"Look Mark" the car runs even when you turn the key off!, Electrical Gurus please chime in Options

[computers4kids]

OK, here's the deal. I made two changes:
Changes I made
First--My stereo used to be just hooked-up directly to +12V all the time, so I move the lead over in the fuse box (yellow wire) to a switched power fuse so the stereo was only energized when the car is on.

Second--I connected a small switch to constant 12 volts in the fuse panel to power the Alpine amp that I have. This way I can play my ipod through my amp and speakers without having the stereo turned on.

Everything works perfectly, except now when I went to turn the car off after going for a drive....it just kept running (had to pop the clutch and yurn the kill switch on the battery to stop it).
Troubleshooting
Alright, so I pulled the switched hot lead that goes to my stereo and tried to see if I could shut off my running motor--Nope!

So I tried unplugging the hot switched lead to my Alpine as well--still couldn't shut off the engine?????

The fuse box connections are all good--no grounding or touching terminals.
What do you think?
Could one of those relays in the fuse box have something to do with my problem??
I did at one time hear some clicking sound for a bit near the relays when I reconnected everything for the first time.

Any ideas?
Mark

[jd66921]

OK, here's the deal. I made two changes:
Changes I made
First--My stereo used to be just hooked-up directly to +12V all the time, so I move the lead over in the fuse box (yellow wire) to a switched power fuse so the stereo was only energized when the car is on.

Second--I connected a small switch to constant 12 volts in the fuse panel to power the Alpine amp that I have. This way I can play my ipod through my amp and speakers without having the stereo turned on.

Everything works perfectly, except now when I went to turn the car off after going for a drive....it just kept running (had to pop the clutch and yurn the kill switch on the battery to stop it).
Troubleshooting
Alright, so I pulled the switched hot lead that goes to my stereo and tried to see if I could shut off my running motor--Nope!

So I tried unplugging the hot switched lead to my Alpine as well--still couldn't shut off the engine?????

The fuse box connections are all good--no grounding or touching terminals.
What do you think?
Could one of those relays in the fuse box have something to do with my problem??
I did at one time hear some clicking sound for a bit near the relays when I reconnected everything for the first time.

Any ideas?
Mark

I never analyzed this, but my '72 did that (in '72!). I was told that the alternator
light bulb shorted out, and that is what fixed it. Easy to check!

jeff

[computers4kids]

[/quote]


I never analyzed this, but my '72 did that (in '72!). I was told that the alternator
light bulb shorted out, and that is what fixed it. Easy to check!

jeff
[/quote]
Hmmm, my alternator light appears to be working, at least it light up red until the engine starts then goes out.

Can the bulb work and still be shorting out?
Mark

[jd66921]

[quote name='computers4kids' date='Oct 28 2006, 05:18 PM' post='805036']
[/quote]


I never analyzed this, but my '72 did that (in '72!). I was told that the alternator
light bulb shorted out, and that is what fixed it. Easy to check!

jeff
[/quote]
Hmmm, my alternator light appears to be working, at least it light up red until the engine starts then goes out.

Can the bulb work and still be shorting out?
Mark
[/quote]
Not likely! I never did know if the dealer was snowing me, but the car worked
right when I got it back!

Nowadays, I would go through and see what works and what doesn't on the car
with the key off. Do all lights, horn, wipers, etc, still function? From that maybe I
can help you further.

Jeff

[computers4kids]

Found this picture on a thread a year old...about engine Run-on. The more I read it seems its an issue with MSD (which I don't have--Compufire), but also manifests itself as result of all kinds of electrical issues.

Quote: the keeps-running symptom has been known to be caused by - of all things - bad connections to the front turn signals. wonky grounds can affect it too.

Anyway, it sounds like an easy fix if it works. From the looks of it the diode allows juice to flow to the Alt bulb does not allow some sort of backfeed of 12 vots to enter the ignition cirucuit (Fuse 9) causing run on.

[jd66921]

Found this picture on a thread a year old...about engine Run-on. The more I read it seems its an issue with MSD (which I don't have--Compufire), but also manifests itself as result of all kinds of electrical issues.

Quote: the keeps-running symptom has been known to be caused by - of all things - bad connections to the front turn signals. wonky grounds can affect it too.

Anyway, it sounds like an easy fix if it works. From the looks of it the diode allows juice to flow to the Alt bulb does not allow some sort of backfeed of 12 vots to enter the ignition cirucuit (Fuse 9) causing run on.

It's worth a try. Still need info on what still works, and year of car if this
doesn't help! It would be better to fix it right.

Jeff

[iamchappy]

You could try splicing in a one way diode in the power wires to your amp and stereo, some how power is bleeding back into the system. Simular cure for the MSD problem above.

[computers4kids]

Thanks Jeff...
It's a 74 1.8 L-Jet.
I'll have to check tomorrow on what works and what doesn't, but at first glance, everything seems to be working.


I agree it does seem the run-on is somehow related to the stereo switched wire or alpine amp.

I guess I could put some diodes inline--I'd rather figure out what I've changed that has caused this feedback.

Perhaps, I'll try pulling the fuses out of the amp and stereo separtely and see if the problem persists.

Mark

[Jerry]

DAMN!!! I can't get mine to run at all.......and yours runs, even with the key off!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

[dlo914]

DAMN!!! I can't get mine to run at all.......and yours runs, even with the key off!!!! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif)

Quote: "I dont care what chall say'n, but that dem dere is funny!"

[computers4kids]

Today I checked out what works and what doesn't.

Absolutely everthing works:
headlights, fog lights, turn signals, emergency flashers, brake lights, tailights and front and side lenses, defroster, horn emergency brake, all lights on the dash including the generator light, both trunks and engine lights.

I disconected both the stereo and amp to take it out of the equaiton. The coil isn't grounding out any where.

It just won't turn off with the key (ignition is brand new from last year).

I guess I'm going to try the "diode" near the generator light. The light has two prongs: one with a thinner blue wire and another that is a twin red wire that loops to the other instrument lights.

Which wire do I put the diode on? And which direction?--flow towards the light or away from it ( I presume towards it).
A little help please,
Mark

[jd66921]

Today I checked out what works and what doesn't.

Absolutely everthing works:
headlights, fog lights, turn signals, emergency flashers, brake lights, tailights and front and side lenses, defroster, horn emergency brake, all lights on the dash including the generator light, both trunks and engine lights.

I disconected both the stereo and amp to take it out of the equaiton. The coil isn't grounding out any where.

It just won't turn off with the key (ignition is brand new from last year).

I guess I'm going to try the "diode" near the generator light. The light has two prongs: one with a thinner blue wire and another that is a twin red wire that loops to the other instrument lights.

Which wire do I put the diode on? And which direction?--flow towards the light or away from it ( I presume towards it).
A little help please,
Mark

If you want to add the diode, the (+) end of the diode goes toward the light bulb.
The other end of the diode is the ngative end, and is normally marked with a bar.
On my car, you would put it in the blue wire line.

Another approach to the problem is to remove circuits until you find the offending
circuit. It depends on year, but I have four smaller wires to my battery that can
be isolated.

Jeff

[computers4kids]

If you want to add the diode, the (+) end of the diode goes toward the light bulb.
The other end of the diode is the ngative end, and is normally marked with a bar.
On my car, you would put it in the blue wire line.

Another approach to the problem is to remove circuits until you find the offending
circuit. It depends on year, but I have four smaller wires to my battery that can
be isolated.

Jeff

Jeff thanks for being so helpful. It's truly been a frustrating day. I checked the blue wire and it's hot 12volts all the time once the battery is connected, the other red one going to the gen light shows no voltage. Generator and Oil light light up as soon as the battery is connected. The lights go off as soon as the car is started. I tried placing the diode in the blue line. The diode didn't seem to make any difference when I tried to shut the car off. I don't think the blue wire should be energized.

Once thing that I noticed today is the voltage gauge is showing higher than normal voltage--around 14.5 volts, at least I don't remember it every being that high.

With the + wires off the coil, I left the battery connected for a while which lit the gen and oil light up, I went around and unplugged all the relays under the dash--lights didn't go out.

With the key off and the car continuing to run, I found that if I pull fuse #9 the gen light comes back on but not as bright, but the car continues to run. Not to sure what that means.

Then I went back and unplugged the relays in the engine compartment and yellow wire--lights didn't go out. I even unplugged what I think was the regulator--lights didn't go out.

I have totally removed the stereo and amp to help isolate the problem.

Not to sure where to go from here...probably the refrig for a cold one. I know you mentioned the red wires off the pos battery post. I guess I could strart unplugging those one at a time to see if one of them turn off the gen light when the engine isn't running.

I'm baffled at this point.

Possible defective parts:
alternator?
regulator?
relays? Sounds like a defective relay, but I think I've tried unplugging all of them.
Mark