare that I just cruised and at play and around town fuel economy was not so good. One thing I noticed after putting the carbs on was I only had to put the car in 1st after I stopped. A slow right turn with the FI would bog the engine too much and I be grinding into 1st.

[ClayPerrine]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

i've been running 40idf's for 40+ years...no problems

Seems the 40IDF's are a huge thing. What about converting to Megasquirt to run my injection?? Any views on that? What does it take?

I've done the Megasquirt. I would not go this route at this point. MS is AWESOME, but I was constantly playing with it. And there are better systems now on the market for putting EFI on old cars.

I would be looking rally hard at Holley Sniper or Terminator X injection.
My current engine has Terminator X. I want to build an engine around Sniper EFI. Both options feature a solid self tuning ability once you have the base parameters nailed down.

There is a learning curve to EFI, and the newer the EFI the smaller that curve is.

Zach

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

There are plenty of kits to do a modern EFI conversion. You get the power of dual carbs, and the drivability of fuel injection. Plus the ability to tune the engine out so that it will get all the horsepower out of the motor while still maintaining drivability.

PMB Performance, Zims, and a lot of others sell kits that can be installed in a weekend, and will be a turn key setup.

Modern EFI is a huge improvement over the stock D-Jet and definitely an improvement over carbs. No rejetting your carbs to go from sea level to the top of Eisenhower pass. :-D

[NARP74]

So what is a ballpark number for current FI as an add on to a Type IV?

[rjames]

Overall the original FI is pretty darn reliable. If I was making a long trip I'd take a spare MPS and a fuel pump. That said, I have refurbished my FI system, including adding a new wiring harness.

[Osnabruck914]

My previous 914 had D-Jet. My present one has dual Dellorto carbs. Previously with the D-Jet my heart was always in my mouth on longer trips, hoping and praying the FI would not leave me stranded (not easy to diagnosis and fix FI failures on the road), which it did several times. Now with carbs I drive those trips with impunity, knowing I can make needed repairs easily. GO CARBS and relax!

Osnabruck914

[930cabman]

My previous 914 had D-Jet. My present one has dual Dellorto carbs. Previously with the D-Jet my heart was always in my mouth on longer trips, hoping and praying the FI would not leave me stranded (not easy to diagnosis and fix FI failures on the road), which it did several times. Now with carbs I drive those trips with impunity, knowing I can make needed repairs easily. GO CARBS and relax!

Osnabruck914

+1, keep it simple

[ClayPerrine]

So what is a ballpark number for current FI as an add on to a Type IV?

https://store.allzim.com/914-parts/fuel-del...efi-conversion/

$3845.00

Complete with a pre-loaded fuel map that will get you a drivable car after installation. To get the optimum performance, you would have to dyno it to have a finish tune done.

[ctc911ctc]

On the Road Experience

1. Extra Relay for the Fuel Pump - know that the pump SHOULD make noise for 2 seconds once the key is turned If the cabin heat fan works, you can switch this relay with the fuel pump
2. Ignition Switch - only when it is raining hard, or below zero and you only have a light jacket will this fail - know this symptom - no spark but everything else works => ignition switch
3, When you are hill climbing and the car is hot and you stop for a Nehi Grape Soda, when you try and restart it may just not start. There are a few issues (yes more than just the position of the fuel pump) that in my experience cause this. Just finish the soda, enjoy the scenery and wait 20-30 minutes. It will start and will never tell you why it would not. This can be a real tail chaser.......yes, this happened to me in a car where the pump was in the Frunk.......10 below and with a date........sigh.....I still need therapy.
4. bumps - you can feel pebbles on the road in this car, limit the drive-per-day to 300miles, after 300 miles that the sport-feel-fatigue can make you wish for a sloppy driving mid 60s Cadillac
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