Talk Me Into (Or Out Of) A -6GT, With SAE Engine Bolts! Options

[Nogoodwithusernames]

So I don't generally post much, but do browse the forum on the regular to keep up with things like Chris' builds and the Alien and whatnot, but I wanted to pick your collective brains for something I've been considering lately.

You may remember that I ended up with what could be a parts car/major project a while back. What you don't know yet is that whilst browsing FB marketplace I ended up with a relatively complete Corvair motor.

To preface:
Since moving a few years back most of my free time has been spent remodeling the new house that was poorly maintained prior to our purchase. However that is what we were able to afford and also get a larger house and yard. I am getting close to being done with the work as much as one can ever be "done" when owning a house... However I got the green light from my better half that once the master bathroom remodel is complete I can commence on my timber frame barn/shop space.
I acquired a large pile of treated German lumber from the absolutely enormous crates that a DMG Mori milling machine was delivered in. (Not mine (IMG:style_emoticons/default/drooley.gif) it is at an aerospace machine shop a good friend works at...) After much planning and measuring and counting of lumber, I can turn it into a small 16.5'x19' two level barn. Plenty big enough for me as I do also have a 2 car garage and am only on 1/3 of an acre.

Anyways, to get to the point of this long winded story I have been considering projects that I can work on in said shop space. The corvair motor and mostly complete but rough 914 has me contemplating a GT tribute.

I know the corvair power plant is old and antiquated, and many newer engines could be used with more power etc etc. but I'm wanting to stay air-cooled for dumb sentimental reasons and a Porsche -6 is out of budget by leagues and other vast units of measureme. I have a crazy hare-brained idea to do custom side plates (similar to https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/2153784.jpg and use maybe 102MM Deutz cylinders, with something like Yamaha XT600 four valve OHC air-cooled head.

Crazy I know. It is obviously much faster and easier to just put a Subaru in it, or build a big T4 or a Porsche 6. BUT I enjoy fabricating and machining things, have a lathe and mill and access to casting equipment and Fusion360 for CAD work.

Off the top of my head the biggest hurdle would be getting custom cams or somehow combining 6x single cylinder cams.

Anyone done anything remotely similar? Or know someone who has? Am I thinking TOO crazy? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif) Not crazy enough? (Maybe twin turbo? Add some cylinders and go for an H-8? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) )

I'm open for thoughts, discussion, criticism etc. Hit me with your best shot.

[worn]

My only suggestion is to plan your shed based upon what you want the shed to be not what materials you have. Use the free stuff to be sure, but keep them from driving the bus. Cause time flies, and you might be living with it a long time.
I guess the same goes for build. My 3.2 never misses a chance to make me laugh out loud. But, I bought the motor before I bought the car.

[mepstein]

Converting to a six is a bigger project than most people realize. Motor mounts, oiling system, engine tin, clutch, exhaust, gauges, wire harness mods, shift linkage, throttle linkage, etc. Most cars also need rust repair.
Now make it harder by using a non standard engine and conversion parts that all have to be designed and made for just one example.
If you just want a project, go for it. If you want to drive a 914, find someone who's unloading their project and buy it.

[infraredcalvin]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

And don’t forget this will be a labor of love, even ls1 conversions are starting to bring bigger $$$, but something as odd as a Convair engine in a 914 is going to limit any buying pool.

I know, we don't build these to sell them, but eventually someone will have to sell it…

[Cairo94507]

Mark is right; find a project where someone has done the initial heavy lifting and buy it for a great savings of time and money. They come up for sale regularly and it is, IMHO, the best move. As much as we all plan to never sell our cars, they all become available at some point. So trying to keep a build in "the groove" is a smart choice and will allow a sale that brings the best money with the least effort. Good luck on your garage build and your 914 project. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif) Michael

[BillC]

IIRC, the corvair motor spins in the opposite direction. So, you'd either need to find reverse-rotation cams for it or would have to adapt a 911 transmission (or flip the ring in your 914 trans).

Also, check the length of the motor. I vaguely recall the corvair motor might be slightly longer than a porsche 6.

[Nogoodwithusernames]

Good replies so far, I appreciate people putting their thoughts and experiences to paper. I'm only 30 right now so I've still got plenty to learn. I do want to put it out there that the '74 2.0 in my signature line is a good runner, so if I need to hop in a 914 and drive I do have one that is in fairly good shape already. Not pristine but a solid runner and looks good from 15 feet or so.

The potential recipient of Frankenstein engine would be a '70 1.7 that is pretty rough. It's got some sort of long reinforcement already, which I have a hunch was not a preventative measure (unless you consider it preventing the car from folding in half) and it's had at least one bump in the front as the frunk and fender gaps are all weird. If it turns out to be in better shape than it looks like, then I will revise plans and change course accordingly.


Nobody seems to have noticed or bit on the thoughts about cylinder head swap and trying to convert a Corvair to OHC instead of pushrod? AKA some ghetto Porsche engineering? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/poke.gif)


Perhaps some insight into why I am asking this; I have for a long time wanted to design and build a sports car or vintage race car from the ground up. (Yes, even designing a motor, and the suspension system, etc. No I will not be making my own brake pads or forging crankshafts and coil-over springs. Probably. I'm not THAT crazy.) A project like this seems in my mind to be somewhat of a stepping stone. I've rebuild a VW motor, next would be starting to modify motors and do some body work and chassis work etc.

[Shivers]

I rode in a turbo Corvair with a nut behind the wheel. Also rode in a big four 914, different nut behind the wheel. The 914 big four was an intense ride.The Corvair was smooth.

[KELTY360]

Sounds like you’re committed to the project for the project’s sake. You’ve got the car, the engine and soon to have shop space. Far be it from me to discourage that. But, I’d recommend making the project car structurally sound first. That will give you time to research and perspective to approach the engine conversion.

There was a guy on here a few years ago who was heavily into a Corvair engine conversion who posted extensively. Sadly he passed away and I don’t remember his user name. I’m sure a google search with 914World at the end will give you that info. Although, someone here may remember his name.

Good luck with the project(s). Enjoy, and keep us posted.

[Chris H.]

r3dplanet (Marcus).

[930cabman]

Converting to a six is a bigger project than most people realize. Motor mounts, oiling system, engine tin, clutch, exhaust, gauges, wire harness mods, shift linkage, throttle linkage, etc. Most cars also need rust repair.
Now make it harder by using a non standard engine and conversion parts that all have to be designed and made for just one example.
If you just want a project, go for it. If you want to drive a 914, find someone who's unloading their project and buy it.

OP: I have one in 14213 if you are interested, solid Palma Green example, new 2.7 with 40 IDTP Webers.

LMK

[Root_Werks]

Sounds like you have a solid project on your hands. As others have said, what you want to do depends on you. Do you want a project you can eventually drive with pride stating you built that or just buy and drive?

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[Ninja]

IIRC, the corvair motor spins in the opposite direction. So, you'd either need to find reverse-rotation cams for it or would have to adapt a 911 transmission (or flip the ring in your 914 trans).

Also, check the length of the motor. I vaguely recall the corvair motor might be slightly longer than a porsche 6.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Verify/solve THIS issue FIRST!!!!!

If the corvair motor spins opposite of the VW (I think it does) it's more than just flipping a ring gear as the transmission gears are helical.

Some race transmissions have straight cut gears and commonly can be spun backwards

They are always noisy, very noisy...

Many helical transmissions (street) have a straight cut reverse; that is why reverse is so noisy.

Changing the rotational direction on either engine or transmission is a daunting undertaking IMO. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ninja.gif)

[barefoot]

r3dplanet (Marcus).

YES, look up this extensive Corvair conversion. he solved the reverse rotation issue.

Good hunting !

[barefoot]

So
To preface:


I know the corvair power plant is old and antiquated, and many newer engines could be used with more power etc etc. but I'm wanting to stay air-cooled for dumb sentimental reasons and a Porsche -6 is out of budget by leagues and other vast units of measureme. I have a crazy hare-brained idea to do custom side plates (similar to https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/2153784.jpg and use maybe 102MM Deutz cylinders, with something like Yamaha XT600 four valve OHC air-cooled head.

Crazy I know. It is obviously much faster and easier to just put a Subaru in it, or build a big T4 or a Porsche 6. BUT I enjoy fabricating and machining things, have a lathe and mill and access to casting equipment and Fusion360 for CAD work.

Off the top of my head the biggest hurdle would be getting custom cams or somehow combining 6x single cylinder cams.

Anyone done anything remotely similar? Or know someone who has? Am I thinking TOO crazy? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/screwy.gif) Not crazy enough? (Maybe twin turbo? Add some cylinders and go for an H-8? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif) )

I'm open for thoughts, discussion, criticism etc. Hit me with your best shot.

Just use 6 XT 600 heads & find a way to link 3 cam's end to end, then find a way to chain drive the bank on either side. Oh and you'll deed to mate the heads to the cylinders. Easy-peasy (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

Barefoot

[gandalf_025]

Reverse rotation issue is simple. Reverse rotation cams have been around for decades
The mount to a VW based transmission is simple also.
Here is an adapter for sale on Marketplace for cheap.

Clarks Corvair Parts is a great resource for info..

[Lucky9146]

What Mark said in post 3.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/white914.jpg)