The 3.2 Conversion Thread, got to git 'er done Options

[kdfoust]

Hey thanks Steve. I do want to look at your car. You could swing by Saturday if you want to spectate or help. Otherwise I was planning to give you call and set something up so I could do a look-see at your car.

Later,
Kevin

[John]

Kevin,

It's looking good. You are way ahead of me. I have a few other projects going on right now like reassembling old engines to get them out of the way....

I will be fabricating my engine mount soon, and I have not yet fabricated my sheet metal, but will be doing that shortly as well.

What oil tank are you planning on using? Are you mounting a front mounted cooler?

[kdfoust]

QUOTE (JOHNMAN @ Oct 6 2005, 07:42 PM)

Kevin, It's looking good.  You are way ahead of me.  I have a few other projects going on right now like reassembling old engines to get them out of the way.... I will be fabricating my engine mount soon, and I have not yet fabricated my sheet metal, but will be doing that shortly as well. What oil tank are you planning on using?  Are you mounting a front mounted cooler?

Hey John:

It's good see a few 14s survived in MO. I lived in Columbia for 13 years and saw very few. A co-worker had a very nice '73 2.0.

I'm undecided on the oil tank at this point. I am leaning towards a front-trunk mounted high capacity system since in the long view (3-5 years) this car will become more track than street. My thinking is that the front mount tank helps balance the car a little bit and once done makes a simple oil cooler installation. At 12-16 quarts it also would reduce the workload on the oil and to me that means the engine would run a little cooler.

BUT

I like the clean setup of the OE location and it doesn't take any space away like the front tank would. With the OE location I'd probably try to develop an effective oil cooler location in the rear of the car (NOT over the tranny though). As far as the actual tank I don't have any interest in paying for a OE -6 tank so one of the aluminum ones would be my choice.

In this region most of the tracks are located in miserably hot places so oil cooling will be paramount.

I've got a little time ( a week or two) to sort it out since I plan to hook up the fuel system after the mechanical install is completed. I'm definitely taking input on the whole oil system setup. How bout you? What's your oil tank setup going to be?

The -6 repro sheet metal leaves a lot to be desired IMHO. I just fitted it this evening after making a few simple mods to get it on the engine. The mods consisted of adding a few holes for sensor wiring to pass through. I was going around and checking all the fasteners and actually asked myself what purpose it will serve in this installation. I suppose it provides a seal between the fan side and the bottom side of the engine helping the air to flow through the right places. It does look pretty rinky-dink to me. Especially when you contrast it with one of Stutgart's finest engines...

Here's a digipic of the sheet metal installed along with the tranny just stuck on. I wanted to make sure that there weren't any surprises between the sheet metal and tranny.

Later,
Kevin

[John]

I am still undecided on the oil tank. I am leaning toward an aluminum repro tank. The track car (also a 3.2) has a front mounted Patterson Enterprises 4-gal round tank.

I want to mount a front cooler, but don't want to take much front trunk space as I want it to remain a street car, and I sometimes use the front trunk.

I compared pricing of an aftermarket aluminum tank to a round racing tank and it seems to be a tossup. When you add a racing filter setup to the round tank, the price is nearly what I could get an aluminum tank repro tank with filler neck and dipstick.

Good luck.

Perhaps I should take pics of where my project is at.......

[Steve]

QUOTE (kdfoust @ Oct 6 2005, 04:40 PM)

Hey thanks Steve. I do want to look at your car. You could swing by Saturday if you want to spectate or help. Otherwise I was planning to give you call and set something up so I could do a look-see at your car. Later, Kevin

I have my daughters socker game at 11am on Saturday.
I could swing by in the afternoon and see how you guys are doing.

[736conver]

Kevin,

It looks like you still need to remove the exhaust. Are you doing that this weekend. Give those nuts a little soaking. Also if you dont have a oxy/act torch I would rent one. The last thing you want is a broken stud because the nut would come off. I heated mine up with a torch and they came off with little hassle. One started to twist but I just heated it up more and the nut came loose. Map or propane gas wont get hot enough.

Another thing did you get a acclerator cable from PMS or are you doing your own. Maybe Steve can also elaborate on what he has for accel cable. I tried using a 4 cable but its hanging up. I thinking of making it a little shorter and get another throttle return spring.

[kdfoust]

I'm planning to remove the exhaust once the engine is hanging in the car. It looks like everything will be in the clear. Oh wait, is the CAT going to be in the way of a trailing arm? If so, it's time for the sawzall to come out. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/sawzall-smiley.gif)

I didn't want to put the engine on my engine stand at all. Unless we break something I'm not even pulling the spark plugs (knock on wood!). I was wondering about those bloody head stud nuts. If MAP isn't hot enough I'm gonna have to get my hands on a real torch I guess. I was thinking about getting one of the "plumber "mini oxy-acetylene setups anyway. I guess it's time.

I haven't sourced the throttle cable yet. Jim @ PMS mentioned it the last time we talked. I'll probably just buy his unless there's a better option out there. I can't wait to have a good look at Steve's car. I've seen it before but I've never looked at in detail. If Steve doesn't mind I'll probably take a bunch of digipix of his car that we can share.

I've got a short list for today to get ready for tomorrow:
1) Shorter engine mount bolts for engine side.
2) Open up engine mount hole that's in wrong place.
3) Read the Bentley on the flywheel/clutch setup.
4) Find the nuts and bolts for the starter and tranny.
5) Buy medicine for the crew (Guinness, Pacifico, Sam Adams)
6) Buy ICE.

Later,
Kevin

[Steve]

QUOTE (kdfoust @ Oct 7 2005, 06:57 AM)

I'm planning to remove the exhaust once the engine is hanging in the car.  It looks like everything will be in the clear.  Oh wait, is the CAT going to be in the way of a trailing arm?  If so, it's time for the sawzall to come out.  :sawzall: I didn't want to put the engine on my engine stand at all.  Unless we break something I'm not even pulling the spark plugs (knock on wood!).  I was wondering about those bloody head stud nuts.  If MAP isn't hot enough I'm gonna have to get my hands on a real torch I guess.  I was thinking about getting one of the "plumber "mini oxy-acetylene setups anyway.  I guess it's time. I haven't sourced the throttle cable yet.  Jim @ PMS mentioned it the last time we talked.  I'll probably just buy his unless there's a better option out there.  I can't wait to have a good look at Steve's car.  I've seen it before but I've never looked at in detail.  If Steve doesn't mind I'll probably take a bunch of digipix of his car that we can share. I've got a short list for today to get ready for tomorrow: 1)  Shorter engine mount bolts for engine side. 2)  Open up engine mount hole that's in wrong place. 3)  Read the Bentley on the flywheel/clutch setup. 4)  Find the nuts and bolts for the starter and tranny. 5)  Buy medicine for the crew (Guinness, Pacifico, Sam Adams) 6)  Buy ICE. Later, Kevin

Take all the pictures you want.
What time are you guys getting started tomorrow morning?
I could always swing by before socker practice.
Regarding the flywheel.
My KEP instructions said to shave the stock flywheel down to get rid of the groove.
I did this on mine and then just bolted the KEP ring, disk and pressure plate to the stock flywheel.
It was as simple as that.
It also said to take out the washer behind the throw out bearing ball pivot.
You also have to use there special throw out bearing.

[kdfoust]

QUOTE (Steve @ Oct 7 2005, 08:05 AM)

QUOTE (kdfoust @ Oct 7 2005, 06:57 AM) I'm planning to remove the exhaust once the engine is hanging in the car.  It looks like everything will be in the clear.  Oh wait, is the CAT going to be in the way of a trailing arm?  If so, it's time for the sawzall to come out.  :sawzall: I didn't want to put the engine on my engine stand at all.  Unless we break something I'm not even pulling the spark plugs (knock on wood!).  I was wondering about those bloody head stud nuts.  If MAP isn't hot enough I'm gonna have to get my hands on a real torch I guess.  I was thinking about getting one of the "plumber "mini oxy-acetylene setups anyway.  I guess it's time. I haven't sourced the throttle cable yet.  Jim @ PMS mentioned it the last time we talked.  I'll probably just buy his unless there's a better option out there.  I can't wait to have a good look at Steve's car.  I've seen it before but I've never looked at in detail.  If Steve doesn't mind I'll probably take a bunch of digipix of his car that we can share. I've got a short list for today to get ready for tomorrow: 1)  Shorter engine mount bolts for engine side. 2)  Open up engine mount hole that's in wrong place. 3)  Read the Bentley on the flywheel/clutch setup. 4)  Find the nuts and bolts for the starter and tranny. 5)  Buy medicine for the crew (Guinness, Pacifico, Sam Adams) 6)  Buy ICE. Later, Kevin Take all the pictures you want. What time are you guys getting started tomorrow morning? I could always swing by before socker practice. Regarding the flywheel. My KEP instructions said to shave the stock flywheel down to get rid of the groove. I did this on mine and then just bolted the KEP ring, disk and pressure plate to the stock flywheel. It was as simple as that. It also said to take out the washer behind the throw out bearing ball pivot. You also have to use there special throw out bearing.

What groove?

I better check the directions from KEP....

[JoeSharp]

Gosh, 2 engine parties tomorrow and I'm going to the races. DAMN!!!!
:PERMAGRIN: Joe

[Aaron Cox]

QUOTE (Joe Sharp @ Oct 7 2005, 10:35 AM)

Gosh, 2 engine parties tomorrow and I'm going to the races. DAMN!!!! :PERMAGRIN: Joe

which races joe?

[JoeSharp]

Thomas keeps telling me that there is an RR PCA A/X in San Berdo. we're loading the car tonight.
:PERMAGRIN: Joe
P.S. Sorry about the High Jack Kevin, I'll be watching this thread close.

[J P Stein]

A couple pics of oil cooler/usable front trunk.

[J P Stein]

And with the lid....which I no longer have use for, BTW.
It sits on the same shelf that the original sat on

[Steve]

[QUOTE=kdfoust,Oct 7 2005, 08:30 AM] My KEP instructions said to shave the stock flywheel down to get rid of the groove.
I did this on mine and then just bolted the KEP ring, disk and pressure plate to the stock flywheel.
It was as simple as that.
It also said to take out the washer behind the throw out bearing ball pivot.
You also have to use there special throw out bearing. [/QUOTE]
What groove?

I better check the directions from KEP.... [/QUOTE]
There's a circular groove in the flywheel.
The instructions said to shave the flywheel down and remove it.
I'm curious if other people shaved there flywheel.
I would check with GPR and PMS.
I still have clutch problems with my car.
The motor prior to the 3.2 was a 2.7 six motor with a stock 2.0 six flywheel.
It worked great and I was using a weltmeister clutch cable.
When I put in the 3.2 and KEP conversion I had problems with the cable stretching.
I switched over to a factory 914-6 clutch cable and the stretching problem went away.
The clutch tube has been welded and reinforced, so I don't think that is the problem.
Right now I have to push the clutch pedal all the way to the floor or it will grind when I go into reverse.
I put the motor in 4 years ago and I have not had the time to pull the tranny out to try to figure out whats wrong.
PMS and GPR said they have never ran into this problem.
I'm running the stage 2 from KEP.
PMS and GPR both recommend the stage 2 and have had no problems.

Regarding the throttle cable I am running a kit from Ottos that comes with a bell crank that mounts to the tranny and mimics the 914-6.
It also came with a 914-6 throttle cable.
It also uses the factory hard wire that goes from the motor to the bell crank.
I think the kit came with the hard wire.
My motor already had one on it.
I think PMS and GPR sell the same kit.
Probably Pelican to.
The factory 914-6 way works much better than jury rigging the 914-4 clutch cable.
The 914-6 way is much smoother.
The 914-4 cable seems to bind because of all the bends and is harder to push.

[kdfoust]

It was a bit of a panic this afternoon. If something on the flywheel was going to need machining I needed to get on it right away, cause the crew is gonna be here... So I pulled the stock pressure plate and clutch apart this evening, cleaned everything up and assembled the new KEP Stage 2 clutch, conversion pressure plate, and ring gear. Everything was a bolt up operation. It seems like it will work...

I talked to Jim Patrick this afternoon about the conversion clutch package. He said no machining was needed for 3.2 flywheels prior to the G50 tranny years. The only thing he said was that some different bolt lengths were required (easily solved - even though they were supposed to be in the kit). Steve, do you have a late 3.2? Maybe that's why you needed to do some machining.

Here's a digipic of the stock flywheel. I highlighted the only thing I could think of that could be considered a groove. This digipic is with the conversion ring gear also installed.

Later,
Kevin

[Steve]

Yep that's the groove.
Per the instructions I shaved the flywheel to get rid of the ring.
My motor is a 1984, so its the 915 trans version.
1987 was the first year of the G50.
I wonder if shaving the flywheel is causing my problem with the clutch.
Patrick has done tons of conversions so I would take his word for it.

[736conver]

Updates.
Is it running yet. You guys have had at least a couple of hours.
Whats the hold up (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)
(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/thisthreadisworthlesswithoutpics.gif)

[brp914]

while waiting for everyone to show up, someone turned on the game, and while discussing how to proceed, they broke out the beer, then they got hungry so they ordered a pizza, and then fell asleep. forthcoming will be "a thread about nothing".

ok, just kidding, hope all went well. bring on the pics!

[kdfoust]

We did in fact break out the beer and pizza but not until some of the heavy lifting was done. First thing this morning I couldn't get the CAT off. We had Robert (the official team blacksmithe) cut the HE pipes so the CAT could be removed using his handy dandy portable band saw. You guys better put one of those band saws on your Christmas list cause it's like a really smooth sawzall.