High Oil temperature, Concerned the temperature is getting to high too fast . Options

[Geezer914]

2056 motor, 9:1 cr., biral cylinders, Tangerine oil pressure relief valve, aux. oil cooler, 26mm oil pump. Oil pressure at start up (70 degrees) 78 psi. Oil pressure hot at 180 is 40 psi. at 3400 rpm. Oil temps hot runs 180 -190. Running Driven 15W50 oil

What flavor external oil cooler are you using?

My 2056 runs very close to 230F when cruising during the summer at 3300rpms. Oil pressure 50

Setrab 11x11 I think with a single fan. What oil pump are you using?

[emerygt350]

I agree with the 50 weight hypothesis. I would try a cheap 30 weight synthetic. Go to walmart or something. Don't bother with the filter or anything.

[brant]

Too early for synthetic

I would put 1000 miles on
Or at least 500 before switching to synthetic

[emerygt350]

Too early for synthetic

I would put 1000 miles on
Or at least 500 before switching to synthetic

Not to keep it in there for break in, just to watch the temps with an oil that is going to behave like a 'real' oil you might use.


I just couldn't bring myself to put a bottle of store brand cheap dino 30 in my car, even for trouble shooting.

[Ron914]

2056 motor, 9:1 cr., biral cylinders, Tangerine oil pressure relief valve, aux. oil cooler, 26mm oil pump. Oil pressure at start up (70 degrees) 78 psi. Oil pressure hot at 180 is 40 psi. at 3400 rpm. Oil temps hot runs 180 -190. Running Driven 15W50 oil

What flavor external oil cooler are you using?

My 2056 runs very close to 230F when cruising during the summer at 3300rpms. Oil pressure 50

Probably made a
a mistake but I am running the stock oil cooler ,checked and flushed out. I wish I had just bought a new one now.I need to find a dual sender so I can hook up the oil pressure gauge I purchased from a member here .

[Ron914]

2056 motor, 9:1 cr., biral cylinders, Tangerine oil pressure relief valve, aux. oil cooler, 26mm oil pump. Oil pressure at start up (70 degrees) 78 psi. Oil pressure hot at 180 is 40 psi. at 3400 rpm. Oil temps hot runs 180 -190. Running Driven 15W50 oil

What flavor external oil cooler are you using?

My 2056 runs very close to 230F when cruising during the summer at 3300rpms. Oil pressure 50

Setrab 11x11 I think with a single fan. What oil pump are you using?

I honestly don't know what oil pump was installed .I only know that when the lower half of the motor was assembled for me the guy doing it for me didn't like my old oil pump so he supplied a new one .

[Superhawk996]

I need to find a dual sender so I can hook up the oil pressure gauge I purchased from a member here .

Let it be noted that dual senders usually suck. The idiot light set pressure of the VDO dual sender is higher (7-10 psi) than the OEM idiot light sender set pressure (2-6 psi).

This results in more instances of the idiot light flickering at idle. This happened to me. I believe it is pretty well documented.

Better off with a remote mounted tee setup that retains the OEM idiot sensor and also uses a single pressure sender for oil pressure.

YMMV.

[Superhawk996]

Because the receipt says oil pump and cover we know it’s a Type 1 pump.

Size won’t be known without disassembly. 90+ percent chance it’s 26mm vs OEM type 4 pump at 24mm.

Probably not 30mm which would be really bad.

First thing I’d do is pull the oil temp sender (and gauge) and bench test it in boiling water. It’s probably coincidence but the temps you’re reporting (216F) with a 120 or 150c sender would put you very close on the gauge to what you’re showing in photos.

Since you need to drain the oil to get the sender out of the taco plate, I’d then try 10W-40 oil if the sender truly is a 200C sender and the sender and the gauge is reporting temperature of boiling water correctly vs the graphic I attached previously.

[Superhawk996]

I’m also going to write this for your benefit despite the people I’m gonna piss off. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)

216F isn’t even remotely close to too hot. Especially for an air cooled engine. Your modern daily driver will easily run 210-220 oil temp if heavily loaded, pulling up an extended grade (ie high load), or extended high speed (high aero load). During testing we wouldn’t even consider aborting at test until oil was well in excess of 250- 300F. Usually, a water pumper will overheat long before oil temperature cases a test to abort. For amusement . . . Go look on the Viper or Corvette forums and see what oil temps they run during a track day.

250F is absolutely zero concern for air cooled. Remember you have heads running at 350F and they are being cooled by oil - it should not be surprising that oil gets hot when washing over hot heads.

Yes, this necessitates reduced oil change intervals (3000 miles would be perfectly adequate) on air cooled engines. My air cooled motorcycles run this hot. We ran at these temperatures long before synthetics were a thing. Synthetics laugh at 250F.

There is a reason the oil temp redline is at 300F (back in the non-synthetic days) by engineers that actually design and test engines for a living vs what someone’s daddy or grand daddy taught them.

Tying to make an air cooled engines run at 180F oil temperature is counter productive.

There I said it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

[930cabman]

I’m also going to write this for your benefit despite the people I’m gonna piss off. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)

216F isn’t even remotely close to too hot. Especially for an air cooled engine. Your modern daily driver will easily replace run 210-220 oil temp if heavily loaded, pulling up an extended grade (ie high load), or extended high speed (high aero load). During testing we wouldn’t even consider aborting at test until oil was well in excess of 250- 300F. Usually, a water pumper will overheat long before oil temperature cases a test to abort.

250F is absolutely zero concern for air cooled. Remember you have heads running at 350F and they are being cooled by oil - it should not be surprising that oil gets hot when washing over hot heads.

Yes, this necessitates reduced oil change intervals (3000 miles would be perfectly adequate) on air cooled engines. My air cooled motorcycles run this hot. We ran at these temperatures long before synthetics were a thing. Synthetics laugh at 250F.

There is a reason the oil temp redline is at 300F (back in the non-synthetic days) by engineers that actually design and test engines for a living vs what someone’s daddy or grand daddy taught them.

Tying to make an air cooled engines run at 180F oil temperature is counter productive.

There I said it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

Not sure if I agree with 250F being 0 concern, myself I prefer to keep the oil under 230F, maybe just cheap insurance

200 - 220 is optimal for me

[73-914]

I’m also going to write this for your benefit despite the people I’m gonna piss off. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)

216F isn’t even remotely close to too hot. Especially for an air cooled engine. Your modern daily driver will easily run 210-220 oil temp if heavily loaded, pulling up an extended grade (ie high load), or extended high speed (high aero load). During testing we wouldn’t even consider aborting at test until oil was well in excess of 250- 300F. Usually, a water pumper will overheat long before oil temperature cases a test to abort. For amusement . . . Go look on the Viper or Corvette forums and see what oil temps they run during a track day.

250F is absolutely zero concern for air cooled. Remember you have heads running at 350F and they are being cooled by oil - it should not be surprising that oil gets hot when washing over hot heads.

Yes, this necessitates reduced oil change intervals (3000 miles would be perfectly adequate) on air cooled engines. My air cooled motorcycles run this hot. We ran at these temperatures long before synthetics were a thing. Synthetics laugh at 250F.

There is a reason the oil temp redline is at 300F (back in the non-synthetic days) by engineers that actually design and test engines for a living vs what someone’s daddy or grand daddy taught them.

Tying to make an air cooled engines run at 180F oil temperature is counter productive.

There I said it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) needs to be above 212 F (100 C) to evaporate condensation (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)

[Ninja]

I’m also going to write this for your benefit despite the people I’m gonna piss off. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)

216F isn’t even remotely close to too hot. Especially for an air cooled engine. Your modern daily driver will easily run 210-220 oil temp if heavily loaded, pulling up an extended grade (ie high load), or extended high speed (high aero load). During testing we wouldn’t even consider aborting at test until oil was well in excess of 250- 300F. Usually, a water pumper will overheat long before oil temperature cases a test to abort. For amusement . . . Go look on the Viper or Corvette forums and see what oil temps they run during a track day.

250F is absolutely zero concern for air cooled. Remember you have heads running at 350F and they are being cooled by oil - it should not be surprising that oil gets hot when washing over hot heads.

Yes, this necessitates reduced oil change intervals (3000 miles would be perfectly adequate) on air cooled engines. My air cooled motorcycles run this hot. We ran at these temperatures long before synthetics were a thing. Synthetics laugh at 250F.

There is a reason the oil temp redline is at 300F (back in the non-synthetic days) by engineers that actually design and test engines for a living vs what someone’s daddy or grand daddy taught them.

Tying to make an air cooled engines run at 180F oil temperature is counter productive.

There I said it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Ninja rule: Always test your test equipment! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ninja.gif)

The greatest variance I've ever seen was with temperature sensing devices.

From my viewpoint the ONLY equipment I trust for temperature measurements has liquid mercury in it!

The electric stuff I don't trust at all...

[Ninja]

Sorry, forum's been glitchy for me recently...

[emerygt350]

Getting the oil over 210, as mentioned is important to get rid of water. High quality synthetic oils can take the high temps. I would definitely check out that sender as mentioned above. My concern would be the speed at which your oil is heating and that is why I suspect the overpressure issue. Which is nothing to be upset about, just reduce the viscosity if that appears to be the issue. I put a T on my mustang so I can keep the stupid dashboard gauge and have another aftermarket manual gauge.

[Ron914]

Sorry, forum's been glitchy for me recently...

@Ninja

Granbury TX ,Spacing between sentences , Is this the technicalnija . I didn't notice the connection at first . If so welcome back .

[Ron914]

I made a couple of more temperature readings when I got home from my smog test today . I used the factory gauge , IR thermometer and a turkey deep fry thermometer as a replacement for my dip stick .

My CHT gauge is stuck in Celsius so 88=190.4F
I don't trust my IR thermometer which was a measurement of the bottom of the motor near the oil drain plug
And of course the factory gauge with a 200 C sending unit which shows ~ 245 F

There's a bit of confusion here for me so I will probably purchase a new sender unit and look for a new gauge .I changed the battery in the IR but that made no difference in the bad readings . I actually trust the turkey fryer thermometer





None of this makes any difference until I can geta passed smog test and actually start driving my car .
Thoughts of abandoning this project are floating about in my head but Ive put so much time, money and sweat into it I hate to give up now after 4 years .

[Superhawk996]

Thoughts of abandoning this project are floating about in my head but Ive put so much time, money and sweat into it I hate to give up now after 4 years .

We all have those days. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grouphug.gif) Take a break from it and think about what’s best for you’d but don’t decide in the heat of the battle.

I don’t know CA other than the smog laws don’t make it easy for anything newer than 75 as I understand it. So you’ve got a bit of uphill battle but probably not insurmountable. Today you are dealing with a typical bureaucratic (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif) and maybe a lazy moron to boot.

On the temp sender - test don’t replace. Could be the gauge. Could be the sender. Could be wiring. Could be perfectly OK. Replacing blindly only adds cost and frustration. It’s very simple to test by getting the car prepped, and simply bringing a pot of boiling water to the car within a couple minutes of removing the pot from the stove.

IR temp measurement of aluminum is terribly inaccurate unless the emissivity is set properly. Emissivity of aluminum is all over the map based on surface finish (shiny, oxidized, rough vs smooth) so I’m not terribly surprised by that reading lower.

Your dipstick and the turkey thermometer aren’t terribly far off (maybe 30 degrees or so). Of the three measurements, I believe the thermometer the most at the moment.

One last thought to leave you with. For all this talk about oil temperature- keep in mind VW / Porsche saw fit to ship many of these cars without a temperature gauges at all. Let that sink in. Lots of hay gets made about it on this forum. Unless you’re driving a pickup truck truck with a tow package I’ll wager you have no idea what the oil temperature measurement is in your daily driver. Again, let that sink in. Not saying ignore it but don’t be freaked out / stressed out about it ether.

Here to help and support if you choose to keep going forward.

[JamesM]

Tying to make an air cooled engines run at 180F oil temperature is counter productive.

Not to mention the oil should be hotter than that anyways.

nothing wrong with 216 at all.