Ron's 914, High oil temp Options

[Ron914]

Hello all,
It's been about 4 months since I passed my smog test and thought I would be on the way to finally be able to drive my 4 year project .

Well I have been enjoying driving it but only for short trips around town because I feel it has a high oil temperature problem . This is after a short drive around town of 30 minutes . A 45 minute drive will bring the needle on the gauge right to the red zone ,which looking at Phil's calibration photo would indicate about 250F , I don't continue to drive once I get to 250F and pull over and let its cool .



Not exactly sure why or if it really is high ( I don't want to damage my new motor ) but I was given a few things to check by the members hers @Superhawk996 , @emerygt350 .

First I checked my oil Temperature sensor to verify type and operation.

It is a VDO 200 C sensor .


I have the later oil gauge . I removed the sensor and placed it in 212F boiling water and it seems within the correct range on the console gauge .

I am using a Efeng turkey fryer thermometer to check against the gauge in console . The thermometer is accurate . The gauge ( apex seems close to the same reading



There was a discussion the other day on this subject with the question of whether missing a cooling tin on bottom of engine could cause the overheating problem @930cabman .

I have the same issue as I have the tin that the shift rod passes through removed because it the shit rod comes into contact with the tin installed and it shifts better with it removed .

Wondering if I should work on getting it reinstalled to help my cooling ?


I have also worked on the cooling flaps /thermostat but will start a new post for those questions .

I saw a comment about the type of oil . It sounds like Synthetic oil might be a better choice for air cooled oil .

I currently have no oil in my motor and was wondering if Mobil Syn oil would be better than putting back in the Valvoline VR1 20-50W ?

[930cabman]

My 2056 build is going on 4 years, basically stock with the addition of an Elgin cam, twin Webers, new bearings, valves, ..... 20W 50 Castrol. I did not install the thermostat because I didn't have a good one and figured I would try without. Well I am pleased with the results, she heats up very quickly with the flats wide open. Yes, I may get some pushback here, just my experience.

Flaps closed? Well fitting tin? spark timing? excessive friction (fishing here)?

[burton73]

Ron, Happy that you completed your smog. I just got this oil for my 6 and by Bud, Alan Sobin got the same for his 6. We are changing our cars this week

HIGH ZINK FORMULA conventional oil not synthetic. I have been told that this is the stuff. If you have a different word on Synthetic versus conventional, please tell. I have heard of people getting leaks from synthetic oil.

Best Bob B

[Ron914]

@930cabman I too have a new 2056 motor and have been wondering if the overheating is because I have not yet tried to tune my MPS after rebuilding it with a CFR diaphragm kit ( you might have seen my post on that job last year, fought getting it too hold good vacuum without any leak down).

I never intended to own this car so I am now dealing with not being more involved when the motor was rebuilt thus I have no information on what parts were installed other than the lighter rods ,96mm piston kit and a new balanced flywheel / Sachs clutch , I hope this doesn't haunt me .

I intend to reinstall that missing piece of tin once I figure out why the shift rod is hitting it .
Here is a mystery piece of tin that came in a box of parts that came with my car . Not even sure if it belongs on a 76 914 2.0L.

[Ron914]

Ron, Happy that you completed your smog. I just got this oil for my 6 and by Bud, Alan Sobin got the same for his 6. We are changing our cars this week

HIGH ZINK FORMULA conventional oil not synthetic. I have been told that this is the stuff. If you have a different word on Synthetic versus conventional, please tell. I have heard of people getting leaks from synthetic oil.

Best Bob B

Hi Bob,
When I first filled the new motor with oil I used Castol , used to get it at Wallmart for a good price then it became unavailable and they started stocking this oil . Im currently using Vavoline .

My comment on using synthetic oil was prompted by a comment that it handles high oil temps better than Dino oil . I've done 3 oil changes in less than 700 miles since the rebuild .

Currently I have not put oil back in after pulling the oil temp sending sensor to test it . Just considering the opinions here on Synthetic . I guess I'm just looking for a little insurance as I negotiate this oil temperature problem .
I want to do Oscar's drive in May but not sure if 250 + miles is a good idea yet .

[Superhawk996]

Here is a mystery piece of tin that came in a box of parts that came with my car . Not even sure if it belongs on a 76 914 2.0L.

That piece of tin in concerning. Not easy to install with motor in the car.

Wondering is it “extra” or was it left out by an incompetent rebuilder? Tin isn’t optional. Hmm. Can you get photo under car? This is drivers side front of cylinder tin.

[Superhawk996]

Regarding the calibration of your gage. That doesn’t look right.


212F should be more or less straight up around 12 o’ clock position and not so close to the red zone.



When you calibrated . . . Does that blue tape represent your measured temperature points? Did you calibrate it in car with all wiring included or was it all done in the house? Just curious because those marks on the blue tape would put you into the red not much higher than 215F. Basically your blue tape 215F mark is looking more like what should be 250F or maybe a smidge higher.

Seems like you have the right sender and they don’t usually drift calibration but ??

Is all your engine seals to the tin in place.

When you run for the 45 minutes are you getting to that 250F mark using the dipstick thermometer?

[Ron914]

Regarding the calibration of your gage. That doesn’t look right.


212F should be more or less straight up around 12 o’ clock position and not so close to the red zone.



When you calibrated . . . Does that blue tape represent your measured temperature points? Did you calibrate it in car with all wiring included or was it all done in the house? Just curious because those marks on the blue tape would put you into the red not much higher than 215F. Basically your blue tape 215F mark is looking more like what should be 250F or maybe a smidge higher.

Seems like you have the right sender and they don’t usually drift calibration but ??

Is all your engine seals to the tin in place.

When you run for the 45 minutes are you getting to that 250F mark using the dipstick thermometer?

The blue tape is marked wrong the mark should say 225 which corresponds with the position of the gauge . I purchased all new rubber for the engine and some grommets but I see some light coming through the seal around the side of the engine , the seal appears to be pulling away from the DS of engine compartment opening not sure why .

I calibrated the sender in boiling water at the car with ignition turned on and it was close to the blue tape mark around 210 .

When the car gauge hit the bottom of red zone I used the analog thermometer to check 250F .
Based on your post yesterday it sounds like I do not want to exceed 250F or run continuously at that temp.
The hole for the CHT sensor is not , I am missing the shift rod tin ( might be hitting because the rod is bent?) and that left front piece which might be a duplicate but I will need to push car out to check .
Will get back to you on that one .
I have another question , Could it be running hot because I haven't tuned the MPS yet and it is running lean ? I will create another post for that with photos of my plugs .

[Ishley]

At some point you might want to look into an Air fuel ratio gauge and setup with an O2 sensor bung welded into you exhaust. They make an O2 setup that runs off blue tooth... and talks to your phone....although I don't know how reliable it is. No one would know you have it.... if you want that stock look. I have a wired one in my car... and it really helps to get the tuning dialed in when you start tweaking the MPS. Also... timing can be another issue. I also run a 123+ distributor. On the hottest days here in the Midwest I see about 215.

Modern tools can really help. Something as simple as adding a couple of pounds of fuel pressure can add a touch more fuel and lower your temps. I found reading spark plugs hit and miss... as you could be lean and hot at cruise and by the time you got back to the garage things look good. The AFR takes some getting used to as it swings around lean to rich... but the goal is to get mix right when your engine is under load.

I've dialed mine a little more rich... you sacrifice some fuel MPG... but it keeps the temps down.

[Montreal914]

Separate topic, but do you have a head temperature gauge?
Reason I am asking is that lean will get the heads run hotter. I assume your timing is set properly as it can impact both head and oil temp.

2056 requires the MPS to be tuned to work with the DJet. Your cam is an unknown from what you are saying. That is a concern as DJet will only tolerate very mild “performance upgrade”. Also, you will need a wide band O2 A/F ratio gauge to set it (MPS).

2056 can heat up the heads and the oil. Not saying you need an oil cooler, but many 2056 engines on the road have an external oil cooler.

Correct reading from your instruments
Correct tuning (timing, MPS, vacuum leaks, etc…)
Complete cooling system (that potential missing duct)
Doubt that shift rod guide will do a difference

Then you can see if you indeed have an oil temperature issue.

[Superhawk996]

Based on your post yesterday it sounds like I do not want to exceed 250F or run continuously at that temp.

Yeah running 250F after just 45 minutes of normal driving is too hot.

If you’re running 85mph extended time in 95F-100F ambient it wouldn’t be concerning but I don’t think your driving like that or driving any serious mountain grades.

Based on you saying your gauge is at 225 position as shown in that photo of the gauge and you saying that you’re at 250F (dipstick) and touching the red zone it does seem like your oil temp gauge is indicating about 25-50F too hot. Weird. Those temp sensors are pretty bullet proof and I’m a little surprised by a 50F offset.

Next time I get a chance I’ll dig a couple of mine out of storage rate and we can compare resistance of them at 212F.

Defiantly need to figure out what’s elevating temps.

MPS & mixture are a possibility but it’s unlikely to be elevating that much.

More likely candidates;

Flaps not open fully

Oil cooler going into bypass due to:
30 mm pump (do you know what size pump or what pump is in the car?)
30mm pump+ running 20w-50 will almost certainly be bypassing the oil cooler.

Missing cylinder tin (mystery tin / spare?)

Since you passed smog - I’m sort of discounting some massive issue with lean fuel mix. I recall you had a Dakota Digital cHT gauge but it too wasnt reading correctly? Did that ever get resolved?

[mgphoto]

I’ve had temps get really crazy hot trying a high advance with distributor vacuum. Took only minutes for oil temps to get out of hand.

[infraredcalvin]

I have one of these, but have never used it so, if you get one YMMV.

https://www.jegs.com/i/Innovate-Motorsports...PkaAoYtEALw_wcB

I’m with the others, you're running too lean/too much advance…. As for oil, ugh, plenty of opinions on that, bottom line, synthetic has good properties for heat, but it’ll find places to leak. Dino is best, many have ‘enough’ zinc even thigh they don't advertise it, but you can look it up, anything labeled high zinc will be more than the recommended needs.