Subaru EJ20DETT Transplant Options

[fiid]

Hey all,

I have obtained a Subaru EJ20DETT motor that I intend to put in my 914.

For those not familiar with this motor - here is some info:

Water cooled flat 4 - twin turbos- staged.
276hp, 252.98 lbft torque

The engine also has coil-over-plugs. (i.e. there is a small coil mounted over each spark plug).

My plans fror the project are:
Use Ron Simpson Radiator, and some sheet metal that allows me to retain use of the front trunk. Spare tire in rear trunk.

Rebuild 901 box with billet intermediate plate, side cover, and limited slip.

Mount engine to tranny using KEP adapter.

Fabricate engine mount and exhaust (I'm thinkin 2 glasspacks should do it).


Here are the questions:

How do I get the thing to fire (anyone know of projects or products that can drive 4 coils and no distributer)???

Any better solutions to the transmition question? Should I run a 915? What do you guys think?

I have uprated the suspension to 23mm front sway bars with weltbushings, konis all round and 180lb rear springs. I intend to put bmw front calipers on it and it has a 19mm front master cyl.

Opinions? Ideas? I think this thing is going to rock when it's done!

Fiid. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

[aufaber]

It's been done a few times now, there are also some subaru 6's and NA 4's in 914's. I think they used the stock ECU.

I think his name is Rod (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) but you may want to look into renegade's radiator setup.. it realy WORKS, even in 120+ degree Las Vegas heat.

You'll want a bigger clutch, like the kenedy 9" or renegades which is the same thing with a different disk.

-Aaron G>

[Mueller]

There are a few Subaru powered 914's running around now (both 4 and 6 powered), and in fact another member here has the same exact motor for his 914.

Subaru Too

An aftermarket ECU might be your best bet, you might be able to use the factory ECU, it all depends on how much documentation you have for it.

I know for a fact that Haltech have a few different units that can run the fuel and ignition for this motor, I'm sure a few of the other brands can handle it as well.

Welcome to the forum, do us and yourself a favor and edit your information about your location, it could be benificial to you if someone else lives near you and you need help.

[Brad Roberts]

Mike..

You have met Fiid 3-4 times at Roadglue events and swap meets.

Welcome Fiid !!

Tid bit of info: Rod Simpson doesnt make radiators.. Ron Davis is the radiators guru (he makes them for Renegade and Simpson)

I think I would get the factory brain and use it. I know MOTEC will handle the ignition..but mapping fuel/ignition would be a nightmare.

Your laundry list looks good and I'm glad too see another one going together.

B

[Brad Roberts]

Oh.. if you have the money... shoot for the 915 box. The billet plate for the 901 doesnt help the R+P stay together. I also think the gearing straight out of the box on the 915 would be better for this application.


B

[aufaber]

And if you've got the money for a 915, then you might as want to go with a 911 front suspention. You get 5 lug and real brake choices.

-Aaron G>

[fiid]

The thing I like about the Rod Simpson radiator is that it is small and fits in the very front of the trunk compartment. Iwas thinking that with some ductwork I would be able to send the air out through the floor ( or sideways to the wheel wells ) and then retain a tenable storage space in the front trunk.

As for the transmition, I am wondering how much a 915 will cost. Also, would it be possible to fit a boxster tranny?? I sort of like the ideaof a tiptronic, or a 6 speed. Since it is going to cost about $2k to work up a 901 to be strong, I am wondering if this is enough to buy something better.

I am reluctant to concede that I should spring for the stock ECU, but you are probably right. Then all I have to worry about is some of the turbo vacuum control lines, weatercooling, and fit.

Another thought I had is that the motor has power steering and A/C pumps on it. I don't think that the power steering can be put on easily, but how much work would it be to get A/C up and running. Can I set it up as a heat pump, so that the same heater core can be used for warm and cold air, or am I on crack??

Thanks for the welcome, and for the ideas and feedback. I broke my arm last week, so I am using the time to try and figure out the best strategy, so I can start work in 6 weeks when the cast comes off!!

Cheers,

Fiid

[fiid]

And if you've got the money for a 915, then you might as want to go with a 911 front suspention. You get 5 lug and real brake choices.

-Aaron G>

Can I use all my trick 914 stuff on a 911 front end?? (Bushings, sway bars, torsion bars, shocks?)

I am afraid of the cost of wheels, but since I will probably have to spring for panasports anyway, I should probably just suck it up.

Does the 915 box require a 5 lug upgrade on the rear??

Fiid

[airsix]

For the 911 suspension you can just use the 911 struts and retain your 914 control arms, bushings, swaybar & torsionbars. You can even get an adaptor if you want to keep your current 914 strut inserts to use in the 911 struts. 5-lug wheel deals are to be found. I'm running 8x16 and 7x16 944 phone-dials. I got them with 50% Dunlop Sp8000's, lugnuts, and center caps all for $500.
-Ben M.

[Hawktel]

What if you added side scoops, hung 2 radiators in the engine compartment, 1 under each sail panel, and left the front trunk alone?

This is just speculation. I'm not a guru.

[redshift]

I haven't driven a 915 converted 914 in a while, have the problems been dealt with? I can look at web catalogs all day.. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I had a 425Hp V8 with a stock 901, other than the ratios being out to lunch, it worked pretty good.

I'd sure hate to lose my shift pattern, what do you guys know about changing out the mainshaft, and R&P on a 901?

In between disasters, I am on my way collecting stuff for my conversion.

with a bit of luck...



M

[fiid]

What if you added side scoops, hung 2 radiators in the engine compartment, 1 under each sail panel, and left the front trunk alone?

This is just speculation. I'm not a guru.

I thought about this. Asides from being a lot of scary-ass bodywork - it looks feasable.

Another option is doing a boxster and putting the radiators where the headlights live and converting to a non flip headlight, and ductingt the airflow to the sides of the frong trunk.

Anyone seen any cool headlamp conversions for the 914??

Fiid

[fiid]

For the 911 suspension you can just use the 911 struts and retain your 914 control arms, bushings, swaybar & torsionbars. You can even get an adaptor if you want to keep your current 914 strut inserts to use in the 911 struts. 5-lug wheel deals are to be found. I'm running 8x16 and 7x16 944 phone-dials. I got them with 50% Dunlop Sp8000's, lugnuts, and center caps all for $500.
-Ben M.

That seems like quite the deal. How much for the strut casings and adaptors (ballpark??)

How much does it cost to do the rears to 5 lug??

Fiid

[redshift]

The rears can be drilled for about $100.00, and you keep your ebrake without having to do wicked incantations, and dance backwards.

You may find 911 struts for a couple hundred bucks, +/-.

SC front end is the best way (especially if you don't have a front ARB) and you can find that for around $800-$1000, or soish.


M

[fiid]

Another question.....

I have a lightened flywheel for my 1.7 motor - I was thinking I'd be better with a full weight one for the conversion, to help iron the torque out for the tranny.....

Would you guys have the lightened wheel or a full weight wheel modified for the subaru motor??

Fiid.

[airsix]

Regarding 911 struts and 5-lug rear hubs:
When I said 911 strut I meant the whole strut assembly: strut tube, hub, bearings, brake rotor, brake caliper. Use the SC as mentioned above, but $800-$1k is way to much. I paid $500 for assembled struts with fresh brakes, including rotors and calipers for the rear too. Go to the 911 bullitin boards and classifieds and ask around. 911 guys are always upgrading and selling the stuff we are trying to get for our 914's. A lot of guys have this stuff laying in the bone pile and never post it for sale - you have to ask.

For the rears, have them done by Rich Johnson (someone will post his email addy). He will re-drill your rear hubs and press in new studs. $180 including parts when he did mine a few years ago.

-Ben M.

[soloracer]

Sounds like a fun project. If you plan on keeping everything stock I would keep the stock ECU as it would simply be a case of plug and play to get running. If you planned on modifying the engine at some time (change to single turbo, etc.) then I would go with a stand alone (probably a Haltech because of cost and from what I have read it is compatible with the Subaru ignition.)

I was considering the same engine but have been told there is a noticeable torque/power drop on the transition between turbo's. Anyone else heard this?

[fiid]

Sounds like a fun project. If you plan on keeping everything stock I would keep the stock ECU as it would simply be a case of plug and play to get running. If you planned on modifying the engine at some time (change to single turbo, etc.) then I would go with a stand alone (probably a Haltech because of cost and from what I have read it is compatible with the Subaru ignition.)

I was considering the same engine but have been told there is a noticeable torque/power drop on the transition between turbo's. Anyone else heard this?

This engine comes from the Legacy GTB. Here is a link to a review from New Zealand:-
http://www.scoop.co.nz/mason/stories/HL0202/S00036.htm

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/boldblue.gif)

[jonwatts]

FINALLY!!! A good reason to get back to working on my project (which is almost identical to fiid's).

Fiid, please keep us posted on your progress so that I can stay 1 step ahead of you (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

Brad, I don't want to hear about focus, I have been focusing, just on other things.

[Chris914n6]

I'm going to hope I catch all the points...

My flywheel assembly tipped the scale at 40lbs. This is partly because of the OE timing ring needed by the Nissan ECU. My 2200lb 914 still gets jerked about pretty well in lower gears. I recommend the standard weight flywheel.

A VW Golf radiator (93-97) 14"x24" core should work ok with Spal 11" fans and good ducting. I used a VW Corrado SLC radiator 12"x24" and the temps sit right where the ECU wants them, 1 of 2 fans on @ 115F.

Go big on your overflow bottle, all-aluminum engines @ 210F like to expand water.

Lose the power steering pump. The a/c can be used, plumb into factory optional system with a seperate heater core or you can wait til I get an all-in-one unit made (friend in the Hot Rod Business).

I recommend the factory ECU for easier setup and troubleshooting. http://www.link-electro-usa.com/ makes a good unit, most retailers have a pretty close program already loaded. http://www.sandstallion.com wanted iirc $1400 complete and good tech support/knowledge.

That's all for now.

Good luck with the project, it's worth the effort (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/MDB2.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mueba.gif)

Chris
914n6