Realistic Streetable 914-6 Target Weight Options

[Rufus]

Gents- I didn't want to hijack the other current thread on weight reduction, so I started anew....

I'm just as sick as (maybe sicker than) all you "sicko's" here:

I'm having my 1970 914-6 remade into a 'hotrod' by the same gent that did the car in the recent Excellence issue (it's been there waiting patiently for quite a while). The 914 has huge all-out performance potential while still providing decent driver protection if done right. I've had this project in mind for 20+ years since my CRXSi was passed by a 914-6 like it was standing still.

I've done a lot of 'weight reduction' research on this forum, but haven't found the direct answer I seek. (There's so much detailed discussion of this topic that maybe I've just missed the right thread.)

I plan to drive my car on the street; no track, maybe / maybe no AX. In order to remain street legal, I plan to retain lights, turnsignals, horn, windshield, and maybe wipers (at least for initial inspection.....then will remove; I don't plan to drive at all in the rain/wet.)

Is my target weight of 1800 lbs reasonable with a cage, windhield and roof (maybe composite)?

I'm planning the removal of all sound deadening, the use of plexiglass everywhere except the windshield, fiberglass body / carbon fiber body parts, PCCB brakes, lightweight racing seats, only minimal carpet / door panels.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the VarioRam added significant weight compared to a 2.0 - 3.0l engine, so let's ignore that factor for the moment.....

How close will this come? Feel free to PM me with known car weight's and what was done to acheive it.

I'm sorry for being so long winded. Thanks in advance for any help.

[iamchappy]

I am solving the weight problem with my 914 by throwing 400hp at it. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

[brant]

So.... this is only my opinion and could certainly be wrong.

but if you retain a dash.
a stock floorpan
a 3.6/6
and even go as far as carbon brakes and body panels...
I'm guessing 1900 as a street car

I'm at 1850 and you will be pressed to have working door handles at that weight... you won't have hinged trunks or engine bay at 1850....
I'm going to guess 1900 though
read my thread for details.

I actually think most -6 streetable cars are over 2,000
but I'm desperately waiting for grant and others to give me more data points on that.

On 2nd thought..... I'm modifying my guess to 1950
it takes enormous dedication to hit 1900.
and I saw that your sig now shows a 3.8
your going to have to have some tremendous cooling on that thing.
I'm ammending my guess to 1950 because its a street car.

brant

This post has been edited by brant: Apr 9 2006, 10:11 PM

[Qarl]

1900-2000 lbs depending on bumpers (fiberglass or steel), hoods (fiberglass or steel). removing firewall pads, floort tar, etc.

There is a lot of things can do to reduce weight and keep the car streetable..

Your passenger doesn't need a floorpan, right?

Windshield? Wear a helmet.

Who needs rear brakes? Just get two good front ones.

Seriously though. 1950 would be a nice weight.

Which conincidentally is the same as my Elise.

[Joseph Mills]

QUOTE (brant @ Apr 9 2006, 10:08 PM)

but if you retain a dash. a stock floorpan a 3.6/6 and even go as far as carbon brakes and body panels... I'm guessing 1900 as a street car

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif)

I think Brant's estimate is reasonable, although the cost may not be. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif)

Both in dollars and comfort.

But other than Quarl's car, URY914, and a few others, you will be bud lite.



Here are a list of weights I found somewhere. May not be totally accurate, but weight wise, it really puts the teener into perspective.

Lotus Elise 1975 lbs

My own 914 2015 lbs

Mazda MX-5 2498 lbs
Mini Cooper S 2679 lbs
Acura RSX S 2769 lbs
Honda S2000 2835 lbs
Porsche Boxster 2855 lbs
Dodge SRT-4 2900 lbs
Saturn Ion Redline 2933 lbs
Chevy Cobalt SS 2991 lbs

Mazda RX-8 3029 lbs
BMW Z4 3042 lbs
Chevy C6 Corvette 3179 lbs
Merc SLK 3231 lbs
Mitsubishi EVO 3263 lbs
Subaru WRX STI 3298 lbs
VW R32 3409 lbs
BMW M3 3415 lbs
Mustang GT 3425 lbs
Nissan 350Z 3445 lbs
Audi TT Quattro 3.2 3683 lbs
Pontiac GTO 3725 lbs
Volvo V70R 3757 lbs
Audi S4 3825 lbs
Cadilac CTS V 3850 lbs

..

[Porsche Rescue]

I have to ask: Why, with a big six of near 300 HP and the intent of street use only, does 50, 100 or even 300 lbs. matter? A 3.8 in a factory curb weight 914 will go fast enough to scare the hell out of anybody.

[Mugs914]

Just as a guide, my '73 with a CIS 3.0 SC engine and half a tank of gas, jack, spare, and at least a magazine or two weighs 2125 lbs., give or take a pound or so. Weight reduction is limited to fibreglass bumpers and removal of the firewall insulation pad. It has all of the original stuff in it still, plus the big oil cooler, tank, lines etc.

Like I said, just for reference....

[turboman808]

You can get a race hood and remove the headlights. Not sure how much they weight but I am sure they got to be at least 30. Fiberglass hoods and bumpers. Might try a light weight top also. Fiberglass doors. Not radio or heat controls. Light weight wheels(SSR). Cut out the rear trunk. For a weekend car on nice days you don't need it.

Not sure why you want to do all this if you aren't gonna race it but to each his own. Plexi windows might be pushing it though. Had them in a 323 rally car I wouldn't want them in a street car.

[brant]

Re-read my post..
my amended comment wasn't meant to sound negative.

The reason I amended it was that it sounds like your going with big brakes (pccb). which necessitates big 17inch wheels (or 18's). Which necessitates big fat tires that are HEAVY. Which necessitates a wide body. Which necessitates coil overs and heavy suspension...

see where I'm going with this.

we run as light of a running gear as we can reasonably...
for example NON-vented rear rotors are lighter than vented

brant

[J P Stein]

Look at it another way.
A stock 914 is around 2150.
Add 3.6 & 915 WAG =200 lbs.
It would be a good idea to do some chassis strenghing with the big motor & tires, IMO......more weight.

so, WAG, 2350 is your starting point.
350lbs reduction in non essential gear is gonna be a bitch
and that only gets ya to 2000.

[Bleyseng]

With 250+hp in a 914 its plain scary fast so who cares if its 2150 or 2350lbs as it doesn't matter. Lexan windows in a street car?

Have you driven a 914 with 250hp yet? Once you do you will see 200 lbs is peanuts....but you'll want the bigger brakes, tires, cage etc for safety cuz you won't be able to keep your foot outta it.

I watched DavidHunt drive crazy this weekend with his weenie 2270 4. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/burnout.gif)

[iamchappy]

Look at it this way because My 914 was probably pushing 350hp before the rebuild and now will be around 400hp. at 2300lbs that translates into something close to 6lbs per hp, there are not to many cars on the road with those numbers.
And I must say that 400hp in a street 914 will scare the shit out of me and will be very dangerous.

Unless you dont plan on increasing horsepower over stock, weight wont matter, the car already is ridiculously light.

Yes I am an adrenaline junkie.

[McMark]

QUOTE (Porsche Rescue @ Apr 9 2006, 07:57 PM)

I have to ask: Why, with a big six of near 300 HP and the intent of street use only, does 50, 100 or even 300 lbs. matter? A 3.8 in a factory curb weight 914 will go fast enough to scare the hell out of anybody.

Two words:

Inertia

Corner

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

[Mueller]

QUOTE (McMark @ Apr 10 2006, 10:36 AM)

QUOTE (Porsche Rescue @ Apr 9 2006, 07:57 PM) I have to ask: Why, with a big six of near 300 HP and the intent of street use only, does 50, 100 or even 300 lbs. matter?  A 3.8 in a factory curb weight 914 will go fast enough to scare the hell out of anybody. Two words: Inertia Corner (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

while that is true...no one should ever push the limits on the street so that the differance of 200 pounds is the deciding factor whether or not the car will reach it's maximum lateral grip and go spinning off the road......

[grantsfo]

QUOTE (Mueller @ Apr 10 2006, 09:42 AM)

QUOTE (McMark @ Apr 10 2006, 10:36 AM) QUOTE (Porsche Rescue @ Apr 9 2006, 07:57 PM) I have to ask: Why, with a big six of near 300 HP and the intent of street use only, does 50, 100 or even 300 lbs. matter?  A 3.8 in a factory curb weight 914 will go fast enough to scare the hell out of anybody. Two words: Inertia Corner (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif) while that is true...no one should ever push the limits on the street so that the differance of 200 pounds is the deciding factor whether or not the car will reach it's maximum lateral grip and go spinning off the road......

I agree 200 lbs on the street really wont make a big difference especially with a big displacement engine.

....In AX 200 lbs could be a half second.

[turboman808]

Why not do a WRX motor instead? Has to be much lighter???